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Calling all Vick Desciples...


jgcoach
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A receiver never makes a quarterback though  a good QB can make a good receiver.

 

 

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How can you say that? Especially with Mcnabb and the Eagles playing. What was said right after TO went down? Was it Mcnabb will carry the team to the Super Bowl? I sure didn't hear that. Mcnabb had his best season he is probably ever going to have with TO but after he got hurt at Dallas he went back to averageville.

 

Against a Cowboy defense that gave up over 25 ppg on average, the Philly offense got 12and Mcnabb was INT'd twice.

 

A good WR gives you confidence, someone you can go to when you do need 8-12 yards. Is anyone really going to say Price gives Vick that.

 

This Price's mentality.

 

http://www.football-gaming.com/teams/modul...odload&topic=17

 

 

WR Peerless Price wasn't too thrilled after his first game with the Falcons. He was happy to win, but not pleased with what he perceived to be extra attention.

"It was frustrating being double-teamed all day long," he said, although he wasn't. "Sometimes, they doubled me straight up, sometimes they disguised it. I'm confident the coaching staff will be able to move me around so I don't get double-teamed so much."

Monday, Price suggested that he work more out of the slot. "It's harder to double-team a guy there," he said.

 

Yeah that's a #1 WR talking.

 

 

You couldn't be more wrong.  McNabb throws the ball but his WRs didn't catch them.  So when he finally got a top notch WR that could actually catch the ball it elevated his whole game.

 

Vick doesn't look to throw the ball.

 

Vick will never get to the big show.

 

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Wasn't Owens known for his dropsies? What was that pass to Westbrook that was 5 feet over his head and that was only like a 6 yard pass. Mcnabb is not the most accurate. This is his first season over 60% and his passer rating had never been over 86% before TO got to the team. It's obvious Owens made a big difference in Mcnabb's game..........

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That's bullmanure.  Dunn and Duckett did very well in that back field and Vick will NEVER have a Pro Bowl WR because he doesn't look to throw the ball.  If Moss and Owens were Falcons neither would be going to the Pro Bowl because Vick wouldn't throw them the ball.

 

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On the other hand, McNabb has lesser (healthy) TEs and WRs than Vick (not to mention a far inferior running game), yet was able to pass for more than 140 yds and complete more than 46% of his passes. Oh, and he also beat Vick at his own game (rushing). And McNabb didn't throw an incredibly stupid INT deep in his own territory.

 

I'll give Vick the benefit of the doubt, as he's still learning a new offense. He very well may develop into a respectable passing QB in a year or two. But, as of right now, he's Kordell Jr.

Edited by Bill Swerski
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Hardly...the running game is in no way Atlanta's problem.  While not as good a back as either of those guys you've mentioned,

 

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Dunn and Duckett due to their physical characteristics are limited. James or Alexander would put much more of a threat in a defense. Nobody is going to worry about a 5'9 guy who weighs 160lbs. Vick is still the primary cover for any defense. But you put Alexander or Edge back there you can't just ignore that threat. That would open more lanes for Vick to throw. Did you see how Burgess was ignoring the the play action fake and stayed with Vick everytime...........

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ATL had better rushers with Dunn AND Duckett. Comparing Price, Finneran, White and first rounder Jenkins to Mitchell, Pinkston, Lewis and McMullen is a wash at best.

 

I said it before and I say it again. Vick is merely Kyle Boller with the ability to run. When his team trails, his inability to pass effectively dooms the team. His stats were actually even worse but they took one interception off on a questionable flag. No team can succeed with only a rushing game and no passing game, not in the playoffs where good defenses always go.

 

And I would question the sentiment that he needs a Pro bowl RB and WR. He already had one of the most productive rushing tandems in the NFL and one of the best offensive lines now. A receiver never makes a quarterback though  a good QB can make a good receiver.

 

Vick's not so fun to watch against a good defense that limits his open field running. There's not much else to watch.

 

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McNabb was average at best throwing early on at first as well. I think Vick will develop just as nicely, when Jenkins is used more in the offense. Atl has a nice offense, but Vick needs to add the passing dimension to this team, and Mora Jr needs to stick to a more balanced offense or there will be setbacks often, just as their was in Philly until this yr. Remember he missed most of last season, and has played what 18 games before this season, and under a new offensive system. I think its a little early to write this kid off as a bust just yet.

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Vick has "happy feet" ... he doesn't check down his recieving options.  If his first option isn't there he runs.  That is his style and it works great in college.  Hell it worked great in the week ass NFC West conference too.

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Just an FYI Blitz....but Vick plays in the weak ass NFC South.

Edited by Big Score 1
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I'll give Vick the benefit of the doubt, as he's still learning a new offense.  He very well may develop into a respectable passing QB in a year or two.  But, as of right now, he's Kordell Jr.

 

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That's all he needs is the benefit of the doubt. Give him some time in this offense. It's his first season. With his ability, which is just off the charts saying he can't or won't be an effective passer is just ..........being negative...........

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That's all he needs is the benefit of the doubt.  Give him some time in this offense.  It's his first season.  With his ability, which is just off the charts saying he can't or won't be an effective passer is just ..........being negative...........

 

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He's also been in the league for three years. He should know how to read a defense by now. I'll cut him some slack, but not a whole lot.

 

But I stand by my earlier comment that, as of right now, he's where Kordell was in his prime. He can effectively manage a run-first offense, but that's about it.

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How can you say that?  Especially with Mcnabb and the Eagles playing.  What was said right after TO went down?  Was it Mcnabb will carry the team to the Super Bowl?  I sure didn't hear that.  Mcnabb had his best season he is probably ever going to have with TO but after he got hurt at Dallas he went back to averageville.

