Ronald Reagan

[BeeR]

Apparently you aren't smart enough to understand what he wrote.

Capt Obvious to the rescue. ya think? Maybe it was all those multi-syllable words.

 

Proverbs 22:10 I still can't see you.

For someone unable to see someone else, that's some fine shootin. What a bloodbath. You can actually see bits n pieces of these idiots scattered about the floor.

[evil_gop_liars]

That was my first thought also. Apparently he wasn't clever enough to figure out he set his own trap in his desperate desire to throw an unsolicited barb in my direction.

 

Stop putting McBoob in a box and labeling him...who are you the USPS.

[WaterMan]

Apparently you aren't smart enough to understand what he wrote. This little Reagan game is already stale. Times are completely different than they were in the 80's. You know that and so do your little boyfriends.

 

Yeah America is almost a 3rd world country now.

[bushwacked]

Maybe it was all those multi-syllable words.

 

Yer unwarranted personal attack has devastated my feelings. Yer high 5ing of the tailgate troll brigade has shaken my pride. Should I go whining to the mods, like you have made a habit of doing lately?

[WaterMan]

Big boys don't cry over the internet.

[bushwacked]

Stop putting McBoob in a box and labeling him...who are you the USPS.

 

 

Apparently I'm the postmaster general. And McDrama has made a couple short posts as late. So apparently we thank the same lord.

[Ditkaless Wonders]

OK

 

Here goes:

 

Never voted for Reagan. Didn't vote for Obama. I am not affiliated with the tea party. Does that help?

 

You and I will never have an honest dialogue because I am way too far out of your comfort level. You are not able to put me in a box with a label on it so that you can attack my positions with your secret decoder ring talking points.

 

Until you can pull out the jar with me in it that has "Christian, Conservative, Tea Party Hack" or some other mundane classification handwritten in Sharpie pen that makes you think you know where I stand so you feel comfortable bringing out that appropriate sub-set of talking points, all you will ever be able to do is call me names and denigrate me. Its OK, I understand completely. People like me frustrate the crap out of you. I still love you man!

 

I have NEVER been pleased with ANY president, or politician in my lifetime. There are some things that I agree with on many issues, but I passionately disagree with all of them on other issues. The closest I could say that my "politics" lie would be a JFK Democrat. But even he was VERY inexperienced for the job and made some horrendous foreign policy errors (which is being relived to today with our current POTUS). The biggest problem with politicians is that they are politicians. They are self-defeating, especially the career ones.

 

You see, I am a pragmatist. I do my best to remove all emotion when analysing the world around me and deciding a course of action, without losing my ability to empathise or be compassionate. I believe greatly in the principles of self-reliance and personal accountability. I don't want anything given to me I didn't earn and don't believe others should EXPECT that either. I use my faith to try to help me along the way, but as a human, I am imperfect and will fall many times. I am not right on everything, but there are some problems that do not have perfect solutions, only consequences for the actions we take to "fix" them.

 

So, you want an explanation? I stand by my statement. It is dogmatically convenient for Bushwacked to accept the words of Reagan now in the current political context, when he wouldn't have then. You guys seem to be very "liberal" in your application of the concept of hypocrisy when applied to people on "your team", but are the first to chastise your "enemies" to the highest order when caught in their own hypocrisy. Politicians, by nature are hypocrites and neither side gets a pass on this one!

 

The pragmatic reality: Our government is broken and spends more than it takes in. That has to stop. If we can't agree on that pragmatic reality, then the conversation is over. Move along.

 

Both sides are completely disingenuous in this whole debt ceiling fiasco. The pragmatic reality is that it has to be raised right now. The pragmatic reality is that it is an atrocity that it has to be raised at all!

 

Many people will be hurt by trying to fix what must be fixed. Just look at Wisconsin and the Greekesque side show we got out of that. We'll fix it as long as it doesn't effect us personally. As a Federal government employee, we have already taken a salary hit and they are talking about more, much more. Forget benefits in the equation, I am talking a 10% plus reduction in salary. Once you are budgeted (which families have to do, why not our government) for a certain monthly expenditure, 10% or more is a hard hit and it will be even tougher on us. I am not happy about these cuts in my earnings, but accept it as part of the fix if that is what is needed, tighten my belt and move on. Now if in the end, they use that money saved for more spending elsewhere, I am gonna be really pissed! If they balance the budget and that is part of what was needed, I did my part, as unpleasant as it was. I was talking to a teacher from Wisconsin visiting family here just after the whole thing up there was over. She was POed. I mean this was one angry woman. We compared her benefits, post "raping" (as she put it) with my fed employee benefits. Her's were STILL superior to mine. I would have loved to have her benefits over mine as a Fed. She was shocked and I think felt a little better about what had happened. (Remember. Federal employees are forbidden by law to have collective bargaining).

