Pope Flick Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 [TheGrunt] I'm always right. [/TheGrunt] Corrected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Love Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 I wasn't referring to that, but it seems like their are some fundamental difference of opinions as indicated by the following 2 statements which seem rather contradictory. Which is it? It depends on what one is focusing on. I'm guessing that those who are convinced that the US is moving towards a more socialist government are focusing on the number of and money spent on social programs. I think that's undeniably gone up. However, that can be offset by a lot of the deregulation going on and the number of private contractors doing things that government employees once did. My assessment is that the US is roughly as socialistic now as we were several decades ago; which is to say, not very. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chavez Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 We are a lot closer to socialism today than we were when this country was founded. We're also a lot further from being "socialist" than we were in say, 1938. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrunt Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 Corrected. I'll usually admit I'm wrong if it's pretty obvious that is the case. But a lot of the time people assume I'm wrong because of the material issue being discussed -- so as I'm entitled to a personal opinion. But I appreciate the notion that I'm rarely wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boat_hacked Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) I have read most of the posts on this thread. I have replied to all of the threads of this type, over the years, and it's getting old, but then so am I. So here's my reply:My background: 31 years teaching in everything from Jr. HS to Grad school. I have 5+ years of industrial experience in Welding, Mech Design, and Machine Tool Operations (machinist/tool & die). I have been a consultant for major corporations, I co-wrote ~5 books on AutoCad, have attended many seminars and have certifications in several related fields, and am a Professor Emeritus from the then largest single campus Community College in the USA. But I was ALWAYS a TEACHER! 1) I have always been and always will be a staunch supporter of teacher unions ( I've been a member of both IEA and AFT) and am proud of it! 2) I have spent countless hours on union committees to make education better! 3) I have also spent countless hours trying to make our profession honorable and reasonably paid. It's always been curious/hughmoress to me that because people spend, hopefully second place, most of their time with a teacher that THEY know this job as well as anyone. And that is where the problem w/ teaching and education in general is F'd up. Until one has taught or has done anything else for that matter IN A PROFESSION, they don't know squat about a/the job. wholeheartedly agree, teaching 12+ years here, and apply that old adage, until you've walked a mile in their shoes... Unions: 1) They don't protect bad teachers! They provide a method for "Due Process". Believe me I have been responsible for many teacher firings, but they got "due process". 2) Tenure is bupkis! Never heard of life-time tenure (and coming from a "right to work state" that says a lot!), unless we're talking about Mr. Chips! 3) Unions help to protect teachers from "arbitrary and capricious" behavior. That's a biggie! Too easy to say "I don't like this teacher because.....and the reason is the district is trying to save cash! In general: Are there bad teachers? YES! Can they be fired? YES if the admin does their job! Tenure or not! Are unions bad? If you're not in a union you'd say yes! Making teachers accountable? We're not making gears here! Teachers get what they get from the student body and live w/ it! Measure what? exactly why teacher's pay shouldn't be based upon student achievement. Bottom line.....The PARENTS are the biggest variable in this puzzle! They don't care, the kids don't care. IF THE PARENTS ARE INVOLVED, THE KIDS WILL DO FINE!!!! CASE CLOSED!!!! God bless Egret, Yukon, Irish, and the rest of you dedicating your life to educating our youth! We need and want you! Pope, Try having the locals pay for GOOD EDUCATION.....they will at you. Never will happen. Teachers do what they do because of dedication and desire! If they don't do that, they drop out and become realtors! Lastly, I hate the connotation that "Voc Ed" was devoted to the dummies! Look at the tech world we are in! No "DUMBIE" could deal w/ the electronics, math, science, etc. that the average welder, car mechanic, machinist, etc. has to know to succeed! ditto the sentiment. I tell the kids if they choose not to understand basic geometry or how to manipulate/calculate formulas, they close the door on a lot of career choices that don't involve college degrees. We'll see who really reads this and the other posts. Seems lately that all most care about is posting their opinion and the other posts be damned! This isn't the place it used to be. Read, dammit!!!! Read as much as possible!!! AMEN Edited March 13, 2007 by boat_hacked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.