haiti

[bpwallace49]

I hope no one here has sympathy for Pat Robertson when he dies.

 

Why should we? Isnt he going to heaven?

[Azazello1313]

kind of an interesting read by david brooks, in the NY Times

 

Why is Haiti so poor? Well, it has a history of oppression, slavery and colonialism. But so does Barbados, and Barbados is doing pretty well. Haiti has endured ruthless dictators, corruption and foreign invasions. But so has the Dominican Republic, and the D.R. is in much better shape. Haiti and the Dominican Republic share the same island and the same basic environment, yet the border between the two societies offers one of the starkest contrasts on earth — with trees and progress on one side, and deforestation and poverty and early death on the other.

 

As Lawrence E. Harrison explained in his book “The Central Liberal Truth,” Haiti, like most of the world’s poorest nations, suffers from a complex web of progress-resistant cultural influences. There is the influence of the voodoo religion, which spreads the message that life is capricious and planning futile. There are high levels of social mistrust. Responsibility is often not internalized. Child-rearing practices often involve neglect in the early years and harsh retribution when kids hit 9 or 10.

 

We’re all supposed to politely respect each other’s cultures. But some cultures are more progress-resistant than others, and a horrible tragedy was just exacerbated by one of them.

 

read the whole thing.

[Ursa Majoris]

kind of an interesting read by david brooks, in the NY Times

 

 

 

read the whole thing.

 

This paragraph you quoted is really interesting.

 

As Lawrence E. Harrison explained in his book “The Central Liberal Truth,” Haiti, like most of the world’s poorest nations, suffers from a complex web of progress-resistant cultural influences. There is the influence of the voodoo religion, which spreads the message that life is capricious and planning futile. There are high levels of social mistrust. Responsibility is often not internalized. Child-rearing practices often involve neglect in the early years and harsh retribution when kids hit 9 or 10.

 

There but for the grace of God........

Edited January 16, 2010 by Ursa Majoris

[Chief Dick]

You know what pisses me off about stuff like this? 100,000+ people are dead. A country is devastated. Who knows if, or when, they will ever recover.

 

And people everywhere have to turn it into a pulpit for politics, or religion, or whatever "reason" this happened.

 

Apparently being sub-human is more important than being human. Makes me f-ing sick.

[Sugar Magnolia]

You know what pisses me off about stuff like this? 100,000+ people are dead. A country is devastated. Who knows if, or when, they will ever recover.

 

And people everywhere have to turn it into a pulpit for politics, or religion, or whatever "reason" this happened.

 

Apparently being sub-human is more important than being human. Makes me f-ing sick.

 

+1 Rush is attacking our president for giving aid to Haiti to be all a political move and nothing else. What would Rush be saying if we didn't give aid? He most likely would be saying what an uncompassionate president we have. I am often embarrassed to be a citizen of this country.

Edited January 16, 2010 by Sugar Magnolia

[The Holy Roller]

+1 Rush is attacking our president for giving aid to Haiti to be all a political move and nothing else. What would Rush be saying if we didn't give aid? He most likely would be saying what an uncompassionate president we have. I am often embarrassed to be a citizen of this country.

 

I'm often embarrassed by the citizens of this country.

 

But I'm more often PROUD to be a citizen of this country. Over 10,000 service men/women already in the Haiti relief effort. I think of THEM. Piss on Rush and all the talking heads, politicians, and religious nuts.

[Sugar Magnolia]

I'm often embarrassed by the citizens of this country.

 

But I'm more often PROUD to be a citizen of this country. Over 10,000 service men/women already in the Haiti relief effort. I think of THEM. Piss on Rush and all the talking heads, politicians, and religious nuts.

 

You are absolutely right.. I was just MAD at politics and poltical activists when I wrote this post.

[bpwallace49]

You are absolutely right.. I was just MAD at politics and poltical activists when I wrote this post.

 

I am proud to be a citizen of this country. But I am embarassed that Rush "pile of poopy" Limbaugh is a citizen .

[Ursa Majoris]

Another reason to be proud. Our military.

