Habitable Stars, Planets, Life & Intelligent Life

[cliaz]

looks like an extended rumination on the drake equation.

 

 

Not Drake - I call it the midget equation

 

 

Take the total star count in the Milky way = M

Then you need to Identify how many solar type stars there are = I

Then how many fall with in the Designated galactic zone = D

How many have solar system that Get inner rocky planet and big brother planet in deep orbit = G

Then Estimate the potential for life to evolve on the planets = E

And that is your Total = T

[bpwallace49]

Very cool info, thanks!

 

I've always been of the opinion that the universe is teeming with intelligent life, simply because of the sheer number of stars. It is fascinating to consider humans in the context of the millions of other species on earth that never attained high intelligence. Maybe we're more rare and unique than I thought. Still, I'm frustrated to have been born so early in our evolution, still struggling with petty issues that our greed, ignorance and short-sighted thinking prevent us from solving. There is so much I'd like to understand about the universe that will never be known in my lifetime. I would love to live in a society where I wasn't enslaved by a currency system -- think of it, we spend what, a third of our short lives working, much of that just for the necessities of food and shelter, and many of us in jobs we hate (I happen to love my job but many don't). I could go on and on about the absurdities of human existence -- I get that's all about helping others, making connections, love, etc., but I would contend we've unlocked a tiny fraction of what our total consciousness could be, and I doubt we'll get there before we destroy the planet and/or each other. Hell, look at all the disease, war, and poverty in this world. Look at our electoral system, run by money and petty politics, just when something gets accomplished, it's time to campaign again. One party gets it right for a while, then they inevitably get too powerful and corrupt so we vote them out and undo whatever progress was made. And we have people we consider intelligent on both sides, arguing ad nauseum, unable to put aside their own interests enough to effect real lasting change. We're pathetic, honestly. The anthill was a good analogy -- one of those level 2 or 3 civilizations might consider it a favor to all the ignorant and suffering among us to simply stomp us out.

 

 

Jesus . . . you are one helluva debbie downer. Thanks for the depression Matt . . . .

[matt770]

Jesus . . . you are one helluva debbie downer. Thanks for the depression Matt . . . .

 

Yeah, my wife says exactly the same thing when I talk about humanity and/or politics, we even do the sad trombone sound effect and have a laugh about it. Obviously I don't share these views in many social situations unless it's one of those drunk late night campfire vibes where everyone is getting deep.

 

I see a lot of good in people too, don't get me wrong. I think most people mean well and there are heroes and extraordinary people among us for sure. I just think that by and large, the good folks fighting the good fight are shoveling sh*t against the tide because the whole system is flawed. If mankind had the capacity to think and act collectively, my god, could you imagine what we could accomplish? The issues we face today would be laughable in 5-10 years, even things like the national debt, poverty, hunger. You can trace so many of our failures to human greed and short-sightedness.

 

I don't see how you can ponder things like the level 2 and 3 civilizations without reflecting on humanity and where we are on that scale. If they do exist, then we are the neanderthals of the universe.

 

Another thing that strikes me -- we look down on the ants, the dolphins, the apes, etc as lesser beings, and yes, they obviously don't possess our intelligence, ability to adapt, use tools, alter the environment, etc....but they have no debts either, they all have jobs to do and get them done, they feed themselves and care for their young, and the old, sick and weak are weeded out by predators, thus strengthening the species. As we've gotten more "advanced", we've circumvented these natural mechanisms to our detriment. We reward laziness, we spend money we don't have, and we allow the lazy and weak to reproduce unchecked. We extend life, often without regard to the quality of that life, or the huge expense involved. Am I advocating we be cold and heartless like the animals? No. I'm pointing out that our emotions and our high-mindedness in many instances actually sabotage the greater interests of our species. As we continue to "evolve", we also take steps backward. Some of the trends we are seeing in our civilization today will lead to mass poverty and death if left unchecked.

 

Come to think of it, if we evolved from primordial slime billions of years ago, and all life comes up in the same manner, no wonder intelligent life is so scarce. Look at how far we've come and how badly we're still botching the job.

[cliaz]

Yeah, my wife says exactly the same thing when I talk about humanity and/or politics, we even do the sad trombone sound effect and have a laugh about it. Obviously I don't share these views in many social situations unless it's one of those drunk late night campfire vibes where everyone is getting deep.

 

I see a lot of good in people too, don't get me wrong. I think most people mean well and there are heroes and extraordinary people among us for sure. I just think that by and large, the good folks fighting the good fight are shoveling sh*t against the tide because the whole system is flawed. If mankind had the capacity to think and act collectively, my god, could you imagine what we could accomplish? The issues we face today would be laughable in 5-10 years, even things like the national debt, poverty, hunger. You can trace so many of our failures to human greed and short-sightedness.

