tazinib1 Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 While Vick does not post top 10 stats through the air (just over 3kyards in 2010 with 21 TD's), his rushing numbers (676YDS WITH 9td's) are in the area of a low RB#2). I'm warming up to the idea of giving Vick a serious look in the 1st round. You get a QB and #2 RB with one swipe of the keyboard. Tell me I'm out of my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 no now that the defense is going to score all of their td's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zooty Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 While Vick does not post top 10 stats through the air (just over 3kyards in 2010 with 21 TD's), his rushing numbers (676YDS WITH 9td's) are in the area of a low RB#2). I'm warming up to the idea of giving Vick a serious look in the 1st round. You get a QB and #2 RB with one swipe of the keyboard. Tell me I'm out of my mind. This sounds like an idea Matthew Berry would come up with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delfamdelfam Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 your first couple rounds need to be safe picks, take risks with later picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted July 30, 2011 Author Share Posted July 30, 2011 Who the hell is Mathew Berry? And FlimFlam...you related to Henry Muto? The CaPTAIN Obvious in your posts tells me you might be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 You may also safety assume that a bear likes to go potty in the woods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby's Hubby Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 Did you take Manning or Brady 1st the year after each of them set single season TD records? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zooty Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 Who the hell is Mathew Berry? And FlimFlam...you related to Henry Muto? The CaPTAIN Obvious in your posts tells me you might be. Berry's wisdom posted here follow the link by guess who? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazinib1 Posted July 30, 2011 Author Share Posted July 30, 2011 Berry's wisdom posted here follow the link by guess who? That pretty much answers my question Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 But Michael Vick wasn't supposed to play football ever ever ever again. And now he's being considered for 1st round picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themiraclejones Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) It doesn't matter what people say here. Everyone knows that Vick is going to be a top 5 pick, probably a top 3 pick, and yes in many leagues he will be a number one pick for the very reason you mentioned. His upside and dual role. That being said it scares me because now that teams have so much film on him...will they be able to shut down his running ability? My guess is no. But we will see. Edited July 31, 2011 by themiraclejones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 it depends on your scoring....I would definitely consider it either way... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) Brady's ADP is 4.02 and P Manning's is 4.03. I'll take either and use my first 3 rounds on RBs/WRs, and then kick your Vick-lead arse, thanks Edited July 31, 2011 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Brady's ADP is 4.02 and P Manning's is 4.03. I'll take either and use my first 3 rounds on RBs/WRs, and then kick your Vick-lead arse, thanks it seems like there is more and more RBBC in the NFL every year and if you don't get one of the top RB's, the better value can be the other back on any team if they catch some passes in a PPR... someone like R Bush or Bradshaw in prior years....it depends on your scoring and if RB is thinning out, I'd gladly take the clear cut #1 QB who can produce as a RB2 while drafting a bunch of RB's in the following rounds... I will try to accumulate studs at RB/WR/QB....it just depends on how things unfold...and things never unfold the way I think they will so I wouldn't rule anything out... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonsoxandy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 If its a late 1st I have no problem doing that considering I could still get a #1 RB I am comfortable with in the early 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I'd gladly take the clear cut #1 QB who can produce as a RB2 while drafting a bunch of RB's in the following rounds... Well, I guess I prefer having a QB to start at QB for my team rather than a RB2. Not sure how anyone comes to the conclusion that Vick is a clear #1 QB, but if this the the prevalent thinking this year I may have to get back into redraft leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Well, I guess I prefer having a QB to start at QB for my team rather than a RB2. Not sure how anyone comes to the conclusion that Vick is a clear #1 QB, but if this the the prevalent thinking this year I may have to get back into redraft leagues. nope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koopafantasy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 of course drafting Michael Vick in the first round isnt out of the question. If it wasnt for people being sure that he will miss time over the season than he would be hands down. The reason I may skip him for someone else is that i want my first pic to be a player i can count on for 16 games as the centre piece of my team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 It doesn't matter what people say here. Everyone knows that Vick is going to be a top 5 pick, probably a top 3 pick, and yes in many leagues he will be a number one pick for the very reason you mentioned. His upside and dual role. True. Alot of guys here said Moss was done after Oakland too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osu1322 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Berry's wisdom posted here follow the link by guess who? His main argument was that Vick was the 15th best rusher in the NFL last season. That is before he even threw a pass. Then u add in his passing stats and in most formats he's going to be one of the top scorers for the season. As for if I'll draft him, I'd consider him in the first rd but I'll guarantee he won't make it to the second rd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddahj Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I would advise not to take any QB in the 