In Wisconsin News Today

[Ursa Majoris]

Well then with your logic I guess anything goes - these fake Dems are OK because it was the recalls that led to this tactic - the recalls are OK because it came as a result of Walker going too fast - the senators leaving is OK because the repubs did not work together enough - what Walker is doing is ok because of the 80's and on and on and on.

 

I guess you can argue where it all started but Walker was elected and is doing things that may get his butt booted but all the crap happening in between is nonsense - he was elected to a term and should get that time - these senators were elected to terms and should get the time they deserve - this is a crock of crap and if it was the other way around the liberals would be screaming bloody murder.

I was trying to make a point about how these things happen. It is because no-one looks far enough ahead. This in turn leads to volatility because by the time change is finally inevitable, it is much more violent than it needed to be. And, yes, that is an admission that much of what Walker is trying to do is absolutely needed. It's just very unfortunate that due to time compression it's going to be so painful.

 

I guess this should lead to a discussion on term lengths but that's for another thread.....

[caddyman]

I was trying to make a point about how these things happen. It is because no-one looks far enough ahead. This in turn leads to volatility because by the time change is finally inevitable, it is much more violent than it needed to be.

 

This is exactly what I was saying during the healthcare debate. Teh dems did not care to share the contents of the bill with the puiblic and rammed it down our throats. They paid the price. So will the Wisc repubs.

[WaterMan]

My best friend WAS an employee at Facebook. He is 41 years old and is now retired. I guess he is just one of those evil rich people. Man that company is just downright evil and treats people horribly!!

 

Facebook isn't making enough money to be evil and they aren't a necessity.

 

When they start buying off politicians, let me know.

[tosberg34]

This is exactly what I was saying during the healthcare debate. Teh dems did not care to share the contents of the bill with the puiblic and rammed it down our throats. They paid the price. So will the Wisc repubs.

 

I disagree with you here caddyman. I think the recall elections are going to very disappointing AGAIN for Democrats. In fact, I predict they actually lose a seat or two.

 

What makes me think this? Well, they've been getting their butts handed to them since last November. First the dems thought the protests and bad behavior would be the silver bullet to turn things around - wrong. Then they though fleeing like cowards would be the silver bullet to turn things around - wrong again. Then they thought the courts would be the silver bullet (for the budget repair bill) - oh so wrong. Then they thought that removing prosser from the SC was the silver bullet - wrong on that too. Now the recall elections are the silver bullet? I'm not buying it. The WI taxpayers and those of sound mind will once again show the left that we can't support their brand of government anymore.

 

Nope, not buying it one bit.

[gbpfan1231]

I disagree with you here caddyman. I think the recall elections are going to very disappointing AGAIN for Democrats. In fact, I predict they actually lose a seat or two.

 

What makes me think this? Well, they've been getting their butts handed to them since last November. First the dems thought the protests and bad behavior would be the silver bullet to turn things around - wrong. Then they though fleeing like cowards would be the silver bullet to turn things around - wrong again. Then they thought the courts would be the silver bullet (for the budget repair bill) - oh so wrong. Then they thought that removing prosser from the SC was the silver bullet - wrong on that too. Now the recall elections are the silver bullet? I'm not buying it. The WI taxpayers and those of sound mind will once again show the left that we can't support their brand of government anymore.

 

Nope, not buying it one bit.

I think you are wrong - I think the repubs are in trouble. Like I said before I hope all incumbents win.

[gbpfan1231]

 

If Walker was so beloved, then why would there be enough signatures and support for a recall? If they lose, I guess that they DONT represent their districts very well, now do they? Two results out of this

 

1.) The republicans get recalled, and the will o the people prevails. It also shows that people are upset with the ham-handed way this whole situation was handled.

 

2.) The republicans win, and then Walker gets a boost by acceptance of his agenda at the polls again.

 

But being against a recall election just because "your" party might lose seats is hilarious. It is part of the political process, and really isnt all that easy to do. You REALLY need a lot of support to initiate and execute a recall of an elected official. Being this far along means there is a LOT of unhappy people . . and that goes for the Dems that are up for recall as well.

 

I still think that if Walker actually campaigned on ending collective bargaining, then he never gets elected.

