Joe Paterno is at death's door

[Ditkaless Wonders]

This is pretty much the part of the lynch mob mentality that bugs me. You guys do know he went to straight to the only police department he could that had jurisdiction. You guys do know that, right?

 

His fault was not going to the State Police later when he saw no action be taken by the department that had local jurisdiction, and not to follow-up with his superiors by asking "what the frack is going on here". But to say he didn't go straight to the police is just flat-out false.

 

 

I thought he decided to go to them after the weekend was over. I thought I heard that, or read that, from his testimony. I am not sure I would characterize that as going straight to the police. I might even describe that as allowing time to pass so that evanescent evidence can be destroyed and so that stories could be worked out, you know, if I was the type inclined to see the evil in folks.

Edited January 25, 2012 by Ditkaless Wonders

[godtomsatan]

This is pretty much the part of the lynch mob mentality that bugs me. You guys do know he went to straight to the only police department he could that had jurisdiction. You guys do know that, right?

 

His fault was not going to the State Police later when he saw no action be taken by the department that had local jurisdiction, and not to follow-up with his superiors by asking "what the frack is going on here". But to say he didn't go straight to the police is just flat-out false.

 

This is part of the whatever-mentality-you-are-part-of that bugs me. Joe Paterno had no "superiors" or police departments in his "jurisdiction" to follow up with. This is a man that was allowed to continue doing his job into his mid-80s when I'm guessing maybe half of his peers at the FBS level were less than half his age. Do you think he realistically answered to anyone at Penn State? His jurisdiction was the football program at the university and he did practically nothing to deal with Sandusky in that realm.

 

This isn't some random employee of the university or some guy in the community that knew someone who saw something. Stop portraying this as such.

[SNOWBOUND33]

This is pretty much the part of the lynch mob mentality that bugs me. You guys do know he went to straight to the only police department he could that had jurisdiction. You guys do know that, right?

 

His fault was not going to the State Police later when he saw no action be taken by the department that had local jurisdiction, and not to follow-up with his superiors by asking "what the frack is going on here". But to say he didn't go straight to the police is just flat-out false.

That's not lynch mob mentality it's what's morally correct. Forget the stupid glorified rent-a-cops. As soon as they didn't do anything the gloves should have come off for this great christian man. State police, DA, Sheriffs Dept. WWJD? Not the what Paterno did. Paterno put himself, the school, the program above the safety of children. Child Rape. Rest in Guilt.

[HowboutthemCowboys]

I thought he decided to go to them after the weekend was over. I thought I heard that, or read that, from his testimony. I am not sure I would characterize that as going straight to the police. I might even describe that as allowing time to pass so that evanescent evidence can be destroyed and so that stories could be worked out, you know, if I was the type inclined to see the evil in folks.

I won't go so far as to say evidence was destroyed, stories could be worked out. I will say that if the " rent a cops" did'nt do anything the next call is to the D.A, FBI, whatever it takes

[Hugh 0ne]

fortunately for me I don't really know the signs/symptoms and I'm not familiar with the long term damage..though I can imagine. But I still would've gone directly to the police

 

either you are intentionally misreading what untateve wrote or you are not as smart as you think you are.

[HowboutthemCowboys]

you are not as smart as you think you are.

sounds about right

[Mr Cliche]

If Joe would have went straight to the Police, this would have never have happened

[detlef]

I thought he decided to go to them after the weekend was over. I thought I heard that, or read that, from his testimony. I am not sure I would characterize that as going straight to the police. I might even describe that as allowing time to pass so that evanescent evidence can be destroyed and so that stories could be worked out, you know, if I was the type inclined to see the evil in folks.

Here's the testimony you're trying to recall...

 

Q: You recall this taking place on a Saturday morning, the conversation with Mike?

 

Mr. Paterno: Yes.

 

Q: When did you — did you do something with that information?

 

Mr. Paterno: Well, I can’t be precise.

 

I ordinarily would have called people right away, but it was a Saturday morning and I didn’t want to interfere with their weekends.

 

So I don’t know whether I did it Saturday or did it early the next week.

 

I’m not sure when, but I did it within the week.

 

So, yes. He didn't want to interfere with some campus policeman's weekend by telling him that a former coach was more or less engaging in sexual behavior with a young boy in the showers at the University. Somethings can wait, apparently.

[caddyman]

I thought he decided to go to them after the weekend was over. I thought I heard that, or read that, from his testimony. I am not sure I would characterize that as going straight to the police. I might even describe that as allowing time to pass so that evanescent evidence can be destroyed and so that stories could be worked out, you know, if I was the type inclined to see the evil in folks.

