detlef Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 The comparison is not on an even playing field at all. A fantasy football owner would never have to factor in getting a look at a young player for future consideration you could get a look at a player without starting him in fantasy football My point is quite simply that both people are doing right by themselves despite the effects it has on doing your part to keep the league fair and competitive for everyone else. Whether it's to save $5 or take a look at a young player or protect the health of one of your stars is not the issue. What if it was $20 for a waiver move? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 (edited) Because FF owners should have more honor than NFL owners? Because FF is not the NFL? The whole point of this thread question, to me, is... I'm out of it so screw'em. Where is the honor in that? You never quit.. you always compete to the fullest. Otherwise there is no point in playing. Money has nothing to do with it.... that is just a side product. No ... the point isn't "I'm out of it so screw 'em" ... the point is I'm out of it why should I throw any more money away. If the league would waive the transaction fee I'd be happy to acquire a scrub TE that may get me 1 point (which would be 1 more point than my starting TE scored last week). So if the league wants me to ensure I have a complete lineup each week to "be competitive" perhaps they should consider waiving the transaction fees instead of trying to milk my team for more money to enhance the kitty. Edited November 4, 2008 by Grits and Shins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 My point is quite simply that both people are doing right by themselves despite the effects it has on doing your part to keep the league fair and competitive for everyone else. Whether it's to save $5 or take a look at a young player or protect the health of one of your stars is not the issue. What if it was $20 for a waiver move? You would have known that when you agreed to be in the league . Some leagues put in rules to prevent this type of thing. Others just go with th unwritten rule that when you commit to a league you agree to submit a competitive linup every week. Starting a guy that isnt playing because you dont want to spend 5 bucks is not fielding the most competitive team you can field Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylive5 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 No ... the point isn't "I'm out of it so screw 'em" ... the point is I'm out of it why should I throw any more money away. If the league would waive the transaction fee I'd be happy to acquire a scrub TE that may get me 1 point (which would be 1 more point than my starting TE scored last week). So you wish to amend the rules to say that if a team is out of the running for a PO spot all WW transaction fees are waived. Sounds fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T_bone65 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 No ... the point isn't "I'm out of it so screw 'em" ... the point is I'm out of it why should I throw any more money away. If the league would waive the transaction fee I'd be happy to acquire a scrub TE that may get me 1 point (which would be 1 more point than my starting TE scored last week). Would you be happy if you were on the other end of things? I am sure the answer will be yes since you are on the 2-6 end now but........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 So, the other night I was playing poker and this a-hole up and folds right in the middle of a hand. It was 5 card draw and I was dealt a straight, so I didn't need a card but dude could have taken a card that someone else needed to beat my hand. Only, because he figured he was out of it, he up and quits right then and there. So guess what happens, the guy sitting to his left takes two cards and makes a freaking full boat! If that chicken poopy hadn't folded, those would have been his cards and I might have won! Honestly, I don't even know why he bothered playing if he wasn't going to stick it out to the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylive5 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 So if the league wants me to ensure I have a complete lineup each week to "be competitive" ...... I'm pretty sure that the league thought you would attempt to be competitive each week when you joined said league. But then again...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 Would you be happy if you were on the other end of things? I am sure the answer will be yes since you are on the 2-6 end now but........ I have ALWAYS been a proponent of allowing owners to manage their own teams. Each week I don't look at anybody's starting lineups, including my own opponents. So, in all honesty I wouldn't even be aware of this happening to another owner. But presuming that another owner raised the issue I wouldn't worry about it unless the owner was clearly submitting an inferior line up in an attempt to impact the results and / or playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 So, the other night I was playing poker and this a-hole up and folds right in the middle of a hand. It was 5 card draw and I was dealt a straight, so I didn't need a card but dude could have taken a card that someone else needed to beat my hand. Only, because he figured he was out of it, he up and quits right then and there. So guess what happens, the guy sitting to his left takes two cards and makes a freaking full boat! If that chicken poopy hadn't folded, those would have been his cards and I might have won! Honestly, I don't even know why he bothered playing if he wasn't going to stick it out to the end. Another weak comparison.