 

The sad truth is that the politicians and the press (yes, Fox news included) are not telling the whole truth. What happens today with all the proposals and the "ten year predictions" is all Bull sh!t! The next congress, and the one after that and so on, are not beholden to anything and can change the rules when the next budget is passed. We are NOT talking about a spending budget right now. We are talking about a nebulous idea of reducing spending while raising our own credit card limit. There are three different animals going on, only loosely tied to each other. Budget, Debt, Entitlements.

 

The only meaningful budget cuts and entitlement reforms will be those done NOW, not ten years from now. And unless we force our government to make these cuts yearly, until the budget is finally balanced, then we are heading down the sh!tter, all of us together.... Weeeeeeeeeeeeee.

 

Both sides of the Washington elite (those politicians that have been there just too dang long ,like Ried, McCain, Durbin, etc.) are terrified of a Balanced Budget Amendment. They don't want to stop over spending "now", but know it has to happen "in the future". They are all out of touch. And forget the pandering of "being in or out of touch with the American People". They are out of touch with the pragmatic realities that face them.

 

A pragmatist will tell you that there is no time like the present. He will also tell you that it is going to be painful.

 

 

 

The responses to this post, and more tellingly the non-responses to this post, could not have been more predictable.

[Ursa Majoris]

The responses to this post, and more tellingly the non-responses to this post, could not have been more predictable.

How so? It looks to me like more of the same.

[McBoog]

The responses to this post, and more tellingly the non-responses to this post, could not have been more predictable.

 

How? The premise was that Reagan was/is my God. God is my God.

 

I never voted for Reagan. I am not affiliated with the Tea Party. I can't answer a question that I have no base from which to answer.

 

Why not throw down an answer to my question first?

 

What merit is there in a juvenile, "Oh yeah well but YOOOOOOOOU, blah blah!" , when the "blah blah" doesn't even apply"?

 

It is called deflecting. There is no attemp to have conversation, because you can't. It is designed to back off your "adversary" without ever having to present any meaningful ideas. The very pinnacle of your intellectual dishonesty. I don't allow my children to get away with it and I certainly don't allow other adults to use this tactic on me either.

 

Just because you THINK you are smarter than everyone in the room, only shows your insecurity and arrogance.

 

The, "I don't have to answer to your questions because you are beneath me to do so." arrogance of the left no longer plays. All it does is show how shallow and lemmingish the vast majority of the left truly is. I have a greater variety of disagreements with people on the far right than I do with those on the left. The reason is that it is always the same argument with the lefties, usually ending up with, "Well, you are {place disparaging, accusatory remark designed to try to put me in a defensive posture here}!" and they walk away all smug thinking they "won".

 

One on one, without their fellow mind clones to point fingers and disparage along with them, they fold like rice paper in any real discussion.

 

The worst thing is that too many of the right/conservatives get sucked into the pettiness and name-calling out of frustration (and yes, some are just as prone to dissolve into this immediately, especially with those they know that they will never be able to talk to). This lowers the entire conversation and never gets anything done. See? Just like Washington DC and those here in The Tailgate. I used to do this with Skins and a few of the old/banned guys because I thought it was mostly playing. It has been taken to a new, real and ugly level by you people and I won't get sucked into it.

 

Feelings never win over pragmatism. Sorry, Thanks for playing though!

[Ursa Majoris]

How? The premise was that Reagan was/is my God. God is my God.

 

I never voted for Reagan. I am not affiliated with the Tea Party. I can't answer a question that I have no base from which to answer.

 

Why not throw down an answer to my question first?

 

What merit is there in a juvenile, "Oh yeah well but YOOOOOOOOU, blah blah!" , when the "blah blah" doesn't even apply"?

 

It is called deflecting. There is no attemp to have conversation, because you can't. It is designed to back off your "adversary" without ever having to present any meaningful ideas. The very pinnacle of your intellectual dishonesty. I don't allow my children to get away with it and I certainly don't allow other adults to use this tactic on me either.

 

Just because you THINK you are smarter than everyone in the room, only shows your insecurity and arrogance.