Yep...check this post out from some dude on another message board...believe as much of it as you want...

 

I think a point a lot of you are forgetting is that during that period Penn State's program was suffering through its lowest ebb since Paterno took it over in the mid-60s. During the five year period of 2000-2004 Penn State was an incredibly weak (by Penn State standards) 26-32. As such Paterno was under SERIOUS pressure to step down from his internal enemies at Penn State (read: Spanier) who feared that he had stayed too long and had grown stale. They were worried about what would happen to the university as a whole if its primary economic engine had stopped producing.

 

Paterno, perhaps out of a fear of death and perhaps out of his ambition to outlast Bobby Bowden for the all time wins mark, was DESPERATE to hang on and was willing to do whatever it took to remain as PSU's coach. It was during that time that Penn State recruited most of the athletes whose misbehavior was so brazen and notorious that it would ultimately land them on ESPN's "Outside the Lines."

 

Had this scandal broken during that time Paterno's many enemies would have absoluterly siezed on that opportunity to leverage the aging coach to the sidelines just like Florida State ultimately did with Bowden. Paterno's enemies would have simply pointed to Sandusky as "proof" that Joe had lost control of the program and they would have succeeded as it is tough to beat the child rape rap - as we have all seen.

 

Paterno was many things but a foolish old man he was not. He could read the tea leaves as well as anyone and he knew the score all too well. He also knew that if the scandal broke he was done as the head coach at Penn State and that his legacy would have been tarnished.

 

So, when McQueary finally came to him with information he already knew - that Sandusky was a pedophile - including an eye witness account of the rape (which was the killer from Joe's perspective), Paterno did what any shrewd, calculating man in that position would do: He called his son - the attorney - over and they discussed all of his options and responsibilities. In fact that night I'm sure that the Parternos had a host of attorneys over to formulate their strategy. And if I had to venture a guess I'm sure that most of those discussions took place around his famous kitchen table.

 

I'm sure that the concensus was that they needed to do whatever it took to cover themselves legally without bringing so much attention to the issue that it would destroy their cash cow of a program. That's why he waited an extra day or two; not because he was worried about ruining Tim Curley's weekend or because he didn't want to breach university protocol but to CONSPIRE and come up with a plan.

 

And of course Shultz and Curley agreed to it. What choice did they have? The same goes for Spanier. As we have all seen if any of them had come forward and done the right thing that would have brought down the program and it would have ensured their place in infamy among the Nitter Nation - and we have all seen how well the Nitter Nation would have handled the destruction of their empire.

 

I mean seriously, can you imagine if a relative nobody like Gary Shultz had come forward and said, "Listen, this is what happened and it wasn't right and I had to come forward so that I could live with myself?" That would have been the end of Camelot and the end of Paterno's reign and you can bet your bottom dollar that it would have been the end of Shultz's life as he knew it. So he went along with the plan and hoped like hell that Sandusky would die before any of this stuff ever came to light.

 

I mean you can choose to believe or disbelieve whatever you want to believe regarding Paterno and his state of mind in 2002 but I think it is FAR more likely that this man was coming up with a plan that covered all bases than it was he was waxing poetic about the "Dobie Gillis Show" and how much he missed the golden era of big band music.

[detlef]

Interesting take, but I wonder why Spanier would go along with it if he was so anxious to get Joe out. You'd think he'd blow the whole thing open and use that as an excuse to oust Paterno. That is, unless Spanier had something to do with why the whole deal was sort of brushed under the rug in 98.

[Azazello1313]

This is pretty much the part of the lynch mob mentality that bugs me. You guys do know he went to straight to the only police department he could that had jurisdiction. You guys do know that, right?

 

His fault was not going to the State Police later when he saw no action be taken by the department that had local jurisdiction, and not to follow-up with his superiors by asking "what the frack is going on here". But to say he didn't go straight to the police is just flat-out false.

 

so an assistant comes to you and tells you he saw sandusky plowing a young boy from behind in the shower. you then wait a couple days and go to the campus cops or whatever and tell them you had a report of some horsing around that may not have been appropriate.

 

based on what we know and what took place later, what kind of posture do you think paterno went into those meetings with the AD and the campus cop with? do you think it was, "this is awful, you need to make sure you get to the bottom of this, if it's as bad as my assistant made it sound this guy is a monster who should be in prison and never EVER around young kids"? or was it more like, "so...just need to let you know, one of my assistants came to me saying he saw sandusky and a kid goofing around naked in the shower and it seemed inappropriate. probably not a big deal, not worth making a fuss over, but I figured I'd better pass it along."