You kind of made my point by doing every thing you can to just nit pick things to argue - You say if Walker was so beloved - these recall elections are for people NOT named Walker. You really think that the idea of a recall election was for this purpose? No it was not. They are using recall elections for reasons that recalls were not intended to do.

 

Where did I say that I am against a recall election just because my party may lose? Reaching for straws here to make an argument - do relatives avoid you at family gatherings? relative: "It sure is nice out today" BP: "No it's not - let's argue"

 

I am not sure if they have recall elections similar to this for federal govt but would it be OK to try and recall Obama or other dems when people were upset with Obamacare? No you wait it out and let time go by to see if Obama can succeed - if after 4 years he does then fine reelect him.

 

Do you seriously think these recalls are appropriate?

[bpwallace49]

You kind of made my point by doing every thing you can to just nit pick things to argue - You say if Walker was so beloved - these recall elections are for people NOT named Walker. You really think that the idea of a recall election was for this purpose? No it was not. They are using recall elections for reasons that recalls were not intended to do.

 

Where did I say that I am against a recall election just because my party may lose? Reaching for straws here to make an argument - do relatives avoid you at family gatherings? relative: "It sure is nice out today" BP: "No it's not - let's argue"

 

I am not sure if they have recall elections similar to this for federal govt but would it be OK to try and recall Obama or other dems when people were upset with Obamacare? No you wait it out and let time go by to see if Obama can succeed - if after 4 years he does then fine reelect him.

 

Do you seriously think these recalls are appropriate?

 

Cmon gbpfan . . try to keep up. The Walker comment was in reference to his AGENDA. In reference to them eliminating collective bargaining while not mentioning it at all during his campaign. They cant go after any elected official that has been in office les than a year, so they are going after anyone they can. Unless Walker starts mending bridges then he will be next on the recall schedule in 2012.

 

People are also going after Democrat lawmakers becasue they are pissed that they left the state to stall passage of the bill. AGAIN, that is their right to do so.

 

You need something like over 12,000 signatures from people in their voting district to initiate a recall for whatever reason you like. How easy do you think it is to get over 12,000 signatures? I trhink some had over 20 thousand!!

 

I absolutely think that if a majority of the voters feel that that a local politician is not representing their best interests they have the right, if not OBLIGATION to do something about it. People feel strongly enoughly about the Dem senators leaving that they got a SHAM WOW!load of signatures to recall them. People also feel strongly enough about the Repub senators not acting in their best interests that they got a SHAM WOW!load of signatures to recall. Keep in mind that this is a part of the legislative process and a way for local citizens to get rid of a politican that is making decison not in line with what they said they were going to do. Then that bar is set high enough that it is pretty damn hard to recall someone. and they STILL got enough signatures!

 

I am all for people exercising their civic duty and making their voices heard. The more people get involved in the political process instead of sitting on their damn hands and do nothing the better.

[gbpfan1231]

Cmon gbpfan . . try to keep up. The Walker comment was in reference to his AGENDA. In reference to them eliminating collective bargaining while not mentioning it at all during his campaign. They cant go after any elected official that has been in office les than a year, so they are going after anyone they can. Unless Walker starts mending bridges then he will be next on the recall schedule in 2012.

 

People are also going after Democrat lawmakers becasue they are pissed that they left the state to stall passage of the bill. AGAIN, that is their right to do so.

 

You need something like over 12,000 signatures from people in their voting district to initiate a recall for whatever reason you like. How easy do you think it is to get over 12,000 signatures? I trhink some had over 20 thousand!!

 

I absolutely think that if a majority of the voters feel that that a local politician is not representing their best interests they have the right, if not OBLIGATION to do something about it. People feel strongly enoughly about the Dem senators leaving that they got a SHAM WOW!load of signatures to recall them. People also feel strongly enough about the Repub senators not acting in their best interests that they got a SHAM WOW!load of signatures to recall. Keep in mind that this is a part of the legislative process and a way for local citizens to get rid of a politican that is making decison not in line with what they said they were going to do. Then that bar is set high enough that it is pretty damn hard to recall someone. and they STILL got enough signatures!

 

I am all for people exercising their civic duty and making their voices heard. The more people get involved in the political process instead of sitting on their damn hands and do nothing the better.