 

The, "I don't have to answer to your questions because you are beneath me to do so." arrogance of the left no longer plays. All it does is show how shallow and lemmingish the vast majority of the left truly is. I have a greater variety of disagreements with people on the far right than I do with those on the left. The reason is that it is always the same argument with the lefties, usually ending up with, "Well, you are {place disparaging, accusatory remark designed to try to put me in a defensive posture here}!" and they walk away all smug thinking they "won".

 

One on one, without their fellow mind clones to point fingers and disparage along with them, they fold like rice paper in any real discussion.

 

The worst thing is that too many of the right/conservatives get sucked into the pettiness and name-calling out of frustration (and yes, some are just as prone to dissolve into this immediately, especially with those they know that they will never be able to talk to). This lowers the entire conversation and never gets anything done. See? Just like Washington DC and those here in The Tailgate. I used to do this with Skins and a few of the old/banned guys because I thought it was mostly playing. It has been taken to a new, real and ugly level by you people and I won't get sucked into it.

 

Feelings never win over pragmatism. Sorry, Thanks for playing though!

Um.......he's actually supporting you.

[McBoog]

Um.......he's actually supporting you.

 

Haven't been sleeping well. I digressed into talking to you.

 

BTW

 

Good point in the other thread!

[bushwacked]

Um.......he's actually supporting you.

 

[SheikYerbuti]

God is my Reagan.

[Ditkaless Wonders]

How? The premise was that Reagan was/is my God. God is my God.

 

I never voted for Reagan. I am not affiliated with the Tea Party. I can't answer a question that I have no base from which to answer.

 

Why not throw down an answer to my question first?

 

What merit is there in a juvenile, "Oh yeah well but YOOOOOOOOU, blah blah!" , when the "blah blah" doesn't even apply"?

 

It is called deflecting. There is no attemp to have conversation, because you can't. It is designed to back off your "adversary" without ever having to present any meaningful ideas. The very pinnacle of your intellectual dishonesty. I don't allow my children to get away with it and I certainly don't allow other adults to use this tactic on me either.

 

Just because you THINK you are smarter than everyone in the room, only shows your insecurity and arrogance.

 

The, "I don't have to answer to your questions because you are beneath me to do so." arrogance of the left no longer plays. All it does is show how shallow and lemmingish the vast majority of the left truly is. I have a greater variety of disagreements with people on the far right than I do with those on the left. The reason is that it is always the same argument with the lefties, usually ending up with, "Well, you are {place disparaging, accusatory remark designed to try to put me in a defensive posture here}!" and they walk away all smug thinking they "won".

 

One on one, without their fellow mind clones to point fingers and disparage along with them, they fold like rice paper in any real discussion.

 

The worst thing is that too many of the right/conservatives get sucked into the pettiness and name-calling out of frustration (and yes, some are just as prone to dissolve into this immediately, especially with those they know that they will never be able to talk to). This lowers the entire conversation and never gets anything done. See? Just like Washington DC and those here in The Tailgate. I used to do this with Skins and a few of the old/banned guys because I thought it was mostly playing. It has been taken to a new, real and ugly level by you people and I won't get sucked into it.

 

Feelings never win over pragmatism. Sorry, Thanks for playing though!

 

 

You mistook my meaning. That is my fault as I was not clear. I was not speaking of the responses in the thread in general to the original post, but rather to your specific post. It was clear to me that when you stated your position clearly, reasonably, and without rancor that it would not draw reasoned replys, but rather ridicule or nonresponse.

 

I apologize for my lack of clarity.

[Ditkaless Wonders]

Um.......he's actually supporting you.

 

 

Well if not him, at least I was supporting well written postings. He offers his points clearly, articulately, and without rancor. I suspect I could find common ground with him in many matters. I suspect he would be more or less tolerant of me in most matters. I do not share his faith in God. I do share his belief that persons need to take responsibility for their own lives to the extent they can. I do not know if he would agree with me that many people do not know the extent to which they could care for themselves having become habitually lazy and dependant.

 

All in all he seems a very reasonable fellow.

[Ditkaless Wonders]

God is my Reagan.

 

 

Reagan is dead.

 

 

 

Therefore .......

[McBoog]

Well if not him, at least I was supporting well written postings. He offers his points clearly, articulately, and without rancor. I suspect I could find common ground with him in many matters. I suspect he would be more or less tolerant of me in most matters. I do not share his faith in God. I do share his belief that persons need to take responsibility for their own lives to the extent they can. I do not know if he would agree with me that many people do not know the extent to which they could care for themselves having become habitually lazy and dependant.