 

I am thinking a campus cop at penn state being called into joe paterno's office about something involving his subordinates in the football program, is probably going to be taking his cues how to proceed pretty closely from The Man himself. so all this mealy-mouthed excuse-making, saying paterno did what he was supposed to do, really makes me want to vomit. paterno did the very minimum and then thought he could wash his hands of the matter, when he was absolutely and unequivocally in a position to stop it all right then and there in 2002. and he probably knew about sandusky's proclivities a lot sooner than that. he sat by and did the minimum when he had to, and otherwise did absolutely nothing. to me that is a conscious choice -- paterno put his own interests and those of his beloved program about those of any kids the monster might victimize. I don't think anyone can deny that, or defend it with any integrity.

[otis29]

It was pretty easy to decide how I felt about Paterno's passing - by trying to put myself in the shoes of the boys and the parents of the boys who were molested by Sandusky after McQueary reported the incident to Paterno.

 

I'd imagine those parties would be pretty enraged by the thought of honoring this man for his previous "good works".

[caddyman]

It was pretty easy to decide how I felt about Paterno's passing - by trying to put myself in the shoes of the boys and the parents of the boys who were molested by Sandusky after McQueary reported the incident to Paterno.

 

I'd imagine those parties would be pretty enraged by the thought of honoring this man for his previous "good works".

Check out some of the quotes in this article in the Pittsburgh Post Gazette...effing sickening....

 

 

By J. Brady McCollough, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Mourners pay their final respects to former football coach Joe Paterno on Tuesday at the Pasquerilla Spiritual Center.UNIVERSITY PARK, Pa. -- As a Penn State fullback from 1996 to 2000, Mike Cerimele believed that Joe Paterno was teaching him and his teammates how to be men.

 

Mr. Paterno made sure they knew it would not always be easy. And, sometimes along that journey, they were going to feel lost.

 

"But he gave us a road map," Mr. Cerimele said. "It will always be there, and you can tap into it and get back on track."

 

What Mr. Cerimele didn't realize until Tuesday afternoon was how much Mr. Paterno had impacted countless others who never stepped foot on the field at Beaver Stadium wearing those classic blue-and-white uniforms.

 

For an hour Tuesday at the public viewing of Mr. Paterno at the Pasquerilla Spiritual Center, Mr. Cerimele stood to the left of Mr. Paterno's closed mahogany casket, which was covered in white roses. A former and a current player would stay with Mr. Paterno's body for the entire nine hours, handling the duty in shifts.

 

Mr. Cerimele wore a navy blazer with a Nittany Lion logo on his left breast pocket and stood stoically with his hands clinched together behind his back. He watched as hundreds of people filed through the worship hall and paid their final respects to Mr. Paterno, who died Sunday of lung cancer at 85. The sadness painted on the faces Mr. Cerimele saw will stick with him forever.

 

"All I could keep thinking is, 'Look at all the different types of people walking through here,' " Mr. Cerimele said. "And they're people who are just fans. They've never even had a conversation with Joe. To see the genuine emotions out of these people is just ... humbling."

 

Mr. Paterno's players may have had most of his attention for the 61 years that he coached at Penn State, 46 of them as head coach, but Mr. Paterno belonged to the world.

 

Thousands of mourners battled brisk winds and waited patiently to see him. The line was shepherded toward the building between bike racks, linked to keep the flow of the crowd orderly. Some people were in line for as long as an hour and a half, and, when they finally made it to the casket, there was hardly time to stop and say goodbye.

 

Mr. Paterno's former and current players and assistant coaches were offered a more intimate experience. Hundreds of former Nittany Lions, from walk-ons to NFL Hall of Famers such as Franco Harris and Jack Ham, made the trip to campus.

 

They were met with gray skies befitting the campus mood in the months since former Penn State defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky was arrested and charged with numerous counts of child sex abuse.

 

Mr. Harris, a Steelers great, has been one of the most critical voices against Mr. Paterno's firing by the school's Board of Trustees on Nov. 9. Last Friday and Saturday, he was one of the few non-family members allowed to see Mr. Paterno in the hospital.

 

"By Sunday morning Joe was at peace," Mr. Harris said in a statement. "Joe had told us that he didn't want to be bitter. Saying that after what he had to endure, he is a better man than I am. But none of us were surprised."

 

As the players and coaches shared their last moments with Mr. Paterno, nearly 500 people had lined up outside the spiritual center at noon. By 2 p.m., the line stretched a quarter-mile to the Pavilion Theatre.

