What is going on with the Browns?

[tazinib1]

Now they hire Elliot Wolf as Director of Football Operations to team up with GM John Dorsey? If I didn't know any better, I'd say they are making solid, franchise decisions. Who else from GB can they steal away??? 

Edited January 10, 2018 by tazinib1

[MTSuper7]

30 minutes ago, tazinib1 said:

Now they hire Elliot Wolf as Director of Football Operations to team up with GM John Dorsey? If I didn't know any better, I'd say they are making solid, franchise decisions. Who else from GB can they steal away??? 

 

Wasn't there discussion that Green Bay's misuse of the IR rule for Aaron Rodgers might call for them to release Rodgers? I wonder what team would have top priority for a waiver claim for Aaron Rodgers? 

[loaf]

wait until after the draft

I'm jaded

[kdko]

On 1/10/2018 at 10:29 AM, MTSuper7 said:

 

Wasn't there discussion that Green Bay's misuse of the IR rule for Aaron Rodgers might call for them to release Rodgers? I wonder what team would have top priority for a waiver claim for Aaron Rodgers? 

 

I'd love if this was true.

Edited January 11, 2018 by kdko

[stevegrab]

2 hours ago, loaf said:

wait until after the draft

I'm jaded

 

I hear you but finally hiring a good GM and other people who know football talent evaluation is a good start.

 

As for who else from GB the Browns could get, they already hired another front office person after Dorsey, Alonzo Highsmith a former RB and long time member of GB scouting department, he will head up the scouting dept and report to Dorsey.

 

I don't think there is ANY chance the Packers are forced to release Rodgers over that IR issue, I'd be surprised if there is any punishment at all.

[jamesplante11]

Don't worry, Jackson will mess up all the smart hiring by picking the wrong OC

[stevegrab]

9 minutes ago, jamesplante11 said:

Don't worry, Jackson will mess up all the smart hiring by picking the wrong OC

 

He may not have final say, he may need approval from Dorsey (or worse Haslam).

 

I do hope that Dorsey has some success, Haslam makes him President of the Browns, all coaching and front office report to Dorsey and he reports to Haslam (who stays out of the football decisions, let him go mess up the Vols).

[BeeR]

22 hours ago, loaf said:

wait until after the draft

I'm jaded

Only the draft?  I'd say more like wait until about November.  By all accounts last spring, they had a great off season.

[stevegrab]

1 hour ago, BeeR said:

Only the draft?  I'd say more like wait until about November.  By all accounts last spring, they had a great off season.

 

They spent a lot to upgrade the OL, and it didn't really show. Of course part of that was Hue Jackson giving up on the run every week, then in the post game press conference admitting he gave up too early, but not knowing how to change it since he kept doing it week after week and saying the same thing.

 

That is one of the biggest knocks on him, continues to admit he is screwing up, but doesn't seem to know how to change it' I'm hoping the new OC will be able to make things better, but he's hand picked by Hue and the front office has no say, he'll just hire somebody that does exactly what he wants.

 

The front office hires give me a little hope, but the proof will come in the games next season.

[NAUgrad]

The funny thing is......how many wins will they need for us to think "hey they are really going in the right direction"?  Is it 5 wins, 4?

[Def.]

16 minutes ago, NAUgrad said:

The funny thing is......how many wins will they need for us to think "hey they are really going in the right direction"?  Is it 5 wins, 4?

 

Well 1 would be trending up.

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry, low hanging fruit and all...

[stevegrab]

For people familiar with the Browns records since return, 4-5 is about the average number of wins. They've only had 2 winning seasons in 19 years, since the last one (10-6 in 2007 missed the playoffs on a tie breaker with Titans) their most wins was 7-9 in 2014, that was a 7-4 start with 0-5 after.

 

Checked the total is 88 wins in 19 years, 4.63 wins a year. If they went 12-4 next year that would be 100 wins in 20 years, nudging the average up to 5 wins.

 

Honestly if they can win 4-5 games again, that would be a huge improvement, return to their average and hope to keep improving. The constant turnover (GM, HC, players even owners with 3 coungint Al & Randy Lerner, now Jimmy Haslam) over 20 years has not helped. 

 

I posted this elsewhere in a discussion of the Browns, they've had 5 coaches over the past 9 seasons, more than one every 2 years. Only 2 coaches in the new era (post 99, Browns 2.0 if you like) had 3 years or more, Butch Davis (fired with 2 games left in 4th season) and Crennel (4 full season)., everybody else 2 or less. So in one way I'm not too unhappy with Hue Jackson staying, I thought he was a good hire at the time, especially with other teams interested and the Browns getting their first (not 9-10th) choice. But I do question some of his in game decisions. And his calm demeanor while the team is a hot mess.

[jamesplante11]

1 hour ago, stevegrab said:

For people familiar with the Browns records since return, 4-5 is about the average number of wins. They've only had 2 winning seasons in 19 years, since the last one (10-6 in 2007 missed the playoffs on a tie breaker with Titans) their most wins was 7-9 in 2014, that was a 7-4 start with 0-5 after.

 

Checked the total is 88 wins in 19 years, 4.63 wins a year. If they went 12-4 next year that would be 100 wins in 20 years, nudging the average up to 5 wins.

 

Honestly if they can win 4-5 games again, that would be a huge improvement, return to their average and hope to keep improving. The constant turnover (GM, HC, players even owners with 3 coungint Al & Randy Lerner, now Jimmy Haslam) over 20 years has not helped. 

