Making sure you don't get hosed by the Insurance Co.

[detlef]

OK, so Monday the insurance Co. is going to offer us an amount for my wife's totalled TDI.

 

When this thing first went down, we immediately looked at KBB to see that it was allegedly worth about $16K (2004 with about 60K in excellent condition). They told us they use a different book and that kicked out $14,500. Here's the deal, we don't think we could replace her car for $14,500. The VW lot only had one used TDI on the lot, a 2006 with about 40K miles and it was $21 and change. These cars obviously really hold their value well. We also went to autofinder.com to search on used 2004 TDIs with less than 75K and only found one within 200 miles (it was 93 miles away), listed by a private seller for $16K.

 

Further, of all the dealers we went to, VW seemed like the ones least inclined to bend over backwards. No crazy deals, no 0% financing. We've spent a bunch of time on-line and found exactly 2 TDIs with the, transmission, trim package, and color we want within 100 miles of here. Actually, both have a few extras we didn't want ($650 worth of wheel and mat upgrades) but both guys are prepared to charge us MSRP of what we did want. One seems prepared to budge a bit, but likely not much since one has already said not to bother coming out to the lot if we're not prepared to pay the price he offered. In short, we're not likely going to be able to bend this guy that far.

 

In short, it does not appear that we would be able to replace her car, in this market, for $14,500. Further, we're not going to be able to pay much less than asking price for a new one. Since I'm assuming that should be a very relevant fact, what is the best way to fight for this number from the insurance co.?

[HowboutthemCowboys]

All I can tell you is, when I totalled one last year they gave us the "ARV" ( actual retail value).

Said they call the 12 closest dealers and average the prices they get from them. Screw job is what it is.

[Vet]

There are different kinds of policies. Most people have an "cash value" insurance policy, where essentially the insurance company will pay you book value for your car. Then, there's a "full replacement value" policy, where the insurance company will pay you what it actually costs to replace your car. Most people have a cash value policy, because the premuims are cheaper. It's actually the better deal for most people.

 

You have to look at your policy and see exactly what you have for coverage.

[detlef]

There are different kinds of policies. Most people have an "cash value" insurance policy, where essentially the insurance company will pay you book value for your car. Then, there's a "full replacement value" policy, where the insurance company will pay you what it actually costs to replace your car. Most people have a cash value policy, because the premuims are cheaper. It's actually the better deal for most people.

 

You have to look at your policy and see exactly what you have for coverage.

It's not our policy, it's the policy of the dude who smashed into my wife's car from behind.

[rocknrobn26]

It's not our policy, it's the policy of the dude who smashed into my wife's car from behind.

 

Have you called your insurance company, get them to pay, assuming you had collision, and if it's more let them go thru Subrogation. I did that about 10 years ago. The city vehicle who totaled me was self insured. It was a 9.5 year old Cougar w/ 58,000 miles, in pristine condition. They offered $4k. My insurance, w/ a little help from my agent, paid off $5800 exactly what NADA listed it for (low mileage really boosted the price), and I let them mess w/ the city. Took a few months to get my deductible back, but I didn't have to mess w/ those f'ers.

[dmarc117]

what rr said. with our accident i filed the car and car seat claims with my insurance. they paid right away, and are now going after the other drivers insurance(they were at fault). i actually think that my insurance company made money on the deal. you figure they declare the car totaled. they give me my check. i give them the title to the car. and then they go after the other inusrance company for the amount that they wrote me. they can now sell the vehicle for parts to a salvage company. so i figure they make about 5k on the deal, atleast. which is why i will always go thru my insurance from now on. it is in their best interest to cut you a nice deal(if the car is totaled and has some remaining value).

[rocknrobn26]

what rr said. with our accident i filed the car and car seat claims with my insurance. they paid right away, and are now going after the other drivers insurance(they were at fault). i actually think that my insurance company made money on the deal. you figure they declare the car totaled. they give me my check. i give them the title to the car. and then they go after the other inusrance company for the amount that they wrote me. they can now sell the vehicle for parts to a salvage company. so i figure they make about 5k on the deal, atleast. which is why i will always go thru my insurance from now on. it is in their best interest to cut you a nice deal(if the car is totaled and has some remaining value).

 

True on the Ins. Co. making $$$ on the parts of the totaled car, but as you prolly know, you have to be licensed to deal in totaled cars in IL. years ago you could buy it back, but no longer, and for quite a while. Collusion??? I digress...

