piratesownninjas Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 (edited) Not the best card ever, but a strong one from top to bottom in my opinion... Dong Hyun Kim Vs. Matt Brown Martin Kampmann Vs. Nate Marquardt Dan Henderson Vs. Rousimar Palhares Rich Franklin Vs. Matt Hamill Chuck Liddell Vs. Rashad Evans Who all is watching this tonight? Anyone care to make any predictions? Edited September 7, 2008 by piratesownninjas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted September 7, 2008 Author Share Posted September 7, 2008 And if Rashad Evans tries to do what he's saying he's going to do it will be over soon. Standing and brawling with Liddell? Also, never say you're hosting a legends retirement party and telling to walk his old ass out of the cage... God, I cannot stand Evans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budlitebrad Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 Wow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted September 7, 2008 Author Share Posted September 7, 2008 Holy poopy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted September 7, 2008 Author Share Posted September 7, 2008 Sadly, I think tonight we saw the end of the face of MMA. Chuck in my mind is the greatest lhw champ of all time, but it's time to call it a day. Jardine came up with the gameplan on how to beat Liddell and Evans executed it even better. I gained a ton of respect for Evans as a fighter after this. I'm shocked by this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopher Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 I thought Matt Brown won his fight. The judges seemed to read too much into him getting cut late, after he basically dominated the first two rounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted September 7, 2008 Author Share Posted September 7, 2008 I thought Matt Brown won his fight. The judges seemed to read too much into him getting cut late, after he basically dominated the first two rounds. I thought Matt Brown clearly lost the first and third round. He gave up his back way too much and was lucky to even escape that round. Saying that, I don't thank he had a 10-8 round in the second to even put it close to a split. I thought the decision was correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopher Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 Giving up your back doesn't necessarily mean you lose the round, especially if Brown felt he was in control the entire time, which it certainly appeared he did. The entire first round, even though his opponent was firmly attached to his back, Brown appeared to be in total control and in no danger of being submitted or suffering any "damage." I thought Brown completely dictated the entire sequence of events, with him getting cut in the last couple of minutes being the only exception. Octagon control was clearly in his favor, IMO. Oh well... not the first time that two people have seen a fight totally differently... It seemed that a lot of Atlanta thought Brown won as well, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziachild007 Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 Sadly, I think tonight we saw the end of the face of MMA. Chuck in my mind is the greatest lhw champ of all time, but it's time to call it a day. Jardine came up with the gameplan on how to beat Liddell and Evans executed it even better. I gained a ton of respect for Evans as a fighter after this. I'm shocked by this. The way he was knocked out was just amazing and scary to watch. I've seen some big knockouts in my short time watching UFC, but that one was just wicked looking. I don't know if Chuck can comeback from a loss like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziachild007 Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 Giving up your back doesn't necessarily mean you lose the round, especially if Brown felt he was in control the entire time, which it certainly appeared he did. The entire first round, even though his opponent was firmly attached to his back, Brown appeared to be in total control and in no danger of being submitted or suffering any "damage." I thought Brown completely dictated the entire sequence of events, with him getting cut in the last couple of minutes being the only exception. Octagon control was clearly in his favor, IMO. Oh well... not the first time that two people have seen a fight totally differently... It seemed that a lot of Atlanta thought Brown won as well, though. Well there was the tiime period where his face looked like a bright red tomato. IMHO, I think fan support for Brown had a lot to do with him fighting a lesser known foreigner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted September 7, 2008 Author Share Posted September 7, 2008 Giving up your back doesn't necessarily mean you lose the round, especially if Brown felt he was in control the entire time, which it certainly appeared he did. The entire first round, even though his opponent was firmly attached to his back, Brown appeared to be in total control and in no danger of being submitted or suffering any "damage." I thought Brown completely dictated the entire sequence of events, with him getting cut in the last couple of minutes being the only exception. Octagon control was clearly in his favor, IMO. Oh well... not the first time that two people have seen a fight totally differently... It seemed that a lot of Atlanta thought Brown won as well, though. Jiu Jitsu and Wrestling teach you to never give up your back, if you do, escape to a better position. You don't dictate anything from that position and you're basically trying to get out of that. Saying that, Matt Brown did not have dominant position at that point. I can see how some would think Brown won, but with everything I've seen in my classes and time watching MMA I thought the decision was accurate. And as far as Atlanta thinking Matt Brown won... Those are also the clowns that boo fighters for grappling and couldn't tell you the difference between a Kimura and a heel lock. They only like knockouts and standing and banging. The fans had their minds made up whenever they found out that the cool guy from TUF was fighting a guy from South Korea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopher Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 I would agree that you can't really control the fight while someone has your back. I guess my point was that Brown certainly didn't seem to be in "panic" mode while Kim had his back. He was