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 I'd like somebody to tell me which scrub TE I should aquire for $5 that makes my team so much more competitive. I'm here to tell you if there was a TE out there I thought would give me 5 points I probably would go ahead and drop the $5 on a waiver move. But there is about a 90% chance that any TE I pick up is going to score 2 or fewer points and have ZERO impact on the out come of my game. In other words I believe there is about a 90% chance that acquiring a scrub TE to fill in this week will have ZERO impact on my team's ability to be competitive. This is also the week I play the TOP scoring team in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I'm here to tell you if there was a TE out there I thought would give me 5 points I probably would go ahead and drop the $5 on a waiver move. I wonder if Brent Celek, and his 7 catches for 136 yards, was on your waiver wire last week? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 So if the league wants me to ensure I have a complete lineup each week to "be competitive" perhaps they should consider waiving the transaction fees instead of trying to milk my team for more money to enhance the kitty. Excellent rule change....for next year. For now, stick to the rules and integrity as they exist today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Another weak comparison.. I was actually just trying to see how far I could push it. Truth be told, I think Grits is being vinegary fresh here and would personally feel obligated to pick a TE myself in that situation. However, that is the only weak comparison I've made. You guys seem to think that is OK to manage one's team in manner that doesn't give it the best chance of victory in some cases but not others. I simply think you should err on the side of letting teams do what they think is right. If someone fails to pick up a TE because they spaced out that he was on a bye, is that punishable? I failed to start a WR in week 2 because I set my line-up, went camping, and then the Balt/ Hou game was moved to week 10. Was that wrong? So, yet another slippery slope. Should I have been duty bound to find someone to manage my team for me just in case the game was called? At what point do we just relax and understand the actual situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I wonder if Brent Celek, and his 7 catches for 136 yards, was on your waiver wire last week? I wonder how much less than 1% the number of people who picked him and started him is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 If I'd been in this boat last week ... based on Huddle projections the best available TE to acquire was Zach Miller. In week 9 Zach Miller scored a whopping 2.90 points versus the 17 points he was projected to score. His 2.9 points woudl have had ZERO impact on the out come of my game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I wonder how much less than 1% the number of people who picked him and started him is. My point EXACTLY. I imagine this is the type of TE available on his waiver wire. Or perhaps Peyton Hills of Denver? Fact is, if you don't even try, the needle in the haystack will never be found. You can try, and not find it....or not even look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whomper Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 If I'd been in this boat last week ... based on Huddle projections the best available TE to acquire was Zach Miller. In week 9 Zach Miller scored a whopping 2.90 points versus the 17 points he was projected to score. His 2.9 points woudl have had ZERO impact on the out come of my game. Doesnt matter. He is still a player with a pulse as opposed to the guy you are starting that has zero chance of scoring from in front of his big screen TV. I think you are bored and fishing here. Its fantasy 101 as far as I am concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MustOfBeenDrunk Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Been one of those years in my local ... my team is 2-7 and has not shot at the playoffs. I still manage my team each week (thus my 2 wins after going 0-6). Here is my problem ... I've been playing with a crappy TE and have not been willing to spend $5 to acquire another crappy TE from waivers in the attempt to upgrade. Now my crappy TE is off this week so I have to decide between taking a zero at that position or coughing up the transaction fee to acquire another scrub TE. One thing is clear .. I'm not making the playoffs ... so whatever transaction fees I spend is money lost. So ... why should I spend the $5 to pick up another TE? ask yourself this question than do the same. if you were in the playoff hunt what would you do ?? simple as that !! anything less is tanking !