I figger I pay premiums to my Insurance Co.. Let them do the work. I don't want to F' w/ these adjusters.

Det, do your home work. Check the value on BB and NADA. Go w/ the highest and fight w/ your Ins. Co.. Be honest w/ the condition (at least to yourself, take pics of undamaged areas to prove the rating) and see who gives the better offer. You have leverage w/ YOUR Ins. Co., cause you can always leave for another, they know that, and if you're a good driver, you got them by the Cojones!

[SteelBunz]

This is also partly why you pay them to BE your insurance company. They are working for YOU in these situations. You shouldn't be dealing with the other guy's insurance company AT ALL. They've lowballed you.....they know it. But if you come at them without any representation, either from your own ins. company or a lawyer.....they figure you'll take the first offer.

 

**And if you've called your insurance company on this and YOUR agent has let you deal with the other company yourself......you should seriously consider looking for another insurance company when this is all done.

[rocknrobn26]

This is also partly why you pay them to BE your insurance company. They are working for YOU in these situations. You shouldn't be dealing with the other guy's insurance company AT ALL. They've lowballed you.....they know it. But if you come at them without any representation, either from your own ins. company or a lawyer.....they figure you'll take the first offer.

**And if you've called your insurance company on this and YOUR agent has let you deal with the other company yourself......you should seriously consider looking for another insurance company when this is all done.

 

Some new points here and they are right on target!

[detlef]

Wow, great info here. Thanks all. Thus far we've been very underwhelmed with our State Farm agent. For instance, the accident happened near enough to work for someone from my wife's company to just come and pick her up. However, our agent wasn't remotely helpful in seeing to it that my wife had a car lined up by the end of the work day. Basically, she had to line the car up herself. Since then, it's been us and the other motorists insurance company the entire time.

 

Between that and what you all are saying spells a rather unfortunate Monday for our agent.

[polksalet]

Wow, great info here. Thanks all. Thus far we've been very underwhelmed with our State Farm agent. For instance, the accident happened near enough to work for someone from my wife's company to just come and pick her up. However, our agent wasn't remotely helpful in seeing to it that my wife had a car lined up by the end of the work day. Basically, she had to line the car up herself. Since then, it's been us and the other motorists insurance company the entire time.

 

Between that and what you all are saying spells a rather unfortunate Monday for our agent.

 

State farm sucks, that is why I fired the clowns. They did not inform me I had the right to 3rd party arbitration.

 

Did yours?

[dmarc117]

This is also partly why you pay them to BE your insurance company. They are working for YOU in these situations. You shouldn't be dealing with the other guy's insurance company AT ALL. They've lowballed you.....they know it. But if you come at them without any representation, either from your own ins. company or a lawyer.....they figure you'll take the first offer.

 

**And if you've called your insurance company on this and YOUR agent has let you deal with the other company yourself......you should seriously consider looking for another insurance company when this is all done.

 

in our accident, everyone went to the hospital in ambulances. as soon as the other ins co. saw this, they didnt stop calling me. everyday there was another message; hope you and your family are ok sir, hopefully we can take care of this quickly for your sake, etc. once i told them i lawyered up, the calls stopped(by law in il they have to stop calling once u tell them u have a lawyer). but they tried very hard to get me to settle with them asap. its in their best interest to cut u a check and be done with you.

[detlef]

State farm sucks, that is why I fired the clowns. They did not inform me I had the right to 3rd party arbitration.

 

Did yours?

I guess the answer is no since I have no idea what you're talking about.

 

At any rate, I'm heading down to my agent's office this morning to, as they say in Ocean's 13, offer him a Billy Martin. He's got one chance to step up and make this right.

[T_bone65]

We had a 2006 Nissan Armada catch fire and burn up back in June of this year (go to youtube and do a search on Nissan Armada fire for video of it). We have progressive for our insurance and my main concern was that I had looked at the Blue Book value and we would of owed over 5K. Our agent told us not to worry about it because they don't use the Blue Book value and after everything was done they paid off our loan and we got an extra 2K and still may have more money coning back to us since they had a recall on the vehicle 3 weeks later for the same exact problem that we had.

[detlef]

So, it appears I have some homework to do (as well as find a new agent). Our guy insists that, at least in NC, our agent only gets involved if it is our fault or the other person doesn't have insurance.

 

None the less, I think we're done with this tool. Here's a pretty funny exchange from our conversation.