 

All in all he seems a very reasonable fellow.

 

Thanx!

 

WE have managed to destroy the American Indian, the American Eskimo and any semblance of properly preparing and integrating the African American populations in our short history as a nation that considers itself a "melting pot". The plight of these people remain one of the greatest embarassments we face as a people and a black eye on our principles of freedom and the American dream. It will be generations of slow, painful choices that will incrementally integrate and incorporate these people into "Modern American Society", honouring their traditions and individual sub-cultures while expecting them to contribute to the overall advancement of their own people and the nation as a whole.

 

To cut these people off in one fell swoop would be Draconian and only result in catastrophe for them and the Nation as a whole. The vast majority of these people have been enslaved by a society that would rather hide them and their issues rather than foster integrity and self-reliance. When you talk "safety net" this is one of the first places that has to be addressed. Some would prefer to keep them dependent on us and promise them everything free in return for their vote. They don't realize that by being totally dependent on the government, they are at the will of the government and have surrendered their freedom in exchange for cash and their vote.

 

Until we can all have an honest discussion about what needs to be done and how to wean these people off of their dependency, they are the victims that remain trapped and enslaved by their own inability to understand that they can make it for themselves. Their children, though born here, are born into a disadvantage because of this institutionalized culture of dependency. We always wonder why Habib can come to the US and in five years own three gas stations and a Cadillac, but our own people continue to languish in poverty. Habib had the perspective that he was not going to let society take care of him, he was inspired by the concept of the American Dream. As with too many issues we face in this country, "fixing" this is politically inconvenient to one of the major parties, and rhetoric rather than positive action will prevail. I know from personal experience that throwing money at the situation is a waste. Having taught in Watts for a few years, money was never the issue in my classroom with all the special programs. Accountability and tough love was missing. As a high school biology teacher, I was trying to teach 90% of my kids how to read and write while throwing a little biology in there. We have to be willing to fail children unable to pass minimum standards over and over again until they can truly advance. If this means some people don't graduate High School until they are 25, so be it. Then again, this is only a small sliver of the overall problem you speak about. If we are to provide public schooling, the society as a whole has failed itself and every child that "graduates" from High School unable to read the very diploma they are being handed. These children are being programmed right from the start to not worry about it because "they" will take care of it and you'll graduate to the next level, even if you didn't work for and earn it. What is overlooked is that there are a lot more white people on welfare than Black people (and I don't want to hear the proportion % to actual population representation crap). We are failing ALL of these people by allowing them this perpetual culture of dependency.

 

Currently, politics will never let us fix it.

 

My Dad (RIP) always used to tell me that for some problems there are no solutions, only consequences for the actions you take to move in a positive direction. The secret to success is consequence management.

 

I guess we agree on this?

 

Pragmatism+compassion+empathy.

[WaterMan]

If we had jobs for these people it would end the dependecy for some of them. But the trickle down stopped when Reagan died.

[Ditkaless Wonders]

If we had jobs for these people it would end the dependecy for some of them. But the trickle down stopped when Reagan died.

 

 

Maybe they should have found, trained for, or created through ingenuity, jobs for themselves.

[McBoog]

Maybe they should have found, trained for, or created through ingenuity, jobs for themselves.

 

This is exactly the difference between teaching them how, and doing it for them. Teach a man to fish...

[TimC]

Maybe they should have found, trained for, or created through ingenuity, jobs for themselves.

 

When the Gubment sends you a monthly check for nothing, why?

[Yukon Cornelius]

Maybe they should have found, trained for, or created through ingenuity, jobs for themselves.

[Ursa Majoris]

+

 

DW = The Huddle's Charles Krauthammer

[bpwallace49]

OK

 

Here goes:

 

Never voted for Reagan. Didn't vote for Obama. I am not affiliated with the tea party. Does that help?

 

You and I will never have an honest dialogue because I am way too far out of your comfort level. You are not able to put me in a box with a label on it so that you can attack my positions with your secret decoder ring talking points.

 

Until you can pull out the jar with me in it that has "Christian, Conservative, Tea Party Hack" or some other mundane classification handwritten in Sharpie pen that makes you think you know where I stand so you feel comfortable bringing out that appropriate sub-set of talking points, all you will ever be able to do is call me names and denigrate me. Its OK, I understand completely. People like me frustrate the crap out of you. I still love you man!

