westvirginia Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 do you think exxon controls the price of crude oil? as far as I can make out, their motive as a corporation is always going to be to produce as much gas as they can. the more they make, the more they can sell. DON'T FEED THE TROLLS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Was anybody pissed a few years ago at how much GM was making on selling their SUVs? Or Apple for selling their IPODs and IPHONEs? Or any of the restaurants and grocery stores on how much they make on their food? Or, Coca Cola's profits on selling water (Dasani, etc)? These are not commodities. Gasoline is the lifeblood of the economy. It's what gets most people to work (yes I know there are alternatives) in this day and age of commuting from the burbs to the office in the city. It's what fuels our transportation industry to get goods to market on the shelves of our stores. It's driving up the price of EVERYTHING. You can't say the same thing about SUVS, IPods, Coke, bottled water, etc. Someone made a good point earlier which I have heard mentioned before. If the government can step in and regulate the electric companies and their profit margins, why should gasoline be treated any differently? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 These are not commodities. Gasoline is the lifeblood of the economy. It's what gets most people to work (yes I know there are alternatives) in this day and age of commuting from the burbs to the office in the city. It's what fuels our transportation industry to get goods to market on the shelves of our stores. It's driving up the price of EVERYTHING. You can't say the same thing about SUVS, IPods, Coke, bottled water, etc. Someone made a good point earlier which I have heard mentioned before. If the government can step in and regulate the electric companies and their profit margins, why should gasoline be treated any differently? can you really not figure this out? it's because an electric company has a local monopoly. each of us only has one utility company we can patronize, because that is just the way the infrastructure works and all of that. we each have several gasoline stations and oil companies we can chose to patronize, all of which are in competition with each other for your business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Was anybody pissed a few years ago at how much GM was making on selling their SUVs? Or Apple for selling their IPODs and IPHONEs? Or any of the restaurants and grocery stores on how much they make on their food? Or, Coca Cola's profits on selling water (Dasani, etc)? A ridiculous argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Somewhat, my point is that in fact there is no Monopoly in the petrol/gas industry, it doesn't exist and to state otherwise is false. Gas prices are based on supply and demand (production costs, etc..). This supply demand correlation has been evident over the past 10 days, oil prices began retreating, I am paying 16 cents (4%) less per gallon than I was 10 days ago. Wow - you got me. I spoke a "false-hood". It's not a monopoly in the true sense of the word so yep - you got me. But if you don't get the point I'm trying to make you're living with your head in the sand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEC=UGA Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 A ridiculous argument. This argument has gone on before in other threads. Markets and supply/demand factors are the most important drivers in pricing of goods (yes you can throw in exchange rates, taxes, etc..., but at the end of the day supply/demand dictates pricing). We have seen an incredible demand for oil on the world market, this has helped to drive up the price of oil. The other factor is that you have cartels that stipulate the amount of oil production that will occur, if these groups do not increase the amount of oil available while demand is rising prices are going to increase. OPEC supplies a great deal of the worlds oil, they are not drastically increasing supplies in the midst of increased worldwide demand, hence, prices go up. Oil refiners here in the US have to purchase the non-locally drilled oil from these other nations, they are having to pay the higher prices that have been created by the increase in global demand. They then refine this expensive oil and must then recover their costs and make some money doing it. In order to continue operations, exploration, refining, etc.... they must make a profit via which they can attract capital/investors, for oil companies it appears that the profit margin they must make is in the 8.4% to 11% range. If they can not make these margins, they can not attract investors and must cease some operations, expansions, improvements, or lay off workers. I guess the most pressing question here is, what profit margin should oil companies be allowed to make, not whole dollar profits, but margins? I think that the sky should be the limit, but that is just me. Believe me, if they push the price too much, the market will adjust and they'll make less money. I would argue that a lot of the issues people are having with gas prices revolves around their personal lifestyle choices. As much as you may hate it, lifestyles may have to change. It may mean not buying a new car every couple of years, it may mean that you can't go out to dinner or a movie as often, you may have to downgrade your cable or cell phone package, hell, you may have to move somewhere closer to where you work, but at the end of the day, you can make changes that will lessen the impact of gas prices... they really aren't that high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Irish Doggy Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Was anybody pissed a few years ago at how much GM was making on selling their SUVs? Or Apple for selling their IPODs and IPHONEs? Or any of the restaurants and grocery stores on how much they make on their food? Or, Coca Cola's profits on selling water (Dasani, etc)? Yes! No! I mean, wait.... well..... maybe Apple anyway... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 I would argue that a lot of the issues people are having with gas prices revolves around their personal lifestyle choices. As much as you may hate it, lifestyles may have to change. It may mean not buying a new car every couple of years, it may mean that you can't go out to dinner or a movie as often, you may have to downgrade your cable or cell phone package, hell, you may have to move somewhere closer to where you work, but at the end of the day, you can make changes that will lessen the impact of gas prices... they really aren't that high. Why should we have to do that when the oil companies are making record profits? They are taking a disproportionate share of our discretionary income and we can't do a whole helluva lot about it. But change they will at the expense of other discretionary items which is bull-chit. Wouldn't it better for the economy on the whole if we were able to go out to dinner that extra time? Or to be able to buy a new TV? Or whatever? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEC=UGA Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 (edited) Why should we have to do that when the oil companies are making record profits? They are taking a disproportionate share of our discretionary income and we can't do a whole helluva lot about it. But change they will at the expense of other discretionary items which is bull-chit. Wouldn't it better for the economy on the whole if we were able to go out to dinner that extra time? Or to be able to buy a new TV? Or whatever? Oh, I see, you're entitled to a certain amount of money for your discretionary budget and those evil oil companies are getting rich off of your discretionary money, so they are bad and evil. You know, food really cuts into my discretionary budget, we should make them lower the price of that. So, what profit margin should we allow them to make? ETA Record profit don't mean chit, it is all in the margin, my friend. Edited July 31, 2008 by SEC=UGA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Wouldn't it better for the economy on the whole if we were able to go out to dinner that extra time? Or to be able to buy a new TV? Or whatever? As you can see here, the middle class has nothing to worry about. One less TV won't make anyone blink. How does this go for the poor? One less house, one less week of food, one less utility payment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Oh, I see, you're entitled to a certain amount of money for your discretionary budget and those evil oil companies are getting rich off of your discretionary money, so they are bad and evil. You know, food really cuts into my discretionary budget, we should make them lower the price of that. So, what profit margin should we allow them to make? ETA Record profit don't mean chit, it is all in the margin, my friend. I don't have the answers - never said I did, but I can sure as hell see the problem. And you're blind as a bat if you don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEC=UGA Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 As you can see here, the middle class has nothing to worry about. One less TV won't make anyone blink. How does this go for the poor? One less house, one less week of food, one less utility payment. These poor of whom you speak, they have cars? Oh, yeah, I've seen them, the ones that live in the subsidized housing and have the 46 inch plasma screens in their apartment and roll in a shiny ass car w. Jordans on it, those poor, the over weight ones that I see rolling around the Publix and paying for their food with food stamps, those poor people. Hey, f uck em.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Hey, f uck em.. Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEC=UGA Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 I don't have the answers - never said I did, but I can sure as hell see the problem. And you're blind as a bat if you don't. Here is the problem, companies have been behind the curve in inventing non-petrol powered automobiles, we are not a country that will allow the use of nuclear power generators (new ones), and we have become too pampered and spoiled, we feel it is our right to own a car and drive it as much as we want, use as much petrol as we want, and shouldn't have to pay to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEC=UGA Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Exactly. That should have been my response to your initial post. BTW, what do you consider poor people? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polksalet Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Exxon has made nearly $1,500 a SECOND in PROFIT this year... Note this is PROFIT, not gross sales. It is real hard for me to ignore the part of me that thinks, "W has major ties to big oil. Here at the end of his Presidency, big oil is making the biggest profit ever in the history of the oil business." In any event I can't believe we just take this as a country. How is it possible to tell us we have to pay these high prices and give the oil companies this HUGH profit, when we also have the largest strategic reserve in history as well?? I just don't get it. Perhaps I just don't understand supply and demand. You don't understand because you are retarded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEC=UGA Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 You don't understand because you are retarded. Okay, mean, but this did make me laugh out loud... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted July 31, 2008 Author Share Posted July 31, 2008 (edited) You don't understand because you are retarded. Maybe if I espouse to live in service of some invisible guy in the sky, while making a living off the backs of poor Chinese who are being poisoned and worse in order to support my Wal-Mart lifestyle, I would be smarter. Edited July 31, 2008 by cre8tiff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 That should have been my response to your initial post. BTW, what do you consider poor people? Here's what the government considers poverty. http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/info/info_1327.html "In 2006 the poverty rate for minors in the United States was the highest in the industrialized world, with 21.9% of all minors and 30% of African American minors living below the poverty threshold. Moreover, the standard of living for those in the bottom 10% was lower in the U.S. than in any other developed nation except the United Kingdom, which had the lowest standard of living for impoverished children." But that's poverty. I consider poor a tad bit above that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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