You again make my point - you say they are going after anyone they can - in my opinion that is wrong on both sides - the Dems leaving the state was WRONG - worthy of recalling them - not in my mind - when the next general election comes then oust them if possible - same with the repubs - going after anyone they can because of what Walker is trying to do is not right in my opinion.

 

We can be done - there is no way to ever get you to agree on anything anyway.

[bpwallace49]

You again make my point - you say they are going after anyone they can - in my opinion that is wrong on both sides - the Dems leaving the state was WRONG - worthy of recalling them - not in my mind - when the next general election comes then oust them if possible - same with the repubs - going after anyone they can because of what Walker is trying to do is not right in my opinion.

 

We can be done - there is no way to ever get you to agree on anything anyway.

 

So you think NO MATTER WHAT, once someone gets elected, they can do whatever SHAM WOW! they want to without any worry or care in the world until the next election?

 

Keep in mind they need over 12,000 signatures minimum. That is just to start the recall. This is by no meansa trivial or small undertaking to try and execute.

 

Arent you the one that speaks out AGAINST "tenure" and guaranteed employment for teachers? But an elected politican should get the equivalent of a 6 year contract EVEN IF they completely act out against what their "bosses/constituents" want? Interesting . . . . not OK for teachers, but OK for politicians. Got it.

[gbpfan1231]

So you think NO MATTER WHAT, once someone gets elected, they can do whatever SHAM WOW! they want to without any worry or care in the world until the next election?

 

Keep in mind they need over 12,000 signatures minimum. That is just to start the recall. This is by no meansa trivial or small undertaking to try and execute.

 

Arent you the one that speaks out AGAINST "tenure" and guaranteed employment for teachers? But an elected politican should get the equivalent of a 6 year contract EVEN IF they completely act out against what their "bosses/constituents" want? Interesting . . . . not OK for teachers, but OK for politicians. Got it.

My god you are as dense as you are arrogant.

 

Where did I say NO MATTER WHAT?? Please point that out. My god. You seriously think that a Dem leaving the state for a couple of weeks to slow down a vote is worthy of a special election to have that person recalled? I do not. If that same person is caught embezzling money or things like tax evasion - maybe a couple DUI's - burglary - etc then yes - serious dereliction of duties yes.

 

What did the repubs that are getting recalled do? They are voting for something they think is needed to get Wisconsin on track - OH MY GOD HOW DARE THEY - THEY ARE VOTING FOR WHAT THEY THINK THIS STATE NEEDS WE MUST RECALL!!!!

 

Quit making SHAM WOW! up like me saying NO MATTER WHAT - you sound like a fool.

Edited July 14, 2011 by gbpfan1231

[bpwallace49]

Arent you the one that speaks out AGAINST "tenure" and guaranteed employment for teachers? But an elected politican should get the equivalent of a 6 year contract EVEN IF they completely act out against what their "bosses/constituents" want? Interesting . . . . not OK for teachers, but OK for politicians. Got it

 

Still waiting for an answer here sweetheart . . . . you think that politicians should just wait until the next election cycle except for . . . what was it again?

If that same person is caught embezzling money or things like tax evasion - maybe a couple DUI's - burglary - etc then yes - serious dereliction of duties yes.

Thats it!

 

But teachers shouldnt get tenure . . . . why again? Werent you ranting about some teacher in Green Bay with a fellowship or some nonsense in a previous thread?

 

Obviously over 108,000 Wisconsinites that signed recall petitions disagree with you And for the republicans under recall, the ire is over voting away the collective bargaining rights without any discussion or negotiation. It isnt just because they dont like Walker. They dont like his agenda that the GOP senators are following like the pied piper. Recalling the Democrat senators for stalling a vote is laughable too . . . but well within the rights of the people to do so.

 

I really dont think you understand how many people signed these petitions. This isnt a trivial undertaking, for either side. Such is the "f@#k you" politics now in America's Dairyland . . . .

[gbpfan1231]

Still waiting for an answer here sweetheart . . . . you think that politicians should just wait until the next election cycle except for . . . what was it again?

Thats it!

 

But teachers shouldnt get tenure . . . . why again? Werent you ranting about some teacher in Green Bay with a fellowship or some nonsense in a previous thread?

