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Disturbing e-mails could spell more trouble for Penn State officials


Azazello1313
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I see no reason for a death penalty due to this criminal behavior. This had nothing to do with the athletes today or the athletes in the near future.

 

That said, Those that participated in obstruction should be exposed, prosecuted, and held accountable in criminal and civil courts.

 

In the event this information is true it went way beyond football.

 

 

Oh, I see the need. This cover-up was to protect that program. Let other schools see that if you cover-up crap like this, your school will hurt far worse than if you put things in the light.

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For me a football death penalty would be about making all those Penn Staters who rallied on campus and who supported Jo Pa throughout finally and unequivocally face what happened here. Their denial centered around the football program, and so to them the awakening and the healing must center around it as well.

 

The so lost perspective that they need this to come to grips with some perspective.

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I do not agree with those that believe the death penalty is in order. It's my opinion that would penalize the wrong people unfairly. Football at Penn State is about making money. Maybe give Penn State the choice between a death penalty scenario and making a huge donation to a victim's cause - huge in the many, many millions of dollars.

 

While I think Paterno is/was a freaking snake, I'm not on board with a death penalty punishment. Not that what I'm on board with matters obviously.

 

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Oh, I see the need. This cover-up was to protect that program. Let other schools see that if you cover-up crap like this, your school will hurt far worse than if you put things in the light.

 

 

yup, my sense as well. to address det's point, OF COURSE the football "game" related aspects of this pale in comparison to everything else. but they need to be addressed. putting "the program" before all else is what allowed this horrible evil to fester. if you care at all about trying to keep that sort of mentality from covering up more evil in the future, "the program" has to face consequences. it's not enough that you just might be able to pin some civil and/or criminal liability on a couple of key players. that just isn't an adequate disincentive to the "protect the program at all costs" mentality.

 

speaking of which, Penn State received more than $208 million in donations for the fiscal year that just ended, the second-highest total in university history. as if we needed confirmation that the "protect the program at all costs" mentality survives even still among boosters, there you have it. I do truly hope that the NCAA goes all "tickle monster" on the penn state football program, and I hope that the school gets sued for every penny of those "solidarity" donations, and then some.

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yup, my sense as well. to address det's point, OF COURSE the football "game" related aspects of this pale in comparison to everything else. but they need to be addressed. putting "the program" before all else is what allowed this horrible evil to fester. if you care at all about trying to keep that sort of mentality from covering up more evil in the future, "the program" has to face consequences. it's not enough that you just might be able to pin some civil and/or criminal liability on a couple of key players. that just isn't an adequate disincentive to the "protect the program at all costs" mentality.

 

speaking of which, Penn State received more than $208 million in donations for the fiscal year that just ended, the second-highest total in university history. as if we needed confirmation that the "protect the program at all costs" mentality survives even still among boosters, there you have it. I do truly hope that the NCAA goes all "tickle monster" on the penn state football program, and I hope that the school gets sued for every penny of those "solidarity" donations, and then some.

 

Like I said earlier, there are far too many sound arguments for why the NCAA should go after PSU for me to put up any fight at all. And, like I said before, it just sort of bothers me that taking away football should even matter, even though I'm quite aware that it would.

 

Lastly, I'd like to add that I could give two poops about the "collateral damage" of punishing the program. If we're not going to worry about the current players who pay the price for a program that gets caught cheating, I don't see why we need to start now.

Edited by detlef
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IMHO, Penn State is going to get crucified for this & rightfully so.

 

From what I'm reading, the NCAA doesn't have any precedence for a case like this nor anything in their bylaws to address it. So we're asking a big, lumbering, stodgy institution to think outside the box and deal with this in a fair, logical, evenhanded manner. And the offending party is basically a religion with hundreds of millions in donations and likewise a big, lumbering, stodgy institution. What do you think the final decision will look like when all the favors are called in and palms greased?

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freeh's report is out today and it looks like it savages paterno, spanier, curley, and schultz.

