Azazello1313 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Again, Tebow absolutely made some poor decisions and poor throws - but he got no help from the playcalling and the O-line was flat out overwhelmed. let's not forget that the defense was also getting lit up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkhorse1251 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 It's not like that turned around the Eagles fortunes this year. Oh wait,... nevermind. Well doing that didn't help Cutler and the Bears recover their season. Wait... Tim Tebow still pales in comparison to Michael Vick and Jay Cutler. It's time to face it Bronco fans, Tim Tebow is not a Pro Quarterback. He looks lost at times and really doesn't belong out there. Kyle Orton at least looked competent out there, keeping the team in it against the likes of the Packers. But I digress, Bronco fans will never doubt the Holier than thou golden boy even if he embarasses the Quarterback position for the rest of the season. Also, blaming the coaching staff for setting Tebow up for failure is ridiculous. Holding your starting QB accountable to make plays for your offense is not setting him up for failure. He couldn't even deliver the simplest of passes. I bet Bronco fans wish they could play the Dolphins every week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Kyle Orton at least looked competent out there, keeping the team in it against the likes of the Packers. If this is what you intend to use as support to remove Tebow in favor of Orton's superior play, you need to step aside before you embarrass yourself even further. DEN dropped trou and grabbed their ankles at GB - they were just as badly overmatched as they were against DET. The only difference between the games is that DET kept applying relentless pressure whereas GB starting using the game as a practice and worked on various things throughout the course of the 2nd Q and 2nd half. DEN got trounced every bit as badly in GB as they did vs DET, and Orton vs GB was just as helpless as Tebow vs DET. GB just called off the dogs whereas DET dogpiled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkhorse1251 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 If this is what you intend to use as support to remove Tebow in favor of Orton's superior play, you need to step aside before you embarrass yourself even further. DEN dropped trou and grabbed their ankles at GB - they were just as badly overmatched as they were against DET. The only difference between the games is that DET kept applying relentless pressure whereas GB starting using the game as a practice and worked on various things throughout the course of the 2nd Q and 2nd half. DEN got trounced every bit as badly in GB as they did vs DET, and Orton vs GB was just as helpless as Tebow vs DET. GB just called off the dogs whereas DET dogpiled. smh, you're missing the point. Tebow cannot even amount to performing decently during garbage time! Man, every excuse is being made for Tebow! Orton lost games, he definitely did that well. But at least if someone was open, he could get it to them! He wouldn't panic and throw the play away. This guy is incompetent as a professional Quarterback! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Defenses exploit weakness. Tebow is the most glaring weakness on that offense (and that is saying a LOT). He cnat make NFL throws consistently, he cant progress through reads, and he cant even set his feet. If he showed any capability of beating a blitz by READING the defense and calling an audible or dumping the pass off within the same zip code of a receiver then guess what? He wouldnt get blitzed as much! Again, this is something that first year QBs like Ponder, Dalton and Newton are handling with ease. Tebow (the super duper hard worker) had all year to watch and learn, and looks like Jamie Foxx in Any Given Sunday when he gets out there. There is no excuse for Tebow to have terrible fundamentals, not know how to read defenses, have incredibly bad pocket awareness, and miss so many throws when he ISNT under pressure. Not for the super duper hardest worker in the NFL. Not for the guy that was pissed that he wasnt anointed the starter in training camp. Fox aint going anywhere, and neither is his offensive system. Tebow is NOT someone you build your pro program around, you get people that fit the system. It is a good thing that Denver is playing Tebow so they can realize what a colossal draft error he was, and suck enough to start over with an actual NFL caliber QB in the draft next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditkaless Wonders Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Tim Tebow still pales in comparison to Michael Vick and Jay Cutler. It's time to face it Bronco fans, Tim Tebow is not a Pro Quarterback. He looks lost at times and really doesn't belong out there. Kyle Orton at least looked competent out there, keeping the team in it against the likes of the Packers. But I digress, Bronco fans will never doubt the Holier than thou golden boy even if he embarasses the Quarterback position for the rest of the season. Also, blaming the coaching staff for setting Tebow up for failure is ridiculous. Holding your starting QB accountable to make plays for your offense is not setting him up for failure. He couldn't even deliver the simplest of passes. I bet Bronco fans wish they could play the Dolphins every week. I happen to be more or less a Tebow detractor. That said, at this point the only option is to give him a chance, and that might as well be his best chance. This kid is overwhelmed by reading coverages and progressions. 