 

Him: Well, I spoke to your wife several times the day of the accident, including once from my home.

 

Me: Before 5pm.

 

Him: Excuse me? What does that have to do with it?

 

Me: Well, you mentioned that you spoke to her from home like it meant something and I'm simply pointing out that it was during business hours, so let's just agree that doesn't qualify as going above and beyond.

 

Him: Are you saying I can't leave my desk?

 

Me; You're not serious. I don't give a crap where you go, just saying don't pretend that taking a call from home is any big deal if you're doing so during business hours. Besides, the only reason why we were even given your cell phone number was because nobody at your office had any idea about our case, so they suggested we call you. If you don't want to be bugged at home during business hours, maybe you need cover your ass a little better.

 

None the less, we'll be moving on.

 

As for my situation, I think we've got some decent ammo to deal with this ourselves. I've done some rather exhaustive research into how much her car was worth, including the fact that there's exactly one for sale within 200 miles of here (for 16K, mind you). I'm pretty sure we'll be OK.

Edited December 1, 2008 by detlef

[SteelBunz]

in our accident, everyone went to the hospital in ambulances. as soon as the other ins co. saw this, they didnt stop calling me. everyday there was another message; hope you and your family are ok sir, hopefully we can take care of this quickly for your sake, etc. once i told them i lawyered up, the calls stopped(by law in il they have to stop calling once u tell them u have a lawyer). but they tried very hard to get me to settle with them asap. its in their best interest to cut u a check and be done with you.

 

That's code for: "Once you sign for any money from us......your settlement will be considered concluded and resolved. God help you if you have further or lingering complications from the accident......we won't be responsible after that."

[TheShiznit]

It's not our policy, it's the policy of the dude who smashed into my wife's car from behind.

 

Then file the claim through your insurance and let them subrogate it through the other dude's insurance.

[TheShiznit]

State farm sucks, that is why I fired the clowns. They did not inform me I had the right to 3rd party arbitration.

 

Did yours?

 

Sure they did...it is in the policy...can you read? Seriously though...most agents don't even know the rules...they are there just to sell...it suck I know..but it is what it is...it is called the dumbing down of America.

[dmarc117]

That's code for: "Once you sign for any money from us......your settlement will be considered concluded and resolved. God help you if you have further or lingering complications from the accident......we won't be responsible after that."

 

 

yep. people do not realize the time you have to file. in illinois its 2y for anyone over 18 and for minors, its until they are 18. my lawyer said he has a ton of cases open right now where people took that 1st check and 2 months later had complications. now they screwed.

[TheShiznit]

So, it appears I have some homework to do (as well as find a new agent). Our guy insists that, at least in NC, our agent only gets involved if it is our fault or the other person doesn't have insurance.

 

None the less, I think we're done with this tool. Here's a pretty funny exchange from our conversation.

 

Him: Well, I spoke to your wife several times the day of the accident, including once from my home.

 

Me: Before 5pm.

 

Him: Excuse me? What does that have to do with it?

 

Me: Well, you mentioned that you spoke to her from home like it meant something and I'm simply pointing out that it was during business hours, so let's just agree that doesn't qualify as going above and beyond.

 

Him: Are you saying I can't leave my desk?

 

Me; You're not serious. I don't give a crap where you go, just saying don't pretend that taking a call from home is any big deal if you're doing so during business hours. Besides, the only reason why we were even given your cell phone number was because nobody at your office had any idea about our case, so they suggested we call you. If you don't want to be bugged at home during business hours, maybe you need cover your ass a little better.

 

None the less, we'll be moving on.

 

As for my situation, I think we've got some decent ammo to deal with this ourselves. I've done some rather exhaustive research into how much her car was worth, including the fact that there's exactly one for sale within 200 miles of here (for 16K, mind you). I'm pretty sure we'll be OK.

 

To be fair Det, some companies do not let their agents actively broker a claim....that is why they have in house claims agents. State Farm has its own claims agents and the selling agents rarely, if ever, get involved in a claim. You will find this to be more of the rule than the exception. Also, to rent a car, all you have to do at most places is give them the insurance info and it is done...you pick the car. Your policy will have limits of say 30 dollars per day up to 900 dollars per accident....but it is what it is. If you use your own insurance company to subrogate the claim, then all of this will be handled for you....your agent has very limited abilities to help make claims with another company easier. It is like you making one of your customers complaints about another restaurant go more smoothly....you have limited things you can do...other than call...which may not help at all.