 

The report found that janitors who were made aware of Jerry Sandusky's apparent abuse of a child "were afraid of being fired over reporting a powerful football coach," Freeh told reporters at a news conference. "If that's the culture on the bottom, God help the culture on the top."
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freeh's report is out today and it looks like it savages paterno, spanier, curley, and schultz.

 

 

The e-mails at the end of the report show that Paterno lied to the grand jury about not knowing about the 1998 incident. Joe Paterno was NOT the man that I thought he was. :(

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The e-mails at the end of the report show that Paterno lied to the grand jury about not knowing about the 1998 incident. Joe Paterno was NOT the man that I thought he was. :(

 

 

Now let's see how Franco comes out and apologizes for all of his comments. Teh sad thing is that you were not close to this situation so I could understand your hope that all of the things said about Joe were not true. But Franco knew damn well Joe was heavily responsible for this situation and he still went around the state crying about Joe.

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The e-mails at the end of the report show that Paterno lied to the grand jury about not knowing about the 1998 incident. Joe Paterno was NOT the man that I thought he was. :(

 

 

not only that, but he was actively pushing Curley to get it resolved. "anything new in this department? coach is anxious to know where it stands."

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This just in; trustees still don't effing get it. No link, just quotes I caught on NPR this am.

 

While one of them did say "61 years of exceptional service is now tarnished" another cautioned that we shouldn't e too hasty in judging Paterno. After all, "who among us wants to be judged for our worse act"

 

Um, let the record state that if I ever habor a child molester and cover it up to protect my own ass, everyone can go ahead and judge me for that. You officially have my permission.

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:PennStateTrustee:Stalin, Hitler, and Pol Pot were all terrific guys in their lighter moments. I don't think we should judge them by their genocide.:PennStateTrustee:

 

 

The difference between these guys and Paterno is that Pol Pot, Stalin and Hitler were all aiming to build what they thought would be a better society. Paterno just wanted to win games.

 

ETA: I guess what I'm saying is that I hold the other guys in higher regard than I do Paterno. :shocking:

Edited by SEC=UGA
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This situation reminds me somewhat of an episode of What Would You Do. They put a picture of a missing girl in the window of a cafe. A lady walks in with her young kids and notices the sign. The "missing" girl is sitting at a table with a man who seems menacing, he's scolding her and she looks sad. The lady does a double take, clearly making the connection. She asks the clerk if she thinks the girl looks like the girl in the picture. The clerk kind of shrugs, acts disinterested, so the lady is left to make her own decision. She does what any moral, rational person would do in that situation, she pays for her food and leaves without doing anything. :huh:

 

When asked about her decision, she said she didn't want to make a scene or cause any trouble, and pointed out that the clerk didn't share her concern.

 

The lady didn't seem evil, just lacked the moral fortitude to stand up, alone, and do the right thing. Apparently some people lack any leadership in this type of situation. This lady wasn't the only one who failed to act either.

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This situation reminds me somewhat of an episode of What Would You Do. They put a picture of a missing girl in the window of a cafe. A lady walks in with her young kids and notices the sign. The "missing" girl is sitting at a table with a man who seems menacing, he's scolding her and she looks sad. The lady does a double take, clearly making the connection. She asks the clerk if she thinks the girl looks like the girl in the picture. The clerk kind of shrugs, acts disinterested, so the lady is left to make her own decision. She does what any moral, rational person would do in that situation, she pays for her food and leaves without doing anything. :huh:

 

When asked about her decision, she said she didn't want to make a scene or cause any trouble, and pointed out that the clerk didn't share her concern.

 

The lady didn't seem evil, just lacked the moral fortitude to stand up, alone, and do the right thing. Apparently some people lack any leadership in this type of situation. This lady wasn't the only one who failed to act either.