3, 4, and 5 receiver packages are ridiculuos plans for him. He needs some max protect, two route options so his reads are limited, and maybe a safety valve guy and the option for him to run. He might be able to make the read on two receivers in proper progression. Might. I happen to not think so, but he needs to start with baby steps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 I would pay cash money to be able to sit in a room with guys like Jaws, Gruden, Dilfer, Hoge breaking down game film of the train wreck this is Timmay Tebow. it would be pure comedy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 A lot of the arguments in favor of dumbing down the offense to help Tebow reminds me of when we had John Bunting apologists here in Chapel Hill. The excuses everyone was giving for why he couldn't get it done were essentially the exact same thing that every other college coach had to deal with. Losing guys because of academic violations, losing guys to the draft, whatever. I was always amazed that people would bother calling the radio shows to explain why he couldn't win and then go on to basically rattle off a list of things a head coach of a major college program has to deal with. It's the same thing here. In the last couple of years, there have been about a dozen rookie QBs who took over football teams essentially right away. And every single one of them had to figure out how to run an NFL offense. None of them had the luxury of spending over a year practicing with an NFL franchise, so the bits about simplifying the offense for him amazes me. That's the last thing he should need compared to other young QBs. If there's one thing that Tebow the work-a-holic should have down, it's understanding what Ds are doing and going through progressions. At least compared to other young QBs. What the hell has he been doing this whole time? Giving hi-fives and pep talks? Go to effing school, kid! With all the talk about him and his attitude and all that, you'd think he'd be at least mentally ready to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Tim Tebow still pales in comparison to Michael Vick and Jay Cutler. It's time to face it Bronco fans, Tim Tebow is not a Pro Quarterback. He looks lost at times and really doesn't belong out there. Kyle Orton at least looked competent out there, keeping the team in it against the likes of the Packers. But I digress, Bronco fans will never doubt the Holier than thou golden boy even if he embarasses the Quarterback position for the rest of the season. Also, blaming the coaching staff for setting Tebow up for failure is ridiculous. Holding your starting QB accountable to make plays for your offense is not setting him up for failure. He couldn't even deliver the simplest of passes. I bet Bronco fans wish they could play the Dolphins every week. Hey alot of QBs look bad compared to Vick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikesVikes Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 I didn't watch the game. But I do feel that less and less people will be able to watch any game that Tebow plays in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 let's not forget that the defense was also getting lit up. Might have been a product of getting tired? After the opening drive FG, Denver's drives were as follows: 3 and out 5 and out 3 and out 3 and out 3 and out 4 plays to the end of the half 1 play before a fumble 6 3 and out 3 and out Then, when the game was out of reach, they put together some drives. As a Niner fan, I can tell you first hand that even a decent D is going to get scored on if they get all of 2 minutes rest before having to run back on the field time and again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 (edited) Might have been a product of getting tired? After the opening drive FG, Denver's drives were as follows: 3 and out 5 and out 3 and out 3 and out 3 and out 4 plays to the end of the half 1 play before a fumble 6 3 and out 3 and out Then, when the game was out of reach, they put together some drives. As a Niner fan, I can tell you first hand that even a decent D is going to get scored on if they get all of 2 minutes rest before having to run back on the field time and again. There was also a pick 6 in there too, which I believe was at the goal-line. The DEN O accounted for 2 of the 6TDs against them, which is as much as a 28 point swing had they scored 2 TDs instead (big IF I know, but with one TO in the redzone, it's worth noting that if they'd scored rather than been scored on, the game could have been much closer). Edited November 1, 2011 by delusions of granduer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 There was also a pick 6 in there too, which I believe was at the goal-line. The DEN O accounted for 2 of the 6TDs against them, which is as much as a 28 point swing had they scored 2 TDs instead (big IF I know, but with one TO in the redzone, it's worth noting that if they'd scored rather than been scored on, the game could have been much closer). Based on how they were moving the ball, that's a 21 pt swing at best. The pick 6 was in the red zone, the fumble 6 was around their own 20 or so. And, again, based on how "well" they were moving the ball, that just happened instead of a punt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 whoa - that is some batchit crazy talk..... the problem is everyone is giving him a shot and the benefit of the doubt bc of who Timmay is, when the reality is anyone else with TT skills wouldn't even make the scout team. He is awful, and is never going to be an NFL caliber QB. Perfect example was in the first qtr when he had Decker for a TD on as easy of a throw as a QB can ask for. Yet somehow with his wind up, long delivery and poor anticipation Timmay is late and ends up throwing a balloon that Decker can't corral in time for the TD. It really was a simple throw, yet he is being set up to fail?? bumping my own post, bc that missed throw to Decker sums up Tebow as a QB, and I frankly nailed it yer welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 bumping my own post, bc that missed throw to Decker sums up Tebow as a QB, and I frankly nailed it yer welcome. You mean it was Tebow's fault that Decker didn't drag his back foot? That bastard! Next thing you know, he'll be leaving Titus Young wide open in the end zone for a DET TD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Based on how they were moving the ball, that's a 21 pt swing at best. The pick 6 was in the red zone, the fumble 6 was around their own 20 or so. And, again, based on how "well" they were moving the ball, that just happened instead of a punt. Yes, but it could have been a 28 point swing if the Bronco's weren't actively setting Tebow up to fail like they are Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 You mean it was Tebow's fault that Decker didn't drag his back foot? That bastard! Next thing you know, he'll be leaving Titus Young wide open in the end zone for a DET TD. cmon- throw was so late it wasn't funny. Not to mention it had so much air under it Decker probably thought he should have signaled for the fair catch. Good NFL QB's nail that throw every time - for Timmay it was difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 cmon- throw was so late it wasn't funny. Not to mention it had so much air under it Decker probably thought he should have signaled for the fair catch. Good NFL QB's nail that throw every time - for Timmay it was