 

I have NEVER been pleased with ANY president, or politician in my lifetime. There are some things that I agree with on many issues, but I passionately disagree with all of them on other issues. The closest I could say that my "politics" lie would be a JFK Democrat. But even he was VERY inexperienced for the job and made some horrendous foreign policy errors (which is being relived to today with our current POTUS). The biggest problem with politicians is that they are politicians. They are self-defeating, especially the career ones.

 

You see, I am a pragmatist. I do my best to remove all emotion when analysing the world around me and deciding a course of action, without losing my ability to empathise or be compassionate. I believe greatly in the principles of self-reliance and personal accountability. I don't want anything given to me I didn't earn and don't believe others should EXPECT that either. I use my faith to try to help me along the way, but as a human, I am imperfect and will fall many times. I am not right on everything, but there are some problems that do not have perfect solutions, only consequences for the actions we take to "fix" them.

 

So, you want an explanation? I stand by my statement. It is dogmatically convenient for Bushwacked to accept the words of Reagan now in the current political context, when he wouldn't have then. You guys seem to be very "liberal" in your application of the concept of hypocrisy when applied to people on "your team", but are the first to chastise your "enemies" to the highest order when caught in their own hypocrisy. Politicians, by nature are hypocrites and neither side gets a pass on this one!

 

The pragmatic reality: Our government is broken and spends more than it takes in. That has to stop. If we can't agree on that pragmatic reality, then the conversation is over. Move along.

 

Both sides are completely disingenuous in this whole debt ceiling fiasco. The pragmatic reality is that it has to be raised right now. The pragmatic reality is that it is an atrocity that it has to be raised at all!

 

Many people will be hurt by trying to fix what must be fixed. Just look at Wisconsin and the Greekesque side show we got out of that. We'll fix it as long as it doesn't effect us personally. As a Federal government employee, we have already taken a salary hit and they are talking about more, much more. Forget benefits in the equation, I am talking a 10% plus reduction in salary. Once you are budgeted (which families have to do, why not our government) for a certain monthly expenditure, 10% or more is a hard hit and it will be even tougher on us. I am not happy about these cuts in my earnings, but accept it as part of the fix if that is what is needed, tighten my belt and move on. Now if in the end, they use that money saved for more spending elsewhere, I am gonna be really pissed! If they balance the budget and that is part of what was needed, I did my part, as unpleasant as it was. I was talking to a teacher from Wisconsin visiting family here just after the whole thing up there was over. She was POed. I mean this was one angry woman. We compared her benefits, post "raping" (as she put it) with my fed employee benefits. Her's were STILL superior to mine. I would have loved to have her benefits over mine as a Fed. She was shocked and I think felt a little better about what had happened. (Remember. Federal employees are forbidden by law to have collective bargaining).

 

The sad truth is that the politicians and the press (yes, Fox news included) are not telling the whole truth. What happens today with all the proposals and the "ten year predictions" is all Bull sh!t! The next congress, and the one after that and so on, are not beholden to anything and can change the rules when the next budget is passed. We are NOT talking about a spending budget right now. We are talking about a nebulous idea of reducing spending while raising our own credit card limit. There are three different animals going on, only loosely tied to each other. Budget, Debt, Entitlements.

 

The only meaningful budget cuts and entitlement reforms will be those done NOW, not ten years from now. And unless we force our government to make these cuts yearly, until the budget is finally balanced, then we are heading down the sh!tter, all of us together.... Weeeeeeeeeeeeee.

 

Both sides of the Washington elite (those politicians that have been there just too dang long ,like Ried, McCain, Durbin, etc.) are terrified of a Balanced Budget Amendment. They don't want to stop over spending "now", but know it has to happen "in the future". They are all out of touch. And forget the pandering of "being in or out of touch with the American People". They are out of touch with the pragmatic realities that face them.

 

A pragmatist will tell you that there is no time like the present. He will also tell you that it is going to be painful.

 

I like reading your posts McBoog . .seriously. But when you state about how impossible it is to put you in a box" and then speak out people that YOU have decided to . . . put in a "box" and label them, that doesnt exactly lend support to your self described pragmatic nature.

 

I really do enjoy your posts, as they are more eloquent and thoughtful than many others here that jump into the political debates.

[evil_gop_liars]

But when you state about how impossible it is to put you in a box" and then speak out people that YOU have decided to . . . put in a "box" and label them, that doesnt exactly lend support to your self described pragmatic nature.

 

Shhh!