 

I don't see how you can ponder things like the level 2 and 3 civilizations without reflecting on humanity and where we are on that scale. If they do exist, then we are the neanderthals of the universe.

 

Another thing that strikes me -- we look down on the ants, the dolphins, the apes, etc as lesser beings, and yes, they obviously don't possess our intelligence, ability to adapt, use tools, alter the environment, etc....but they have no debts either, they all have jobs to do and get them done, they feed themselves and care for their young, and the old, sick and weak are weeded out by predators, thus strengthening the species. As we've gotten more "advanced", we've circumvented these natural mechanisms to our detriment. We reward laziness, we spend money we don't have, and we allow the lazy and weak to reproduce unchecked. We extend life, often without regard to the quality of that life, or the huge expense involved. Am I advocating we be cold and heartless like the animals? No. I'm pointing out that our emotions and our high-mindedness in many instances actually sabotage the greater interests of our species. As we continue to "evolve", we also take steps backward. Some of the trends we are seeing in our civilization today will lead to mass poverty and death if left unchecked.

 

Come to think of it, if we evolved from primordial slime billions of years ago, and all life comes up in the same manner, no wonder intelligent life is so scarce. Look at how far we've come and how badly we're still botching the job.

 

 

While I tend to be a pessimist about a lot of things overall I am a very optimistic in my views towards humanity. Look at where we are with medical technology. If Chargerz wanted to, he could operate on a woman in New York City while standing in a hospital in California, we can grow new tissues now, create stem cells from our own skin cells, we are on the cusp of curing a lot of forms of cancer, we can give site to the blind and hearing to the deaf, we can even purposely kill someone in order to perform high risk surgeries and then revive them. I mean, sh!t within the next 2 to 3 years there will be a drug I can give my children that will help to significantly reduce the affects of a genetic disorder that is systemic wide. To even do deeper (that's what she said), my sister-in-law should be dead right now but thanks to cutting edge medical technologies and procedures, she is alive and well today. If there is one area where humanity is beginning to exceed expectations and its own limits it is the medical field (IMO).

 

I firmly believe that if we focus on establishing a dynamic and robust space program that both government and private sector can benefit from we would begin to see our natural resource issues go away. Not enough potable water? No problem, Comet R-11754 is entering the inner solar system so we'll go harvest a few million gallons of fresh water from there. We're running low on certain metals? No problem, NASA is already mining 7 large asteroids. Human population on earth just exceed 9 billion people? No problem, we have a wonder community on the Moon with earth colonies on Mars and orbiting earth with artificial gravity to protect those bones.

 

And along with this I believe humanity's finest moment will be the day we are able to sustain a fusion reaction on earth and put an end to carbon base and nuclear fuel needs for our power plants. Where needed, we will subsidize energy needs with giant solar panels placed in a gravity neutral spot between the earth and the sun, wind farms and more geothermal use. In fact, as unpopular as it is, I would support converting Yellowstone park into a natural geothermal power plant much like they have in Iceland.

 

A lot of our problems here on earth could be solved or reduced greatly by expanding our foot print in space.

[cliaz]

and duct taping a naked iRash then charging $10 a ticket to pull a piece of tape off of his hairy back and butt

[jetsfan]

and duct taping a naked iRash then charging $10 a ticket to pull a piece of tape off of his hairy back and butt

 

in! :heart:

drunk as as a skunk! booya!

[cliaz]

While I tend to be a pessimist about a lot of things overall I am a very optimistic in my views towards humanity. Look at where we are with medical technology. If Chargerz wanted to, he could operate on a woman in New York City while standing in a hospital in California, we can grow new tissues now, create stem cells from our own skin cells, we are on the cusp of curing a lot of forms of cancer, we can give site to the blind and hearing to the deaf, we can even purposely kill someone in order to perform high risk surgeries and then revive them. I mean, sh!t within the next 2 to 3 years there will be a drug I can give my children that will help to significantly reduce the affects of a genetic disorder that is systemic wide. To even do deeper (that's what she said), my sister-in-law should be dead right now but thanks to cutting edge medical technologies and procedures, she is alive and well today. If there is one area where humanity is beginning to exceed expectations and its own limits it is the medical field (IMO).

 

 

Case in point

[cliaz]

neat!

 

any progres on growing large amounts of skin or regenerating skin for severe burn patients?

 

 

[Lo Pan] Indeed! [/Lo Pan]

[cliaz]

Criteria for Life changed a bit today