 

I posted this elsewhere in a discussion of the Browns, they've had 5 coaches over the past 9 seasons, more than one every 2 years. Only 2 coaches in the new era (post 99, Browns 2.0 if you like) had 3 years or more, Butch Davis (fired with 2 games left in 4th season) and Crennel (4 full season)., everybody else 2 or less. So in one way I'm not too unhappy with Hue Jackson staying, I thought he was a good hire at the time, especially with other teams interested and the Browns getting their first (not 9-10th) choice. But I do question some of his in game decisions. And his calm demeanor while the team is a hot mess.

 

I think Hue needs to choose his OC intelligently. Regardless of who it is, Hue is gonna be on a very short leash next year. I think Haslam told Dorsey that he promised Hue more than two years so that’s why Hue is still around. If they start horribly I could see Jackson getting the hook early. So he needs someone that can help him make a difference at OC

[jamesplante11]

“#Browns head coach Hue Jackson DID NOT extend an offer to #Texans QB coach Sean Ryan to make him offensive coordinator because Hue did not want to give up play-calling duties (which Sean Ryan wanted), according to @MaryKayCabot. A huge loss for Cleveland.”

 

This is a coach that according to advanced statistics cost the team 3 wins last season

Edited January 12, 2018 by jamesplante11

[stevegrab]

On Friday, January 12, 2018 at 6:18 PM, jamesplante11 said:

“#Browns head coach Hue Jackson DID NOT extend an offer to #Texans QB coach Sean Ryan to make him offensive coordinator because Hue did not want to give up play-calling duties (which Sean Ryan wanted), according to @MaryKayCabot. A huge loss for Cleveland.”

 

This is a coach that according to advanced statistics cost the team 3 wins last season

Same idiot who keeps saying "I gave up on the run too early, that was wrong" then does the same thing week after week.

 

If he isn't required to give up play calling duty the OC hire is meaningless. Hue won't make it to November.

[BeeR]

Starts at the top.  Their owner is a retard. 

[stevegrab]

On Wednesday, January 17, 2018 at 11:05 PM, BeeR said:

Starts at the top.  Their owner is a retard.

 

Agree and its been all downhill since the first owner of Browns 2.0 (Al Lerner) died and handed off to his son (Randy who was a moron). Then we got Mr. "I was a minority owner with the Steelers and learned a lot watching how they run their organization" Haslam. It seems he is going against everything he learned, or decided he was smarter and would do the opposite.

[tazinib1]

Rumors have Todd Haley as the new OC 

[jamesplante11]

The same rumors have McAdoo and the LSU RB coach still in the running as well with Mularkey as a dark horse

[stevegrab]

On Sunday, January 21, 2018 at 1:06 PM, jamesplante11 said:

The same rumors have McAdoo and the LSU RB coach still in the running as well with Mularkey as a dark horse

 

Watch them be left waiting to hire an OC after the SB when all the other HC have been hired and built their staffs, left with the dregs nobody wanted.

 

I'd prefer Haley, just a gut feeling that he can work with a young QB. And he'll be eager to stick it to PIT. The key is Hue must give up play calling duties, I've seen some debate on that regarding OC candidates. If he won't guys like Haley and McAdoo may be less interested (and it is a key to helping the Browns in game performance, especially to stop giving up on the run early (Hue admits he does it too often, but didn't do a thing to change that).

 

An interesting read (just skimmed so far)

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-insider-notebook-browns-oc-pickle-keeping-keenum-in-minnesota-and-more/

[tazinib1]

I seriously don't think Hue will last to week 5 without a win. Whoever they hire as OC will probably be the "coach in waiting" if/when Hue is shown the door. You have a solid, proven front office now that isn't going to play around with ineptitude. 

[stevegrab]

6 minutes ago, tazinib1 said:

I seriously don't think Hue will last to week 5 without a win. Whoever they hire as OC will probably be the "coach in waiting" if/when Hue is shown the door. You have a solid, proven front office now that isn't going to play around with ineptitude.

 

I don't disagree, and I've said to people that all 3 (Haley, McAdoo, Mularkey) have that prior HC thing going which could mean Hue is on super short leash and they might replace him. That begs the question, why would Hue hire them instead of say the LSU RB coach? That guy isn't going to be handed HC duty, so its a safer pick for Hue. (No idea if OC is solely Hue's decision, or if Dorsey/Haslam have input/veto.)

 

As far as them firing Hue if he doens't win a game through first month or so, not unreasonable, but that is Haslam's decision, unless he's extending that power to Dorsey (both Dorsey and Hue report to Haslam, so Dorsey cannot just fire him). If Dorsey/Haslam view the new OC as a potential interim HC, they're going to have input.

[jamesplante11]

I remember reading somewhere that Jackson is looking for someone with play calling experience, then once he makes the call on who he approves of Dorsey must also give the hire the green light. I really hope there is some truth to this that way Jackson knows exactly how short of a leash hes on. The Vegas line has the Browns over/under at 4.5 wins...I would like to think that is also the over/under of how many games before Jackson is fired next season. 

[jamesplante11]

 

I am ashamed to admit to falling for the Hue bs that Haslem doesn't seem to be able to see past

[michaelredd9]

After reading the speculation in this thread that Hue could be fired after 4 games into the season, I was curious which coach was fired quickest in NFL history.  George Allen was fired after the LA Rams started 0-2 in the preseason of 1978.  He hadn't even been the coach there the year before.  He switched to the broadcast booth that season in a 3-man crew with Jim Brown and Vin Scully.  The Rams proceeded to go 12-4 and made it to the NFC championship game.