 

Obviously over 108,000 Wisconsinites that signed recall petitions disagree with you And for the republicans under recall, the ire is over voting away the collective bargaining rights without any discussion or negotiation. It isnt just because they dont like Walker. They dont like his agenda that the GOP senators are following like the pied piper. Recalling the Democrat senators for stalling a vote is laughable too . . . but well within the rights of the people to do so.

 

I really dont think you understand how many people signed these petitions. This isnt a trivial undertaking, for either side. Such is the "f@#k you" politics now in America's Dairyland . . . .

Still waiting for answer?? You are comparing a teacher to a state senator and comparing a 6 year term to Tenure? Not the same thing.

 

I guess according to BP recall elections should be held every year and can be for any reason. Gotcha BP!!!

[caddyman]

Still waiting for answer?? You are comparing a teacher to a state senator and comparing a 6 year term to Tenure? Not the same thing.

 

I guess according to BP recall elections should be held every year and can be for any reason. Gotcha BP!!!

 

 

Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

[TimC]

Are we certain we can't sell Wisconsin to Canada for some trinkets and beads?

 

Tell 'em we'll throw in Illinois and Michigan for free.

Edited July 14, 2011 by TimC

[WaterMan]

The GOP is really making friends with the voters.

 

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/13/9...ing-drops-to-37

 

Overall, do you approve or disapprove of the way Scott Walker is handling his job as Governor of Wisconsin?

Approve: 37

Disapprove: 55

 

Ouch. This is the lowest approval rating for Walker found in any poll to date. While Walker is not, sadly, on the ballot in the recalls, these numbers do suggest an increasingly difficult political environment for all Republicans in Wisconsin.

 

Other notable findings from the poll:

 

60% disapprove of the way the State Legislature is handling its job.

56% disapprove of the job Republicans in the State Legislature are doing.

48% disapprove of the job Democrats in the State Legislature are doing.

 

Wisconsinites overwhelming think the recall option in the state constitution is a good thing (78%), and 50% said the current recalls of state senators made them feel better about Wisconsin politics.

59% of residents statewide preferred that the Democratic state senators remain in office rather than be recalled and 49% said the same of the Republican state senators.

Edited July 14, 2011 by WaterMan

[TimC]

The GOP is really making friends with the voters.

 

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/13/9...ing-drops-to-37

 

Overall, do you approve or disapprove of the way Scott Walker is handling his job as Governor of Wisconsin?

Approve: 37

Disapprove: 55

 

Ouch. This is the lowest approval rating for Walker found in any poll to date. While Walker is not, sadly, on the ballot in the recalls, these numbers do suggest an increasingly difficult political environment for all Republicans in Wisconsin.

 

Other notable findings from the poll:

 

60% disapprove of the way the State Legislature is handling its job.

56% disapprove of the job Republicans in the State Legislature are doing.

48% disapprove of the job Democrats in the State Legislature are doing.

 

Wisconsinites overwhelming think the recall option in the state constitution is a good thing (78%), and 50% said the current recalls of state senators made them feel better about Wisconsin politics.

59% of residents statewide preferred that the Democratic state senators remain in office rather than be recalled and 49% said the same of the Republican state senators.

 

Yes. Democrats will save you.

[bpwallace49]

I guess according to BP recall elections should be held every year and can be for any reason. Gotcha BP!!!

 

You need an overwhelming amount of signatures to initate a recall. This is not a trivial undertaking. You have to have MASSIVE support to initate a recall. If the citizens exercise their civic duty by withdrawing support for politicans that they feel are not acting in their best interests, you are saying that you are opposed to that?

[bpwallace49]

The GOP is really making friends with the voters.

 

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/13/9...ing-drops-to-37

 

Overall, do you approve or disapprove of the way Scott Walker is handling his job as Governor of Wisconsin?

Approve: 37

Disapprove: 55

 

Ouch. This is the lowest approval rating for Walker found in any poll to date. While Walker is not, sadly, on the ballot in the recalls, these numbers do suggest an increasingly difficult political environment for all Republicans in Wisconsin.

 

Other notable findings from the poll:

 

60% disapprove of the way the State Legislature is handling its job.

56% disapprove of the job Republicans in the State Legislature are doing.

