redwings.cup Posted June 20, 2002 Share Posted June 20, 2002 I think he will come back for one more season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Azazello13 Posted June 23, 2002 Share Posted June 23, 2002 reports out of buffalo are that he's decided to retire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egret Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 I think he's gone. He got what he came for... OUT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh 0ne Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 Once again another great prediction from Redwings.cup. wink  http://msn.espn.go.com/nhl/news/2002/0623/1398161.html  Now what? Manny Legace? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egret Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 Cujo, Richter, Dafoe. :confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Azazello13 Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 so now that their first high-priced rent-a-goalie did his one-and-done routine, they'll just go out and get the best goalie money can buy THIS year. AND there's talk about them going after one of the big-ticket forwards on the market. Â gee, they've got the highest payroll in the league already and they're talking about taking on another $20 million via free agency. hmm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwings.cup Posted June 24, 2002 Author Share Posted June 24, 2002 Azazello13:so now that their first high-priced rent-a-goalie did his one-and-done routine, they'll just go out and get the best goalie money can buy THIS year. AND there's talk about them going after one of the big-ticket forwards on the market.  gee, they've got the highest payroll in the league already and they're talking about taking on another $20 million via free agency. hmm... hasek will free up $8.5mm + $1mm bonus and i hear we're thinking of letting Luc walk? Trying to sign Chelios at close to last year's $5.5MM or letting him walk too. I think the rich can afford to get richer and continue rewarding fans with the best franchise in the NHL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerxst Posted June 24, 2002 Share Posted June 24, 2002 The Red Wings and Yankees are perfect examples of what is right and wrong with their respective sports. Both are run great and have great people at the top, but you have to wonder how well either would do if hockey and baseball had salary caps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
policyvote Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 I've said it before, I'll say it again. Let's look at a typical Wings' active roster for the playoffs. High-priced mercs are highlighted in BOLD.  First Line: Fedorov, Yzerman, Shanahan Second Line: Larionov, Robitaille, Holmstrom Grind Line: Draper, Maltby, McCarty Two Kids and a Goat: Pavel Datsyuk, Brett Hull, Boyd Devereaux  Defensive Pair 1: Frederick Olausson, Nick Lidstrom Defensive Pair 2: Jiri Fischer, Chris Chelios (Chelli is debatable, as he was widely percieved to be completely washed up, and he was an emergency replacement for Konstantinov anyway) Defensive Pair 3: Mathieu Dandenault, Steve Duchesne  Goalie: Dominik Hasek  Okay, so that's three, perhaps four mercs. The rest is almost all homegrown talent, or from trades/acquisitions that happened years ago (Shanny, for example). The Red Wings fill needs, but the Yankees use free agency as a weapon. How about Giambi this year? They take away their chief threat's greatest player, replacing the perfectly-fine Tino Martinez. And thus continues the carousel--the Yankees are on a two-year cycle at every position except shortstop. Every year, they manage to steal the best player from a lesser team, use 'em for two years, then discard 'em for the latest sensation. Mark my words, Giambi will not be playing for the Yankees two seasons from now. I guarantee it. However, the Wings' best players have been staples for years.  Admittedly, Chelli had a fantastic year this year, but no one expected that of him. Hasek didn't play any better this year than Osgood has in the past (on average), though he was much better in the clutch. Robitaille was barely a factor, clocking 30 goals in the regular season, but only a couple in the playoffs.  Bottom line: all the players that everyone agreed were the best and most valuable out there--Yzerman, Fedorov, Lidstrom, the Grind Line--are all career Wings. The Wings are not the Yankees, who can only boast Jeter (and maybe someday Henson) as their "homegrown talent".  Peace policy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Azazello13 Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 policyvote:The Wings are not the Yankees, who can only boast Jeter (and maybe someday Henson) as their "homegrown talent".  bernie williams? rivera? posada? soriano? pettite? and jeter, as you mentioned. that's a pretty solid nucleus (none of them were mercs from other teams) without which the yanks wouldn't be much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
