RB Shonn Greene

[piratesownninjas]

Weird... I thought he made a few valid points. Greene's hype was built in the playoffs. Losing Faneca might make a difference. They did bring in Holmes and Cromartie, and Revis may hold out, all of which adds to the pressure there in NY. The only potential hate was the last couple sentences about not buying into them because they had two lay down games in weeks 16 and 17 and about avoiding all Jets this year.

I counted the trades of Cromartie and Holmes as Free Agents even though they were brought in via trade. And it's not hate, as the Colts layed down. If Peyton Manning and Reggie Wayne are not playing, the Colts are laying down. My point is that this is still a team that struggled to make the playoffs last year. It's not hate, it's reality. And as far as avoiding Jets players this year...

Shonn Greene=Already said why I wont take him. He's going to go a round or two well before I'd be willing to take him.

Santonio Holmes=Not interested in a headcase that is liable to get suspended again during the season.

Braylon Edwards=Fool me once... Fool me twice...

Mark Sanchez=Low end qb backup

LaDainian Tomlinson=Someone will take him earlier than I would hoping he returns to earlier form.

Dustin Keller=I like.

[Randall]

The Jets did struggle to get into the playoffs but under a new head coach and system. They love Greene there and in non PPR lewagues I would project him as a late 1st round pick, I wish he'd catch more passes for PPR leagues and maybe he will this year.

 

Being successful late season and in the playoffs doesn't equate to hype for me. I think he'll improve this year and I don't see the loss of Faneca as a weakness as he didn't perform well last year in my opinion.

 

 

He has worked on receiving

 

 

On many levels, this will be a new experience for Tomlinson. In San Diego, he barely broke a sweat in pre-season games, but now he’ll be asked to carry a decent workload as he assimilates into the Jets’ system and tries to convince the coaches he’s still worthy of a significant role. Greene missed a chunk of his rookie camp with a sprained ankle, so his No. 1 goal is to stay healthy. The coaches are eager to see if his receiving skills have improved to the point where he can be trusted in any situation. Don’t expect to see a lot of Tony Richardson in camp; at 38, he’ll be used judiciously. That will allow to the two young battering rams, rookie John Conner and Jason Davis, to receive more reps.

Edited August 11, 2010 by Randall

[Avernus]

The Jets did struggle to get into the playoffs but under a new head coach and system. They love Greene there and in non PPR lewagues I would project him as a late 1st round pick, I wish he'd catch more passes for PPR leagues and maybe he will this year.

 

Being successful late season and in the playoffs doesn't equate to hype for me. I think he'll improve this year and I don't see the loss of Faneca as a weakness as he didn't perform well last year in my opinion.

 

 

I actually did read that Faneca fell off a little playing for the Jets...he wasn't what he was when he was a Steeler at all...

[Randall]

I agree with much of this. I don't know about staying away from all Jets this year but as of now I have mid to late first round picks in my leagues and that's just too early to take him even with my second rounder. Otherwise, I might consider him late in the second but more likely the third. Given where I know I'm drafting the third is the earliest I would seriously consider him. Granted, 500 - 600 carries for a team means he has plenty of opportunities even if sharing but like my feelings on J Charles I've gotta see more than just a few real good games to draft a guy in the top 15 - 20.

As for the LT effect, it was discussed quite a bit last year early on about how the SD O-line was a question mark and that LT might suffer. Well, he did and so did Sproles from a yds/car perspective so I'm not sure you can completely write LT off just yet.

I love Greene's upside, just not enough to take him that early.

 

 

I took him 3.02 in MSHB a 16 team IDP and like him there. It's a half point PPR and I hope he does catch a few more passes.

 

These RB's went before him

 

1.01 1. Johnson, Chris TEN RB Mon Jul 19 7:16:52 a.m. CT 2010

1.02 2. Jones-Drew, Maurice JAC RB Mon Jul 19 7:51:56 a.m. CT 2010

1.03 3. Peterson, Adrian MIN RB Mon Jul 19 4:54:26 p.m. CT 2010

1.05 5. Rice, Ray BAL RB Mon Jul 19 8:57:52 p.m. CT 2010

1.07 7. Gore, Frank SFO RB Tue Jul 20 10:15:32 a.m. CT 2010

1.09 9. Turner, Michael ATL RB Tue Jul 20 10:31:35 a.m. CT 2010

1.10 10. , DeAngelo CAR RB Tue Jul 20 10:59:48 a.m. CT 2010

1.11 11. Mendenhall, Rashard PIT RB Tue Jul 20 12:04:06 p.m. CT 2010 And so the road to the champeenship begins...