calm and didn't seem phased by it at all. I thought it seemed that, once Kim no longer had his back, Brown was in control of the majority of the rest of the fight. My original post was simply stating that I hoped the decision wasn't swayed too much by the cut Brown suffered, which was pretty much meaningless, but very noticeable, obviously. As far as Atlanta goes, I wasn't necessarily talking about the fans only... Joe Rogan seemed somewhat surprised as well. Even Kim's reaction to the decision was one of surprise... His team looked pleasantly shocked, like they thought they had stolen the decision. I agree that it was close, but no way Kim won that fight easily. Other than hanging from Brown's back for 2-3 minutes (during which time Brown didn't appear to look threatened in the least), he really did NOTHING...little damage and no danger of finishing the fight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopher Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 Well there was the tiime period where his face looked like a bright red tomato. IMHO, I think fan support for Brown had a lot to do with him fighting a lesser known foreigner. Yeah, but blood is overrated. That cut was a non-factor and the fight was not in danger of being stopped by a doctor, etc. That was kind of my point, actually, his face LOOKED bad to the fans, but Kim really did very little to no damage to Brown. He attached himself to Brown's back at the beginning, but never threatened to choke Brown out or submit him in any way. The cut was not a true reflection of how much (or in this case, how little) damage Kim was able to do to Brown. Not much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziachild007 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 Yeah, but blood is overrated. That cut was a non-factor and the fight was not in danger of being stopped by a doctor, etc. That was kind of my point, actually, his face LOOKED bad to the fans, but Kim really did very little to no damage to Brown. He attached himself to Brown's back at the beginning, but never threatened to choke Brown out or submit him in any way. The cut was not a true reflection of how much (or in this case, how little) damage Kim was able to do to Brown. Not much. I wasn't talking about the blood. I was talking about his face turning red from the choke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 I was also very unimpressed with Dan Henderson. He was going up against an absolute beast of a BJJ guy, but he just looks different from the former Pride Champ that I grew used to seeing... He is in his late 30's and looks like he's starting to wind down quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted September 8, 2008 Share Posted September 8, 2008 A few thoughts - Palhares is gonna be an absolute beast at 205 - Hendo should be happy to just get outta there with the W - Matt Brown - got to the sports bar a bit late and missed rd1 - typical crowd was pissed that he didn't get the decision but it sounds like the Korean won rd 1 - tough break Liddell just is too exposed, and his hands have slowed to the point he can't just stand there looking for the big right hand - we all saw how much faster Evans hands were - really hoping he has one last run in him- but holy chit was that a brutal knockout Griifin/Evans will be an interesting matchup - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratesownninjas Posted September 8, 2008 Author Share Posted September 8, 2008 A few thoughts - Palhares is gonna be an absolute beast at 205 - Hendo should be happy to just get outta there with the W - Matt Brown - got to the sports bar a bit late and missed rd1 - typical crowd was pissed that he didn't get the decision but it sounds like the Korean won rd 1 - tough break Liddell just is too exposed, and his hands have slowed to the point he can't just stand there looking for the big right hand - we all saw how much faster Evans hands were - really hoping he has one last run in him- but holy chit was that a brutal knockout Griifin/Evans will be an interesting matchup - He's a monster, if he can develop any kind of stand up he could be devestating. I talked to a few of the brown belts/black belts at my gym, who are also the professional fighters at my gym about the Brown fight and the majority thought Matt Brown lost the first... You can't give that kind of position that easily. I think Matt Brown is a tough guy, but I think he'll never be more than what he is right now... Just a guy that fights tough and will win about half his fights. As far as Liddell, I think he lost because of game planning. Liddell was beat by Jardine because Jardine had the game plan. Chuck is a counter striker who waits for opponents to come at him with the fight. Whenever someone counters him by using the same game plan he gets frustrated. Jardine and Evans work out together, and who better to help you train than the last guy that beat him. Evans was patient and made Liddell push the fight. His cockyness and flashyness I think also frustrated Chuck and made him make a mistake. Evans is just the next generation of fighter and guys that rely on one thing are going to get beat more often then not. Chuck comes from a wrestling background, but when was the last time he used it? I think it shows that you can't be one deminsional in this sport anymore. Yes, Chuck has one of the best, if not the best sprawl in MMA, but that and just banging doesn't work anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt Ryan Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 Chuck didnt respect Evans, and Evans was disappointing except for that one punch. Evans clearly countered with everything he had, and it landed flush. Game over for anyone on the planet if they are hit that hard in that spot. I dont think Chuck is done, but clearly he has trouble with fighters who rely on the same technique he does, and that is to just counter. Rampage kicked his ass twice, and Evans I wouldnt say kicked his ass, but clearly caught him. Chuck was winning that fight in my opinion before that bomb landed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheikYerbuti Posted September 9, 2008 Share Posted September 9, 2008 The way he was knocked out was just amazing and scary to watch. I've seen some big knockouts in my short time watching UFC, but that one was just wicked looking. I don't know if Chuck can comeback from a loss like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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