 

Those in line were a mix of ages, some in business coats and others in jeans, ball caps, Penn State parkas and Ugg boots. The variety reflected the man's imprint left on campus and the university's football program across more than six decades.

 

Penn State juniors Zack Francis and Kelly Feiertag arrived at the end of the line having no idea how long it would take them.

 

"Even though I've never met the man," said Mrs. Feiertag, a native of Latrobe, "I felt as though he was a part of our Penn State family. He was our collective grandfather. It's the least thing we can do."

 

Mr. Francis, a native of Cranberry, and Mrs. Feiertag aren't sure they would have gone to Penn State without Mr. Paterno.

 

"I'm the first person in my family to go to Penn State," Ms. Feiertag said. "Because of Joe Paterno and what he did for this school, I felt it would be the proper place for me to better myself."

 

Behind Mr. Francis and Ms. Feiertag, the line had pushed closer to Shortlidge Road. Now standing at the back was Christel Ertel, a 1982 Penn State alum who had made the two-hour drive from Camp Hill.

 

Asked what brought her to campus Tuesday, Ms. Ertel broke into tears. But she soon brightened when recalling the time when she and her college roommate saw Mr. Paterno walking around campus. That sight made her day then, and the memory had the same effect.

 

"Coach Paterno was really a force in all of our lives," said Ms. Ertel, "and it's pretty incredible that even though none of us played football for him, all of us were deeply influenced by the lessons that he taught and the life that he led."By 3:15 p.m., the line had curved around from Curtin Road to Shortlidge Road. Jonathan Scollo and Joe Gurka, 2010 Penn State alums, stood near the back, each holding a medium pizza box.

 

Mr. Scollo and Mr. Gurka met at Penn State's Hazleton campus with a shared mission of transferring to the University Park campus for their last two years. They put in all that work so that they could be a part of the Happy Valley Mr. Paterno had created.

 

"He's my third grandfather," Mr. Gurka said.The hardy folks at the rear of the line were eventually given a welcome reward. Tom Bradley, the former Penn State player and defensive coordinator and the man who replaced Mr. Paterno in November as interim head coach, came walking to the corner wearing a gray suit and light blue tie.

 

He spent the next 10 minutes receiving condolences and posing for pictures. At one point, a young woman began crying and gave him a hug, telling him, "You meant the world to our family."

 

"I made out pretty good, too!" Mr. Bradley said. "I've been blessed! It wasn't like it was all bad!"

 

Walking away from his fans, Mr. Bradley said that he'd been interacting with the line for the last 21/2 hours.

 

"I hate to say no," Mr. Bradley said. "They're such great people, and they came out for coach Paterno."

 

Mr. Bradley, who spent most of his adult life walking in Mr. Paterno's shadow, asked for a few moments alone with his mentor before the public viewing started.

 

"I told all the players, 'You guys go. I'm going last. I've got some things to say,' " Mr. Bradley said.

 

Mr. Bradley got into his SUV and headed toward Mr. Paterno's house on McKee Street. Estranged from Penn State for the first time in 35 years, he is now living in Nevillewood. Asked about the difficulties of the past few months, Mr. Bradley said, "It's been different. I'll tell you that."

 

As Mr. Bradley drove away from campus, the mourners continued to funnel through the worship hall. Penn State junior fullback Mike Zordich stood to the right of the casket with Mr. Cerimele to the left.

 

"It means the world to me," Mr. Zordich said, "to be able to stand next to him like that and watch over him while he's resting."

 

It was only months before that Mr. Zordich was taking orders from the legendary coach.

 

"That's the wild part about it," Mr. Zordich said. "I was on the field with him every day this year. He was our coach."

 

Like Mr. Cerimele, his fellow Nittany Lions fullback, Mr. Zordich watched people's reactions intently.

 

After an hour and 15 minutes of waiting, Ms. Ertel was in the room. She walked in front of Mr. Paterno's casket, stopped for a few seconds and then pulled out a tissue to wipe her eyes.

 

"I was thinking about how few truly great men there are on this planet," Ms. Ertel said.Outside on Allen Road, Mr. Scollo and Mr. Gurka emerged from the worship hall, their expressions somber. Mr. Gurka had driven that morning from Summit Hill to pick up Mr. Scollo in Harrisburg so they could ride to campus together. The effort was worth it for just a brief look at Mr. Paterno's casket.

 

"It's exactly what he deserves," said Mr. Scollo, who a manages a hotel in Harrisburg, "This is one of those things you're always going to take with you. It's just as if he was a family member.

 

"I told my general manager today, straight up, I have a funeral to go to."