[Sugar Magnolia]

Another reason to be proud. Our military.

 

Nice to read the article.

 

And with all of this relief effort, a right wing high profile figure is critical of this quick response as being only politically motivated aid. Even to the point of accusing this admin. of providing aid so they can then accuse the Repulicans of having no compassion

 

We have learned something from Katrina, so can't the right side of the aisle give this administration a little credit for that? At least stay quiet instead of twising it to make it look like our admin. intensions to help with aid is all evil.

 

If I was a Republican politician, I would be broadcasting to the world that this classless A$$hole is not representative of our party, or a leader of our party. They may not, because they are more afraid of the damage this high profile jerk can do to their reputation, if they call him out. Very sad.

 

This Rush quote was unbelievable "I'm just gonna tell you, if I was named envoy to Haiti, I'd quit government. Envoy to Haiti? You can't even pick up a prostitute down there without genuine fear of AIDS."

 

Sorry had to get that off my chest.

[SheikYerbuti]

Apparently Satan has responded to Pat Robertson:

 

 

Dear Pat Robertson,

 

I know that you know that all press is good press, so I appreciate the shout-out. And you make God look like a big mean bully who kicks people when they are down, so I'm all over that action.

 

But when you say that Haiti has made a pact with me, it is totally humiliating. I may be evil incarnate, but I'm no welcher. The way you put it, making a deal with me leaves folks desperate and impoverished.

 

Sure, in the afterlife, but when I strike bargains with people, they first get something here on earth -- glamour, beauty, talent, wealth, fame, glory, a golden fiddle. Those Haitians have nothing, and I mean nothing. And that was before the earthquake. Haven't you seen "Crossroads"? Or "Damn Yankees"?

 

If I had a thing going with Haiti, there'd be lots of banks, skyscrapers, SUVs, exclusive night clubs, Botox -- that kind of thing. An 80 percent poverty rate is so not my style. Nothing against it -- I'm just saying: Not how I roll.

 

You're doing great work, Pat, and I don't want to clip your wings -- just, come on, you're making me look bad. And not the good kind of bad. Keep blaming God. That's working. But leave me out of it, please. Or we may need to renegotiate your own contract.

 

Best, Satan

[Ursa Majoris]

Apparently Satan has responded to Pat Robertson:

That was a letter written to the Mpls Star Trib a couple days back. Good stuff.

[Ursa Majoris]

If I was a Republican politician, I would be broadcasting to the world that this classless A$$hole is not representative of our party, or a leader of our party. They may not, because they are more afraid of the damage this high profile jerk can do to their reputation, if they call him out. Very sad.

They won't because in large measure, he IS their party. He supplies the drip drip drip of lies and smears necessary to keep the zombie hordes of Republican cretins motivated.

[The Holy Roller]

Apparently Satan has responded to Pat Robertson:

 

Sad but true.

[nuke'em ttg]

Haiti's Interior Minister Paul Antoine Bien-Aime said around 50,000 bodies had already been collected and the final death toll will likely be between 100,000 and 200,000.

 

I've been puttin off readin bout this, had no idea it was this bad was the quake that bad or just magnified by bad construction and people crammed tagether...did it just hit the capital?

[Ursa Majoris]

Haiti's Interior Minister Paul Antoine Bien-Aime said around 50,000 bodies had already been collected and the final death toll will likely be between 100,000 and 200,000.

 

I've been puttin off readin bout this, had no idea it was this bad was the quake that bad or just magnified by bad construction and people crammed tagether...did it just hit the capital?

It hit west of the capital but not that far away and bad construction was much of the problem. That said, it was a hugh quake - 7.0 on the Richter scale is very high.

[westvirginia]

It hit west of the capital but not that far away and bad construction was much of the problem. That said, it was a hugh quake - 7.0 on the Richter scale is very high.

 

7.0 is damn high. The richter scale is exponential, not linear (IIRC), so a 2 is 10X worse than a 1, a 3 is 10 times worse than a 2, etc.

