spider321 Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 (edited) I never stated Portis was "done", only that he is "due" for a decline. Portis is the only player in the top 60 career touches to have only played 7 seasons.(and he's #32) There are only three players currently in the NFL that have more touches. LaDainian Tomlinson, Fred Taylor and Jamal Lewis. Non-retired RB's with 2,285 touches or more... Edgerrin James - unemployed Warrick Dunn - unemployed LaDainian Tomlinson Fred Taylor Jamal Lewis Ahman Green - unemployed Shaun Alexander - unemployed Clinton Portis I see nothing here to refute these facts that I posted. I respect that two other posters here (keggerz and Tford) are able to support their positions. As some of us know, there are 3 types of lies(in order)... a little white lie a d*** dirty lie statistics I strive to reach keggerz level of statistics mastery. Edited June 10, 2009 by spider321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 (edited) I see nothing here to refute these facts that I posted. I respect that two other posters here (keggerz and Tford) are able to support their positions. As some of us know, there are 3 types of lies(in order)... a little white lie a d*** dirty lie statistics I strive to reach keggerz level of statistics mastery. that wasnt nothin'.... I see nothing here to refute these facts that I posted. I respect that two other posters here (keggerz and Tford) are able to support their positions. As some of us know, there are 3 types of lies(in order)... a little white lie a d*** dirty lie statistics I strive to reach keggerz level of statistics mastery. that wasnt nothin'.... oh and your facts...what do they say? 1 Fact gives where portis ranks on touches Another Fact lists three players in the NFL with more touches than Portis(so what does that fact mean?) Another Fact lists all the non-retired NFL RBs with as many or more touches than Portis(again what does that fact mean?) so yeah you are right we cant refute those facts but what can be refuted is that Portis is "done" or "due" for a decline due to his number of touches...well I already stated that just about any RB that has played 4+ years is due for a decline so that sure wasnt much of a limb you stood out on.....and as far as being "done" or as you said "time to jump ship"(that pretty much says you think he is done to me.) it is easy to see just from the few RBs I pulled off the top of my head that Portis can surely be productive and not "done" after 2285 touches. Edited June 11, 2009 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) Curtis Martin: Played the 2000 season at the age of 27(same age Portis was when they both had 2285 touches) thru 2000 Martin accumulated 2285 touches(just like Portis) Martin stats: 00:1712 total yards(finished the season with a career total of 2285 touches) 01:1833 total yards 02:1456 total yards 03:1570 total yards 04:1942 total yards 05: 853 total yards and final year in the NFL so after reaching 2285 touches Martin went on to average 1530.8 total yards per year over his final 5 NFL seasons oh and in case you were curious as to what Martin averaged in total yards from 95-00 it was 1629.3 total yards per season...so yeah he was "due" to decline then too and he sure did decline at a rate of 100.5 yards per year....oh but since spider mentioned how evil stats can be I would be remiss if I didnt mention that excluding 05 after martin reached 2285 touches he averaged 1700.3 yards per season from 01 thru 04 Edited June 11, 2009 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spider321 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) So you're saying that Spider is talking out his web spinning hole? Opie, let us know when you have something/anything to contribute to the thread. Edited June 11, 2009 by spider321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spider321 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) Curtis Martin:Played the 2000 season at the age of 27(same age Portis was when they both had 2285 touches) thru 2000 Martin accumulated 2285 touches(just like Portis) Martin stats: 00:1712 total yards(finished the season with a career total of 2285 touches) 01:1833 total yards 02:1456 total yards 03:1570 total yards 04:1942 total yards 05: 853 total yards and final year in the NFL so after reaching 2285 touches Martin went on to average 1530.8 total yards per year over his final 5 NFL seasons oh and in case you were curious as to what Martin averaged in total yards from 95-00 it was 1629.3 total yards per season...so yeah he was "due" to decline then too and he sure did decline at a rate of 100.5 yards per year....oh but since spider mentioned how evil stats can be I would be remiss if I didnt mention that excluding 05 after martin reached 2285 touches he averaged 1700.3 yards per season from 01 thru 04 OK, I get it, you disagree. Do you really think it would be difficult for me to find multiple players that hit the "wall" after 2,000 touches? I could post their names, numbers, and stats. Then maybe I could even make a pretty pie chart or bar graph to list them on. Then you could spend even more time finding players, numbers, and stats that support your opinion. Then I could spend even more time than you finding more players, numbers, and stats to support my opinion. and so on... and so on... and so on... It's not worth it to me. You win. Clinton Portis will play for 10 more seasons and average 1,500 yards and 12 TD's. Edited June 11, 2009 by spider321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 umm, no. Your point was that there was a wall. Kegz proved that there isn't a wall or at least the wall is somewhere else. or that a wall based on 2285 touches isnt a definitive wall and spider, fwiw I didnt dig....those RBs were just a few guys off the top of my head that I knew played into their 30s and figured they had in excess of 2285 carries...the others were guys you supplied Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spider321 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) umm, no. Your