 

Interesting and sad commentary, but still not quite the same thing. For starters, this lady hasn't been championed as an iconic leader and "builder of men". She didn't have legions of people coming to her defense pointing out her decades of "winning the right way" (assuming that was actually the case). She was just some random person of no consequence who failed to be a hero when the chance arose. She was not assumed to already be a hero that conciously shirked the duties that come with the title.
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Interesting and sad commentary, but still not quite the same thing. For starters, this lady hasn't been championed as an iconic leader and "builder of men". She didn't have legions of people coming to her defense pointing out her decades of "winning the right way" (assuming that was actually the case). She was just some random person of no consequence who failed to be a hero when the chance arose. She was not assumed to already be a hero that conciously shirked the duties that come with the title.

 

Right. Just thought it was interesting how human nature fails to lead us in the right direction many times. I've always been fascinated by mob mentality, and those experiments from the 60's where volunteers were told to deliver electric shocks to people in the next room they couldn't see. And instances like this at PSU and others where people were corrupted by institutions -- either in the interest of protecting said institutions or just going along with what everyone else is doing. People don't seem to worry about their decisions being right or wrong if they have others going along with them. Joe supposedly being a "hero" and "leader of men" and all that...meh, such icons let us down all the time, because we deify them and then love to tear them to shreds when they turn out to be human like the rest of us. His failure to act was despicable, but I don't find it especially shocking just because he was *gasp* Joe Paterno.

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This situation reminds me somewhat of an episode of What Would You Do. They put a picture of a missing girl in the window of a cafe. A lady walks in with her young kids and notices the sign. The "missing" girl is sitting at a table with a man who seems menacing, he's scolding her and she looks sad. The lady does a double take, clearly making the connection. She asks the clerk if she thinks the girl looks like the girl in the picture. The clerk kind of shrugs, acts disinterested, so the lady is left to make her own decision. She does what any moral, rational person would do in that situation, she pays for her food and leaves without doing anything. :huh:

 

When asked about her decision, she said she didn't want to make a scene or cause any trouble, and pointed out that the clerk didn't share her concern.

 

The lady didn't seem evil, just lacked the moral fortitude to stand up, alone, and do the right thing. Apparently some people lack any leadership in this type of situation. This lady wasn't the only one who failed to act either.

 

 

Or you have a scenario like one of my salesmen ran into a few months ago.

 

He is pulling out of his subdivision and sees a man grab a 8/10 YO boy and drag him in the car. The boy is fighting. THe car starts to pull away and the passenger door opens, the boy is pulled back in. My salesman calls the police and begins to follow the car. He stays on the phone with the police, they are moving at about 70 to 80 mph. Still on the phone with the cops. The car turns into a subdivision, my salesman follows. They hit a cul de sac, my salesman pulls his truck longways to block the exit. Guy gets out of car, salesman tells him to stop, guy is coming over to the salesman's truck screaming, salesman reveals that he has a pistola. cops get there about 20 seconds later as the guy is getting back in his car to leave.

 

Turns out that the guy was the boys estranged father and the boy wouldn't have anything to do with him and the guy flipped out. All told this could have been a much worse scenario than it was, but there are still people who will go out of their way to ensure the safety of others.

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Or you have a scenario like one of my salesmen ran into a few months ago.

 

He is pulling out of his subdivision and sees a man grab a 8/10 YO boy and drag him in the car. The boy is fighting. THe car starts to pull away and the passenger door opens, the boy is pulled back in. My salesman calls the police and begins to follow the car. He stays on the phone with the police, they are moving at about 70 to 80 mph. Still on the phone with the cops. The car turns into a subdivision, my salesman follows. They hit a cul de sac, my salesman pulls his truck longways to block the exit. Guy gets out of car, salesman tells him to stop, guy is coming over to the salesman's truck screaming, salesman reveals that he has a pistola. cops get there about 20 seconds later as the guy is getting back in his car to leave.

 

Turns out that the guy was the boys estranged father and the boy wouldn't have anything to do with him and the guy flipped out. All told this could have been a much worse scenario than it was, but there are still people who will go out of their way to ensure the safety of others.

 

:tup: Very kewl...provided he was able to fit it all in on his lunch hour.

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