[Perchoutofwater]

Robertson is an idiot. Limbaugh is an idiot. The people of Haiti need our help, and we should give it to them. I don't think anyone (anyone with half a heart or half a brain) questions sending the USNS Mercy, but I do think questioning any type of financial aid the US government provides for rebuilding is legitimate. It falls back to the roll of government and the roll of charities.

Edited January 18, 2010 by Perchoutofwater

[bpwallace49]

Questioning rebuilding is completely relevant and legit. IMO the current mission should be to get people through a current crisis, maybe help rebuild a water treatment plant or two to get them self-sufficient for essential services, and then let them be.

 

Questioning providing humanitarian aid in a time of crisis is self-serving and should reserve you a special place in hell.

 

and ANY questioning right now when people are dying is just plain heartless and stupid.

[Randall]

5500 americans among the missing.

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34928950/ns/wo...iti_earthquake/

 

MSNBC reporting there is hospital in northern Haiti in need of patients.

[Randall]

Questioning rebuilding is completely relevant and legit. IMO the current mission should be to get people through a current crisis, maybe help rebuild a water treatment plant or two to get them self-sufficient for essential services, and then let them be.

 

Questioning providing humanitarian aid in a time of crisis is self-serving and should reserve you a special place in hell.

 

and ANY questioning right now when people are dying is just plain heartless and stupid.

 

 

In many poor countries at least here is a central water supply where people can go and get clean water that is missing in Haiti. I would like to see at least that.

[SEC=UGA]

Well we all knew it was eventually going to happen... The US gives $100 million in aid, 10 times more than the UN, 20 times more than Canada and most of the European Nations, not to mention the tens of millions that the American public has given. We send troops to restore order and countless suppies... Hugo Chavez says we are occupying Haiti and now this from the French. No good deed goes unpunished when you're the US.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...s-flood-in.html

[Ursa Majoris]

Well we all knew it was eventually going to happen... The US gives $100 million in aid, 10 times more than the UN, 20 times more than Canada and most of the European Nations, not to mention the tens of millions that the American public has given. We send troops to restore order and countless suppies... Hugo Chavez says we are occupying Haiti and now this from the French. No good deed goes unpunished when you're the US.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...s-flood-in.html

EU aid totals more than 420 million Euro.

 

It was pretty simple to Google this.

[SEC=UGA]

EU aid totals more than 420 million Euro.

 

It was pretty simple to Google this.

 

Tee EU and European nations are two distinctly separate entities. It is pretty easy to google that, as well. And that is counting Italy forgiving a 40 million dollar loan in there, I'm pretty sure.

 

The European Union promised €330 million ($474 million) for emergency and long-term aid. The U.K.'s Development Secretary Douglas Alexander called the result of the earthquake an "almost unprecedented level of devastation", and said the United Kingdom committed to ₤20 million ($32.7 million), while France promised €10 million

Edited January 19, 2010 by SEC=UGA

[SEC=UGA]

And to be completely fair, here is the most recent accounting I have found. A number of these countries have increased their aid from the initial reports I read on Friday.(which incidentally had the UK, France, and a few other European countries at 5 to 10 million, the UN at 10 million, Canada at 5 million, and china at 2.3 Million, I believe, can't find the article. It was on CBS news or CNN).

 

BRUSSELS – European Union nations pledged over euro400 million ($575 million) Monday to help quake survivors and rebuilding efforts in Haiti after last week's massive earthquake.

 

The European Union Commission said it would contribute euro330 million ($474 million) in emergency and long-term aid to Haiti. EU member states also poured euro92 million ($132 million) in emergency aid alone.

In addition, the EU was moving toward sending 150 people to be part of a police force to beef up security in the quake-hit Caribbean nation.

 

"We have taken swift action," said EU foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton after an emergency meeting of the 27-nation EU's development ministers.

 

Development Secretary Douglas Alexander said Britain would triple its commitment to 20 million pounds ($32.7 million) to deal with "an almost unprecedented level of devastation." France committed euro10 million ($14.4 million) and Italy said it was "willing" to forgive Haiti's euro40 million ($55.7 million) debt on top of its aid pledges.

Edited January 19, 2010 by SEC=UGA