point was that there was a wall. Kegz proved that there isn't a wall or at least the wall is somewhere else. There is a wall. I agree that wall is not in the same place for every player, but there is a wall. For the vast majority of players that wall was well behind where Portis is now. Very few players' wall was beyond where Portis is now. For Kegz to name some players whose wall was beyond where Portis is now does not prove anything. Kegz and Tford will understand this(you will not), but most of the time you can use numbers and stats to "prove" just about anything. Kegz and Tford have mastered ProFootballReference.com and substantiate their claims. You sir, are the bereft sheep in the background commenting on everything, while adding nothing. This has taken too much of my time already. Edited June 11, 2009 by spider321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) There is a wall. I agree that wall is not in the same place for every player, but there is a wall. For the vast majority of players that wall is well behind where Portis is now. Very few players wall was beyond where Portis is now. For Kegz to name some players whose wall was beyond where Portis is now does not prove anything. I don't believe you will understand this, but most of the time you can use numbers and stats to "prove" just about anything. This has taken too much of my time already. Kegz and Tford have mastered ProFootballReference.com and substantiate their claims. You sir, are the bereft sheep in the background commenting on everything, while adding nothing. i dont use ProFootballReference.com ...I actually just pulled up those players on NFL.com looked at their numbers and then said yeah that looks like they performed past the 2285 wall and when I checked the numbers I was correct.....you can also use stats to disprove what others say about things too the thing is I agree that there is a wall I just dont know how much of it is touch based versus how much is age based....but i do know you said Portis is due for a decline because of touches....i felt that probably could be disproved so I used the guys you supplied and then looked up a couple off the top of my head and sure enough it proved that a RB can produce without declining at the 2285 number... I am sure I will "stat" you in the future Edited June 11, 2009 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spider321 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 (edited) Well, that's really useful then. Is that going to be the limit of your contributions to this board? Surely, even you can do better than just taking statements out of context. ...or are you just a one trick sheep? I may be the frontrunner for NTOY, but at least I have SOMETHING to add. Edited June 11, 2009 by spider321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chargerz Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 LaDainian Tomlinson - Getting long in the tooth for an NFL RB and has absorbed an obscene amount of work over the years. He's going to give up some of his workload to Sproles and Gartrell Johnson this season. That's another situation where it is very good for LT and the Chargers, but bad for LT FF owners. Still a very legit first round pick, but not at the top of the list by himself anymore. [Yoda]The risk of injury is great with this one.[/Yoda] For that reason alone I'm not so sure he's "a very legit first round pick". Those that like high reward/high risk players will take him there, but I think he should go in the second round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 [Yoda]The risk of injury is great with this one.[/Yoda] For that reason alone I'm not so sure he's "a very legit first round pick". Those that like high reward/high risk players will take him there, but I think he should go in the second round. LT is going to be here in a couple of weeks and I am going to see if I can possibly get an interview with him(Cutler and Urlacher too) and I hope to ask him about his injury and rehab etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darin3 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 While that may be true at this exact moment, if any of the following RBs sign with a team, your statement is incorrect. Edgerrin James Warrick Dunn Ahman Green Shaun Alexander I think you just proved spider's point by comparing Portis - in a roundabout way - to these stiffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spider321 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I think you just proved spider's point by comparing Portis - in a roundabout way - to these stiffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Is that going to be the limit of your contributions to this board? Surely, even you can do better than just taking statements out of context. ...or are you just a one trick sheep? I may be the frontrunner for NTOY, but at least I have SOMETHING to add. Dude, you made a pompous, arrogant, all-or-nothing statement about Portis. Opie took you to task on it and called BS. You can't really support your opinion, but instead of agreeing to disagree, you belittle and ridicule others for a difference of opinion. We have differences of opinion here all the time. The folks who are corteous to their neighbors and realize they can be wrong are the ones who typically gain respect around here. Just learn from the situation and realize you don't always have to have the last word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I would say with extreme confidence that LT, Portis, Westbrook, Jackson and Jacobs all finish in the top 10 RBs this year. Add in AP, MJD, and Turner and you only have 2 spots left. I would assume Forte will probably end up somewhere in that mix, I just can't say for certain where. SJax hasn't finished healthy in 2 years. He is young and could do it but in my PPR the last 2 years he finished 15th and 16th. I gave up on his last year. I think 1 or 2 of the rookies will crack the top 10 this year too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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