1st round. I did it last year (Rodgers) in a couple of redrafts. I made it to the playoffs, but got bounced early. It seemed like I was constantly scrambling to find quality starters @ RB/WR throughout the season. IMO, the risk isn't worth the reward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I love these kinds of debates. So let's look at Vick last season. Take his first 6 game splits vs his last 6 game splits (throw out the game in week 4 where he got hurt and insert the playoff game vs GB so that we are measuring 6 full games vs 6 full games) Vick threw 6 more passes per game in the last 6 than the first six, but only completed half of those additonal attempts. Over the last 6 games vs his first 6 games, his completion percentage, yards per passing attempt, QB rating, and yards per rushing attempt all dropped. In the first 6 games he threw 0 INTs, in the last 6 he threw 7 INTs - at least 1 in every game - while thowing for the same number of TDs and running for the same number of TDs in each split. Those numbers tell me that DCs started getting the book on Vick as his season progressed. That will be even more prevalent as DCs have had all offseason to pour over film while not having to worry about coaching in OTAs. Then you have that Vick posted career highs in passing last year. I remember the year after Manning set NFL passing records, as well as Brady doing the same, and people projecting the next year off their career highs and how overdrafted both guys were the following years as they regressed to their means. I expect the same thing to happen with Vick. If people seriously think that Vick will survive 16 games when they are also projecting 140 carries, and also are expecting him to rush for 900 yds AND throw for 4500 yds - as last year's numbers would project out over 16 games - they are seriously in need of therapy. It ain't gonna happen. Not even close, Draft him or any other QB in rd 1 at your FF team's peril. There are legitimately at least 6 guys who could project as the #1 FF QB this coming season. You don't want one of the top 2 guys on that list on your team. You want one of the last two - that's where the value is while you're loading up on studs at other positions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennykravitz2004 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I would advise not to take any QB in the 1st round. I did it last year (Rodgers) in a couple of redrafts. I made it to the playoffs, but got bounced early. It seemed like I was constantly scrambling to find quality starters @ RB/WR throughout the season. IMO, the risk isn't worth the reward. As tempted as I may be at 1.10 and 2.1, I agree with you. Add in the "emotion" that he flat-out won me my league last year... IMHO, this is a deep year for passers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJV Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I love these kinds of debates. So let's look at Vick last season. Take his first 6 game splits vs his last 6 game splits (throw out the game in week 4 where he got hurt and insert the playoff game vs GB so that we are measuring 6 full games vs 6 full games) Vick threw 6 more passes per game in the last 6 than the first six, but only completed half of those additonal attempts. Over the last 6 games vs his first 6 games, his completion percentage, yards per passing attempt, QB rating, and yards per rushing attempt all dropped. In the first 6 games he threw 0 INTs, in the last 6 he threw 7 INTs - at least 1 in every game - while thowing for the same number of TDs and running for the same number of TDs in each split. Those numbers tell me that DCs started getting the book on Vick as his season progressed. That will be even more prevalent as DCs have had all offseason to pour over film while not having to worry about coaching in OTAs. Then you have that Vick posted career highs in passing last year. I remember the year after Manning set NFL passing records, as well as Brady doing the same, and people projecting the next year off their career highs and how overdrafted both guys were the following years as they regressed to their means. I expect the same thing to happen with Vick. If people seriously think that Vick will survive 16 games when they are also projecting 140 carries, and also are expecting him to rush for 900 yds AND throw for 4500 yds - as last year's numbers would project out over 16 games - they are seriously in need of therapy. It ain't gonna happen. Not even close, Draft him or any other QB in rd 1 at your FF team's peril. There are legitimately at least 6 guys who could project as the #1 FF QB this coming season. You don't want one of the top 2 guys on that list on your team. You want one of the last two - that's where the value is while you're loading up on studs at other positions. BB I have been saying this forever. Nothing against ppl who draft a QB in the 1st but IMO you will be playing catchup for the entire draft if you do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 (edited) BB I have been saying this forever. Nothing against ppl who draft a QB in the 1st but IMO you will be playing catchup for the entire draft if you do so. Sage advice, RJV. Not drafting one of the top 6 doesn't prelude you from outstanding QB production either. Those guys drafting in the top 6 QBs probably won't being going QB for quite a while again - especiallly those burning a 1st/2nd rounder on QB. While those 1st round QB guys are playing catch up at other positions, other owners can wait and get a really lucrative QBBC that will give them overall equivalent production by utilizing prime matchups to get FF QB numbers game-per-game that may match or exceed the season long numbers of the top QBs. Even if Vick plays a possible 14 or 15 games (and who knows which ones he may likely miss - maybe FF playoffs) and gets you 6 FF ppg than other QBs, the other FF teams may be getting an additonal 2 to 3 FF ppg per player from 4 to 5 other guys because their RB/WR/TE starters will likely be more productive - giving them an overall scoring advantage despite losing out in the QB slot. That's where value comes in and makes its real impact. It ought to be a really fun year in FF for sure. It will be enjoyable tracking how the 1st round Vick teams do in overall stature once the season is over and we can rehash this. Edited July 31, 2011 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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