48% disapprove of the job Democrats in the State Legislature are doing.

 

Wisconsinites overwhelming think the recall option in the state constitution is a good thing (78%), and 50% said the current recalls of state senators made them feel better about Wisconsin politics. 59% of residents statewide preferred that the Democratic state senators remain in office rather than be recalled and 49% said the same of the Republican state senators.

 

 

That says it all . . .

 

The recalls will really showcase whether or not Wisconsin voter endorse Walker's agenda/tactics or oppose it.

[bpwallace49]

Republicans ran fake Democrats, calling them protest candidates, to delay the recall elections that were organized against six GOP senators for their support of Gov. Scott Walker's legislation ending most collective bargaining by public employees. The Journal Sentinel has reported that those elections - which were won Tuesday by the real Democrats - cost an estimated $475,000.

[gbpfan1231]

Hey BP - don't think anyone is really arguing that the fake Dems was a good move.

 

Wonder what the recount for Klappenburg cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of fleeing dems to Illinois cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of paying teachers sick pay to hop off to Madison cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of security for the protests in Madison cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of repairs were to the Capitol?

[bpwallace49]

Hey BP - don't think anyone is really arguing that the fake Dems was a good move.

 

Wonder what the recount for Klappenburg cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of fleeing dems to Illinois cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of paying teachers sick pay to hop off to Madison cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of security for the protests in Madison cost?

 

Wonder what the cost of repairs were to the Capitol?

 

Straight from Sykes/ Belling

 

Do you have an original thought in your mind?

 

Recount was under 5% . . . and absolutely allowed and even necessary with the "glitch" with Prossers former employee.

 

Cost of fleeing Dems? Really? How is that a "cost"?

 

Sick pay I completey agree, and stated when it was happening that it was irresponsible.

 

Protest? Maybe that shows how poorly Walker handled this from the get go?

[gbpfan1231]

Straight from Sykes/ Belling

 

Do you have an original thought in your mind?

 

Recount was under 5% . . . and absolutely allowed and even necessary with the "glitch" with Prossers former employee.

 

Cost of fleeing Dems? Really? How is that a "cost"?

 

Sick pay I completey agree, and stated when it was happening that it was irresponsible.

 

Protest? Maybe that shows how poorly Walker handled this from the get go?

Man - you really think you are a smart smart guy don't you.

 

What do you mean straight from Sykes/Belling? What does that mean? I already told you I have never listened to Sykes - Belling was not on today and my comments had nothing to do with Belling. Would you quit pulling crap out of your a$$.

 

Yes the recount was under 5% - Yes it was allowed - so were running fake dems so why did you bring it up then? oh yea you are a typical liberal hypocrite.

 

So the protest is OK even though it had costs but the fake dems (which was ok) is not - please explain your logic.

 

I admit I am partisan when it comes to republicans - the sad part is that you try to come across as some non-partisan smart guy that has all the answers.

[Yukon Cornelius]

Straight from Sykes/ Belling

 

 

Sick pay I completey agree, and stated when it was happening that it was irresponsible.

the teachers i know that called in sick were fined 2 days pay for that day. some were fined 14 days pay

[bpwallace49]

Yes the recount was under 5% - Yes it was allowed - so were running fake dems so why did you bring it up then? So the protest is OK even though it had costs but the fake dems (which was ok) is not - please explain your logic.

 

I admit I am partisan when it comes to republicans

 

Wasting almost half a million bucks seems rather hypocritical from the party that has taken the position that "we are broke, so lets cut back teachers"

 

If they actually WERE fiscally responsible, would running fake candiates that were expected to lose be fiscally responsible? Hmm . . that sounds like the OPPOSITE of being fiscally responsible!

 

The Shenanigans with the supreme court vote all but guaranteed a recount. If that never happened and Klop STILL wanted a recount, then it would be wasteful. But the crap that happened with the "found" votes all but guaranteed a recount. That has basis and foundation. How does running purposefully fake candidates when it wastes almost half a million bucks have any backing?

 

You are partisan when it comes to republicans? No way!

[tosberg34]

the teachers i know that called in sick were fined 2 days pay for that day. some were fined 14 days pay

 

Good, but they should have been fired.