policyvote Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Azazello13: policyvote:The Wings are not the Yankees, who can only boast Jeter (and maybe someday Henson) as their "homegrown talent".  bernie williams? rivera? posada? soriano? pettite? and jeter, as you mentioned. that's a pretty solid nucleus (none of them were mercs from other teams) without which the yanks wouldn't be much.Okay, they'd still have two bona fide #1 ace starters in an age where most teams don't have any--both of whom were pirated away from a division rival, I might add. Plus, Rivera (who I will give all the credit in the world to) supplanted John Wetteland, who is the perfect example of what I'm talking about. He was a big-name star in the prime of his career, went to the Yankees amidst much fanfare, then two years later the Yanks dumped him and he never did much of anything again. Same thing has happened to a million rent-a-studs in NY over the last decade. Another critical point to make here is that the Yankees can spend whatever the hell they want because they MAKE SO MUCH MORE than the other teams, from their huge TV benefits and merch liscensing. OTOH, the Wings would have lost money this year if they hadn't made a successful Cup run (that's why those playoff tix are so darned expensive). The difference? The Yankees start off on a way higher plane than any other team and use that extra capital to its fullest, but Illitch just plain commits more of his cash than other hockey owners are willing to, for whatever reason.  This is kind of amusing, because Illitch is a tight-fisted SOB in baseball, only giving money to mediocre players who are injury risks (Bobby Higginson will make $12 million next year for sitting on the bench, hurt again), and somehow giving each successive manager less and less to work with. God only knows how long before Dombrowski and Alou mount an armed coup (backed by Pete Karmanos' money, I'm sure) . . .  Anyway, back to my point: sure, I'll grant you that out of the eight position starters, five rotation starters, and one closer, the Yanks have six homegrown talents. That works out to a 43% 'homegrown' ratio. Meanwhile, out of the Wings' top four lines, three defensive pairs, and starting goalie, only SEVEN haven't spent their whole career with the Wings (IIRC). So, that's a 63% 'homegrown' ratio.  Yeah, the Wings will be active again this offseason. Hasek is gone (freeing up tons of salary), Robitaille will probably be traded, and some role players like Olausson and Slegr will probably leave, too.  They'll have to fill those holes, and they will as best they can. Either they get CuJo, or they pick up a guy like Belfour to play the typical Wings "Playoff Goalie" role while giving Legace resular season PT. If the rumors are true, they'll add a forward like Holik or Guerin to replace Robitaille. However, they'll have homegrown talent goming up, too. Swedish phenom Henrik Zetterburg will play his rookie year next year (probably seeing a role much like Datsyuk played this year), and Maxim Kuznetsov should see plenty of PT with Olausson and Slegr leaving.  Peace policy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Azazello13 Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 policyvote:Anyway, back to my point: sure, I'll grant you that out of the eight position starters, five rotation starters, and one closer, the Yanks have six homegrown talents. That works out to a 43% 'homegrown' ratio. Meanwhile, out of the Wings' top four lines, three defensive pairs, and starting goalie, only SEVEN haven't spent their whole career with the Wings (IIRC). So, that's a 63% 'homegrown' ratio.  well if you're talking about the yankees, you've got to throw nick johnson and el duque in the mix as well. plus with those percentages you're comparing apples to oranges...free agency is much less restricted in MLB, and there actually aren't many teams in MLB that have even as much of a "home-grown" presence as the yanks. the thing that separates the yanks from the rest of baseball is the fact that when they have a hole to fill, they buy the best in the league. they need a starter, they buy mussina...they need a first baseman, they buy giambi.  which is of course exactly the kind of market behavior the wings have been exhibiting since last year, especially if the cujo/guerin rumors pan out this year. how could you seriously say it's any different? you talk about the yankees discarding tino after, what, 4 or 5 years? well what was the shelf life of lucky luc as a wing (if it's true the wings are trying to scrap him)? or hasek? chris osgood was a pretty good goalie for them and they didn't hesitate to dump him on the scrapheap him to clear the way for their one-year love-in/spaz-fest with hasek. how is any of this any different from the stuff the yankees have done that you're crying foul on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwings.cup Posted June 25, 2002 Author Share Posted June 25, 2002 yep, he will. the best goalie of his era will retire and go back to CZK. thanks, dominator. you were a blast to watch and helped the Winged Wheel return to prominance! thumbs_u thumbs_u thumbs_u frown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerxst Posted June 26, 2002 Share Posted June 26, 2002 Hasek the best goalie of his era? I think not. That distinction goes to Patrick Roy, who has 4 Stanley Cups and 3 Conn Smythe's, which mean a lot more than Hasek's regular season awards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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