 

Against a Cowboy defense that gave up over 25 ppg on average, the Philly offense got 12and  Mcnabb was INT'd twice. 

 

A good WR gives you confidence, someone you can go to when you do need 8-12 yards.  Is anyone really going to say Price gives Vick that.

 

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I thought in a different thread you were making an argument for Vick saying it's not the #'s but the wins or the chance of winning he gives his team. McNabbs #s may have come down but they are certainly winning in Philly, due in large part to McNabb. McNabb also throws the ball a lot more than tucking and running because he's got some poise in the pocket and scrambles to find the open rec. instead of just tucking the ball and running upfield.

Edited by jgcoach
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McNabb was average at best throwing early on at first as well.  I think Vick will develop just as nicely, when Jenkins is used more in the offense.  Atl has a nice offense, but Vick needs to add the passing dimension to this team, and Mora Jr needs to stick to a more balanced offense or there will be setbacks often, just as their was in Philly until this yr.  Remember he missed most of last season, and has played what 18 games before this season, and under a new offensive system.  I think its a little early to write this kid off as a bust just yet.

 

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I don't think anyone is writting him off, just saying he doesn't deserve the (as of yet) tag of a great anything as many proclaim.

Edited by jgcoach
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That's all he needs is the benefit of the doubt.  Give him some time in this offense.  It's his first season.  With his ability, which is just off the charts saying he can't or won't be an effective passer is just ..........being negative...........

 

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It's NOT his first season ... he has plenty of ability ... just none that involves throwing the ball ...

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He's also been in the league for three years.  He should know how to read a defense by now.

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Actually he's been in the league four years now.

 

However, he's only had two complete seasons on the field.

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I thought in a different thread you were making an argument for Vick saying it's not the #'s but the wins or the chance of winning he gives his team. McNabbs #s may have come down but they are certainly winning in Philly, due in large part to McNabb. McNabb also throws the ball a lot more than tucking and running because he's got some poise in the pocket and scrambles to find the open rec. instead of just tucking the ball and running upfield.

 

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Mcnabb does. He is IMO a Chunky soup player. He gets the job done. Mcnabb does what he has to do to win. Doesn't always look good doing it but he is effective. He also didn't develop poise in the pocket until he got TO. Mcnabb was most effective running the ball to set up the pass.

 

 

By the way did anyone notice how much time Mcnabb had to pass back there? He had all freaking day to read the defense. I can't think of one time where Vick could just sit back and set his feet..........

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Actually he's been in the league four years now.

 

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My bad. Then again, that more strongly supports my argument anyway.

 

IMO, next year is Vick's make-or-break season. He'll have had four years to learn how to read defenses and will have had over a year's worth of experience in Mora's system. By then, we should know whether he's the next Randall Cunningham or the next Kordell.

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Did you see how Burgess was ignoring the the play action fake and stayed with Vick everytime...........

 

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But that's the primary point here and the key to stopping Vick and the Falcons right now...if you can stay on Vick and cover him, he won't often beat you with his arm. I don't see how getting a marginally better running game changes that, when it's already a strength to begin with.

 

McNabb was average at best throwing early on at first as well.

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I'd say McNabb was better than "average at best." In the first half, by my count he was 6 of 10 for 104 yards and a TD through the air, and added 2 rushes for 14 yards on the ground. He maybe didn't put up huge numbers but they were certainly respectable...more importantly he was very efficient and didn't turn the ball over and he put his team up 14-10 at the half. :D

 

I think Vick will develop just as nicely, when Jenkins is used more in the offense.  Atl has a nice offense, but Vick needs to add the passing dimension to this team, and Mora Jr needs to stick to a more balanced offense or there will be setbacks often, just as their was in Philly until this yr.  Remember he missed most of last season, and has played what 18 games before this season, and under a new offensive system.  I think its a little early to write this kid off as a bust just yet.
Painful as it may be to ever agree with Sgt. Ryan, the above makes sense to me. :D
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I still say Vick reminds me alot of Randall Cunningham, he's just not quite as good as Randall. That is not anything to be ashamed of. Obviously, Cunningham is in some pretty rare company having won 3 MVP awards (I believe Jim Brown, Y.A. Tittle, Johnny Unitas, and Brett Favre are the others with 3) and you could argue he belongs in the Hall. But he was never paid $18 million/year or whatever it is that Vick makes. Ironically, Cunningham became a much better QB after he got hurt and couldn't run as well anymore and was forced to become more aof a pocket passer.

 

I think Vick will improve. He better, because he looked like a high school QB today.

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I don't think anyone is writting him off.

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Looks like Blitz is:

So you are proposing that they get rid of Vick then?  Because as long as he is the guy they have to work with, Atlanta will be watching the SB from their living rooms.

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Vick will never get to the big show.

 

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It's NOT his first season ... he has plenty of ability ... just none that involves throwing the ball  ...

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18 million dollar RUNNING BACK that lines up under center ...

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I could be wrong here, but somehow I get the impression that Blitz doesn't think too much of Vick as a QB. :D

Edited by Big Score 1
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I'd say McNabb was better than "average at best."  In the first half, by my count he was 6 of 10 for 104 yards and a TD through the air, and added 2 rushes for 14 yards on the ground. He maybe didn't put up huge numbers but they were certainly respectable...more importantly he was very efficient and didn't turn the ball over and he put his team up 14-10 at the half.  :D

 

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My bad Sgt. Ryan, I just realized you meant early on in his career. :D

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