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 (edited) My point EXACTLY. I imagine this is the type of TE available on his waiver wire. Or perhaps Peyton Hills of Denver? Fact is, if you don't even try, the needle in the haystack will never be found. You can try, and not find it....or not even look. Then you're not very good at making points. Had Grits gone after a TE, it's pretty damned certain that it wouldn't have been that dude. Oh, and I think Peyton Hills is a FB so he doesn't count. None the less, even if he was in the running, one could make an argument that it wouldn't be worth $5 to pick up a guy who history shows has a very slim chance of helping your team. Not sure what percentage $5 is of the entry fee, of course. Go check out the advice forums on WDIS at TE for guys in bye week situations. It's typically a pretty weak batch of talent and inevitably you're talking about guys who are more than likely going to end up with 2 catches for 25 yds or something. Edited November 4, 2008 by detlef Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loaf Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 it's 5 bucks. Did you get fired? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylive5 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 If I'd been in this boat last week ... based on Huddle projections the best available TE to acquire was Zach Miller. In week 9 Zach Miller scored a whopping 2.90 points versus the 17 points he was projected to score. His 2.9 points woudl have had ZERO impact on the out come of my game. You can't look back.... no one knows who will get what. You had no idea if Miller would have had an impact on you winning or losing that game until it was played. That isn't a very well thought out rationalization for deciding to not be competitive and using a player on a bye to save 5 bucks. What are you going to do when Miller has the 17 points this week and you didn't pick him up? You are in it to be competitive and hope to win...or you aren't in it at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylive5 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Sometimes, when you are wrong and know you are wrong, you just have to admit it and move on. This is one of those times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 (edited) Then you're not very good at making points. Had Grits gone after a TE, it's pretty damned certain that it wouldn't have been that dude. Oh, and I think Peyton Hills is a FB so he doesn't count. None the less, even if he was in the running, one could make an argument that it wouldn't be worth $5 to pick up a guy who history shows has a very slim chance of helping your team. Not sure what percentage $5 is of the entry fee, of course. the you too are not very good at making points, since (ETA) ALMOST every poster here except you feels the right thing to do when accepting an invitation to play in a league is to field as competitive a team as possible, regardless of whether, as you state above, "a guy who history shows has a very slim chance of helping your team". Brent Celek was a starting NFL TE last week....why on earth would he have not taken a flier on him in an offense that throws the ball 60+% of the time? And no, "one could NOT make an argument that it wouldn't be worth $5"......the money is irrelevant. When you sign up for a fantasy league, you read the rules, and know that every FA move is $5, and that you are expected to make moves to field the most competitive team possible, whether you are 9-0 or 0-9. What you are saying is that, as teams become eliminated from contention, its OK for the integrity of the league to slip further and further into the abyss, since those eliminated teams should be excused from maintaining that integrity. That's weak....and a league I would never be associated with. Edited November 4, 2008 by i_am_the_swammi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhippens Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 if there is nothing in your rules that says you are required to be more competitive and no "loss fee" paid out to prevent you from even attempting to luck out a win, then go ahead, do what you want to do and nobody here can really say it's against your league rules. it's on the league to enforce that and if they are not, it's your personal conviction that will dictate the outcome. if there is something in the rules about it, then i see why this is no different than breaking any other league rules and you should be at the mercy of the commish and your leaguemates. because at that point, you can guarantee as someone mentioned before that the most competitive thing to do is start someone that will at least be on a football field this weekend. the quality of guys on the wire has nothing to do with it. personally, i would pay the 5 bucks, get a tight end and do my best, but that's because i feel a commitment to do so, not necessarily because rules tell me to. basically, the 5 bucks is less of a price to pay than getting razzed by this board, league members, and my conscience. what's worth less (or more) to you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myhousekey Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 (edited) I've played Scheffler 3 weeks in a row. My team still has a shot at the playoffs but the WW doesn't have anything worth my money. I don't see any issue with playing the guy on a bye. Edit: Granted in that league I incurred a $2 fine for starting a player on a bye but was still cheaper than picking up another scrub TE. Edited November 4, 2008 by myhousekey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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