[detlef]

Then file the claim through your insurance and let them subrogate it through the other dude's insurance.

Well, maybe my guy is full of it but he assures me that's not how it works in NC and suggested that I call the NC insurance commissioner if I didn't believe him.

 

He said that I would not be able to find any agent in this state who'd handle the claim this way.

[dmarc117]

Well, maybe my guy is full of it but he assures me that's not how it works in NC and suggested that I call the NC insurance commissioner if I didn't believe him.

 

He said that I would not be able to find any agent in this state who'd handle the claim this way.

 

 

in my accident, i didnt really deal with my agent at all. i called the 800 to file the claim. then was contacted by someone handling the claim and dealt with them the whole time.

[detlef]

To be fair Det, some companies do not let their agents actively broker a claim....that is why they have in house claims agents. State Farm has its own claims agents and the selling agents rarely, if ever, get involved in a claim. You will find this to be more of the rule than the exception. Also, to rent a car, all you have to do at most places is give them the insurance info and it is done...you pick the car. Your policy will have limits of say 30 dollars per day up to 900 dollars per accident....but it is what it is. If you use your own insurance company to subrogate the claim, then all of this will be handled for you....your agent has very limited abilities to help make claims with another company easier. It is like you making one of your customers complaints about another restaurant go more smoothly....you have limited things you can do...other than call...which may not help at all.

Well, short of subrogating the claim (which it appears doesn't happen here, though I still don't know), I wouldn't have minded a bit more guidance and looking after.

 

For instance, we had another collision a few years ago when it wasn't our fault, got the car fixed, but failed to get the lost value claim. You might recall I posted about that 2 weeks ago right after the latest. See, it didn't dawn on me about the lost value until we got hosed at resale time. So, I ultimately found out how to deal with that here in the huddle. A fine resource indeed, but I'd like to think that my insurance agent would have my back enough to make sure I was going to bat with all the info I needed. You know, like a good neighbor should?

 

Same goes here. I don't think we're going to get hosed here, but that's 100% because we made sure of it. During my talk with him today, after it was clear that I was pissed at his lack of attention of guidance, he started in with, "now just because they offer something, doesn't mean you have to take it." Of course, this is after I already did about as much as I could.

 

Again, I would expect my agent to hip me to as many ways I can make sure I don't get hosed by the other company. You know, because I pay him.

[detlef]

in my accident, i didnt really deal with my agent at all. i called the 800 to file the claim. then was contacted by someone handling the claim and dealt with them the whole time.

I understand what you and shiznit are saying. However, if it was simply a matter of someone at State Farm besides my agent being the one to talk to, don't you think he'd have told me that?

 

"Hey, we're here to help, but I'm not the guy you're going to be dealing with. Call X and they'll take care of it.

[SteelBunz]

To be fair Det, some companies do not let their agents actively broker a claim....that is why they have in house claims agents. State Farm has its own claims agents and the selling agents rarely, if ever, get involved in a claim. You will find this to be more of the rule than the exception. Also, to rent a car, all you have to do at most places is give them the insurance info and it is done...you pick the car. Your policy will have limits of say 30 dollars per day up to 900 dollars per accident....but it is what it is. If you use your own insurance company to subrogate the claim, then all of this will be handled for you....your agent has very limited abilities to help make claims with another company easier. It is like you making one of your customers complaints about another restaurant go more smoothly....you have limited things you can do...other than call...which may not help at all.

 

Well if that is how it works in NC......then to be fair, his AGENT should have directed him and his claim to an in-house claims agent. Right? The point is.....not ALL of your premiums are going toward strictly covering you and your car. SOME of those premiums go toward service, whether it is a commission to the selling agent or paying other State Farm employees......such as an in-house claims agent.

 

And part of those services include mediating between you and other insurance companies in the event of an accident. They are responsible for going after uninsured motorists.....they are also responsible for getting fair settlements from other ins. companies for you.

 

His agent has gladly taken the original commissions and all renewals to date.....and as far as I can tell, has done nothing for him now in this accident that wasn't even his wife's fault. NOT even referring him to a claims agent (if that's how it's supposed to work in their company). Instead he's trying to get Det to hire his own atty (or do it himself) to recoup an acceptable amount for totalled his car. In cases of bodily injury......I'd recommend your own atty.....but this is replacement value for a car that his company had been insuring. His ins. co. should be doing this for him.