difficult. What is it about Tebow that threatens you so much? Tebow had a really crappy day, no doubt - but that pass was right on the money and should have been a TD. That you bring that pass up and then misconstrue it so badly makes me wonder why you feel such an urgent need to see Tebow fail so utterly. You're not the only one, but you certainly are one of the more adament in asserting that there is absolutely no chance that Tebow could succeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 What is it about Tebow that threatens you so much? Tebow had a really crappy day, no doubt - but that pass was right on the money and should have been a TD. That you bring that pass up and then misconstrue it so badly makes me wonder why you feel such an urgent need to see Tebow fail so utterly. You're not the only one, but you certainly are one of the more adament in asserting that there is absolutely no chance that Tebow could succeed. miscontstrued? threatened? lol if that pass was "right on the money" than TT is your man. Enjoy. I find it kind of incredible to watch to be honest. Nothing personal against TT at all, I just haven't seen someone so overmatched with no tools whatsover to play QB in the NFL. Yet bc of who he is, he keeps getting run out there. yer right, I would put his chance to be a solid starting QB in the NFL at zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Nothing personal against TT at all, Okaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 What is it about Tebow that threatens you so much? Tebow had a really crappy day, no doubt - but that pass was right on the money and should have been a TD. That you bring that pass up and then misconstrue it so badly makes me wonder why you feel such an urgent need to see Tebow fail so utterly. You're not the only one, but you certainly are one of the more adament in asserting that there is absolutely no chance that Tebow could succeed. At this point I think that we can say that the "delusional hate" for Tebow's prospects in the NFL were in fact justified. To say he has a long ways to go is being kind.... We can now flip that to ask, after all that you've seen from Tebow in the last two games, how can his supporters be so delusional in their support and excuses for why he can't get it done? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otis29 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 I think both "sides" of the Tebow debate are (for the most part) making good points, but he's such a polarizing guy that any positive opinion makes you a homer and any negative opinion makes you a hater. Most logical people can admit to the following: Tim Tebow is a long ways from being a solid NFL quarterback. Tim Tebow has some serious fundamental flaws that most successful NFL QB's do not have. Tim Tebow has been pretty bad in his (limited) play to this point. The Broncos don't have any great alternatives to Tim Tebow right now. If he ends up being successful, Tim Tebow wouldn't be the first QB in NFL history to overcome the items listed above. I'd bet that most people agree on these points. I'd certainly be classified as a "doubter", but don't really think the Broncos have much to lose in seeing what the guy has or how he'll improve from week to week. I think Kyle Orton is a known entity, and Brady Quinn is...well, he's Brady Quinn. Step back, take the vitriol out of the debate and see it for what it is. It's a bad football team evaluating one of the best college QBs ever to play, while making their fans happy in what already looks like a lost season. If he doesn't improve in the next few weeks, he goes back to holding a clipboard and learning his craft outside the spotlight. No harm done, essentially. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 At this point I think that we can say that the "delusional hate" for Tebow's prospects in the NFL were in fact justified. To say he has a long ways to go is being kind.... We can now flip that to ask, after all that you've seen from Tebow in the last two games, how can his supporters be so delusional in their support and excuses for why he can't get it done? Can you provide a quote from someone - anyone - who holds Tebow blameless for his play the past two games? The absolutists like yourself are the ones who are making the argument that there can't possibly be any other factors to DEN's poor offensive play other than that Tebow. It's to the point where it has passed being merely absurd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Can you provide a quote from someone - anyone - who holds Tebow blameless for his play the past two games? The absolutists like yourself are the ones who are making the argument that there can't possibly be any other factors to DEN's poor offensive play other than that Tebow. It's to the point where it has passed being merely absurd. Sorry, but I don't think the other shortcomings in DEN are directly correlated in the least with Tebow's specific struggles... They may be fine for you to be able to partly excuse his bad play, but it changes my opinion none about thinking that Tebow doesn't have the skills needed to be a successful NFL QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted November 1, 2011 Share Posted November 1, 2011 Can you provide a quote from someone - anyone - who holds Tebow blameless for his play the past two games? The absolutists like yourself are the ones who are making the argument that there can't possibly be any other factors to DEN's poor offensive play other than that Tebow. It's to the point where it has passed being merely absurd. BB you bury a tidbit like "boy he has played bad" in a paragraph of apologies for his play blaming everyone from his teammates to Elway to the offensive play calling to the waterboy. Instead of looking at his shortcomings as a QB (and they are pretty damn hard to miss) you look at how Tebow just isnt getting the support that he needs to truly succeed. Things like dumbing down the offense for the hardest worker in the NFL that cant make passes to blaming his WRs for not catching everything that it is in the same time zone (which is rare in and of itself). Most look at Tebow and realize that he just isnt ready to be the QB for an NFL team. This includes a multitude of NFL analyists, players, coaches and really anyone that knows anything about football You look at it as "my isnt anyone helping Tebow?" and "he would be successful if excuses 1-15 didnt happen" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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