J. Brady McCollough: bmccollough@post-gazette.com and on Twitter @BradyMcCollough. Bill Schackner contributed to this report.

 

 

 

Read more: http://www.postgazette.com/pg/12025/120581...m#ixzz1kV5vLfjy

[tonorator]

franco, franco ...

 

Mr. Harris, a Steelers great, has been one of the most critical voices against Mr. Paterno's firing by the school's Board of Trustees on Nov. 9. Last Friday and Saturday, he was one of the few non-family members allowed to see Mr. Paterno in the hospital.

 

"By Sunday morning Joe was at peace," Mr. Harris said in a statement. "Joe had told us that he didn't want to be bitter. Saying that after what he had to endure, he is a better man than I am. But none of us were surprised."

 

what he had to endure? yes, the poor man had to endure keeping this massive cover up going until he could break the win record. i'm so glad he was not bitter towards those that would have preferred he instead focused on protecting children. what a great man.

 

[matt770]

RIP, you POS

[caddyman]

franco, franco ...

 

 

 

what he had to endure? yes, the poor man had to endure keeping this massive cover up going until he could break the win record. i'm so glad he was not bitter towards those that would have preferred he instead focused on protecting children. what a great man.

 

Yep...Franco is on the I hope he rots in hell list too. He may be the worst of his supporters. It's like he did not even hear about the rapes.

[SNOWBOUND33]

Yep...Franco is on the I hope he rots in hell list too. He may be the worst of his supporters. It's like he did not even hear about the rapes.

Franco possibly has an excuse with the concussions I am sure he sustained. If not then he's should just be buried with JoePedophileEnabler. Maybe Franco thinks rape is ok. Like Joe. Like the hierarchy at the catholic church. Peas in a pod.

[delusions of grandeur]

Yep...Franco is on the I hope he rots in hell list too. He may be the worst of his supporters. It's like he did not even hear about the rapes.

Dude please stop. You have every right to blast Paterno, because he was in a position to stop the sick acts, but saying a supporter of his should "rot in hell"?

 

No I don't like the way he's been deified or blindly defended, but at least their hearts are in the right place. They were in no way shape or form involved, so it's pretty shameful the way that you'd lump them in with a pedophile enabler just because the truth is too shocking for them to accept. These aren't jurors you're blasting, they're people like you and me who are having trouble accepting that a guy that looked up to could do something like this...

 

I think you should take a good look at yourself and the people you're blasting, because the nastiness you've shown towards people sad about a guy's death (even if he was in fact a scumbag) is flat out shameful...

[detlef]

Dude please stop. You have every right to blast Paterno, because he was in a position to stop the sick acts, but saying a supporter of his should "rot in hell"?

 

No I don't like the way he's been deified or blindly defended, but at least their hearts are in the right place. They were in no way shape or form involved, so it's pretty shameful the way that you'd lump them in with a pedophile enabler just because the truth is too shocking for them to accept. These aren't jurors you're blasting, they're people like you and me who are having trouble accepting that a guy that looked up to could do something like this...

 

I think you should take a good look at yourself and the people you're blasting, because the nastiness you've shown towards people sad about a guy's death (even if he was in fact a scumbag) is flat out shameful...

Yep. I'm puzzled by those who insist to look at the situation through rose colored glasses. And I'm alarmed and annoyed by those who are striking back at those who refuse to do so. But, just because I find it a pathetic and shameful stance, that doesn't mean I'm going that far with it.

[caddyman]

Dude please stop. You have every right to blast Paterno, because he was in a position to stop the sick acts, but saying a supporter of his should "rot in hell"?

 

No I don't like the way he's been deified or blindly defended, but at least their hearts are in the right place. They were in no way shape or form involved, so it's pretty shameful the way that you'd lump them in with a pedophile enabler just because the truth is too shocking for them to accept. These aren't jurors you're blasting, they're people like you and me who are having trouble accepting that a guy that looked up to could do something like this...

 

I think you should take a good look at yourself and the people you're blasting, because the nastiness you've shown towards people sad about a guy's death (even if he was in fact a scumbag) is flat out shameful...

 

Sorry...don't care one bit. And Franco is waaaaay more than just a supporter of him. He is going out of his way to keep this thing alive. Like scheduling a competing event to the president of PSU's speaking event. You can't compare Franco to regular guys like Menudo. Menudo I understand. Franco...nope.

 

Lastly, I am not sure it's up to you to tell me what rights I have. I am pretty sure that you would be very low on the list when it comes to someone that I would listen to. That's not meant to blast you. I just don't know you and frankly don't give a damn Scarlet what you think about my stance on this issue.