1.12 12. Grant, Ryan GBP RB Tue Jul 20 12:23:03 p.m. CT 2010

1.15 15. Jackson, Steven STL RB Tue Jul 20 12:29:43 p.m. CT 2010 Steal....

1.16 16. Wells, Chris ARI RB Tue Jul 20 6:22:28 p.m. CT 2010 I sure am afraid I will regret this pick.

2.04 20. Addai, Joseph IND RB Tue Jul 20 10:26:31 p.m. CT 2010 Pick made based on Pre-Draft List

2.05 21. Moreno, Knowshon DEN RB Tue Jul 20 10:26:31 p.m. CT 2010 Pick made based on Pre-Draft List

2.06 22. Ryan Matthews SDC RB ® Wed Jul 21 7:55:56 a.m. CT 2010 300 touches, 1200 yards, 11 TDs in the bank.

2.13 29. Thomas, Pierre NOS RB Wed Jul 21 11:41:50 a.m. CT 2010

3.02 34. Greene, Shonn NYJ RB Wed Jul 21 6:19:12 p.m. CT 2010

Edited August 11, 2010 by Randall

[Rovers]

Jets hate? I couldn't care less about the AFC East. I'm just not interested in Sanchez, Greene, Tomlinson, Holmes, or Edwards. I guess I should have said I'm staying away from every jets player sans Dustin Keller, as I think he can crack the top ten in TE's.

And Shonn Greene didn't face stacked boxes for an entire season. He only rushed for over 100 yards just once in the regular season, and scored his only regular season TD's in that game. That's the kind of hype I'm talking off. And I know that as soon as the jets cut Fanica everyone started talking about how much he sucked, but give me a break... Having a rookie replace him isn't going to help things.

And yes, if Greene injured himself in TC and then in the playoffs, that counts as 1, 2 injuries. I don't remember you being this big of a queen on the boards. So defensive.

 

 

 

Where is this Anti-Jets crap coming from? I predicted Mark Sanchez would be a better quarterback than Matt Stafford. I just don't like them for fantasy purposes, and I think it's crazy to annoint them the AFC favorites. Would you argue that they didn't have two teams lay down to just get in the playoffs? Relax Rovers.

 

I'm plenty relaxed, LOL. I just don't understand the reasoning behind any of your opinions, they fly in the face of any objective analysis.

 

First, the Jets faced a stacked box the entire year. Teams tried to force the rookie Sanchez into throwing all year long, but the Jets continued to run the ball. You want to critisize Greene for having only one 100 yard game in the regular season? Grene only got over 13 carries twice all regular season. Is he supposed to have ran for 100 yards on 10 carries? In the 2 games he did get more than 13 carries:

 

Week 7, OAK- 19 carries, 144 yards, 33 yard TD run.

 

Week 16, IND- 16 carries for 95 yards.

 

Greene had 4 games including the playoffs in which he had more than 13 carries. in 3 of them, he was well over 100 yards rushing. In the other, he had 95 yards on 16 carries.

 

Greene's YPC in the regular season was 5.0, and 5.6 in the playoffs. The trend for Greene is the more carries he gets, the higher his YPC gets. He did have 168 carries before the bruised rib injury in the playoffs. That might have kept him out for a week, maybe two. His injury history does not suggest he is brittle, not when compared to just about any other RB in the NFL. The TC injury was an ankle. Not related to his running style. Lots of NFL'ers tweak ankles. I do however have some trepidation due to his running style, but 168 carries without injury does not imply he is injury prone per se.

 

So, it was hardly Greene's fault he didn't get carries, Jones was running plenty well enough and wisely, the Jets were slow to start two rookies in the O backfield, Sanchez's growing pains were more than enough to deal with. When Greene had his opportunites, he didn't just play well, he played very well, and any objective look at his whole year proves this out. Might as well say Mathews will be a bust, he hasn't done anything in the NFL. EVERY time Greene got an opportunity to play, he played extremely well. You base your opinion of Greene not on what he has done, but on what he hasn't done when not on the field.

 

FanEca was in decline. He had the worst OG pass blocking rating in the NFL last year. His in line blocking was not very good, he wasn't a good power blocker. What Faneca was and still is very good at is pulling and blocking in space at the second level. He has very quick feet still. There are reasons the Jets cut him, and it wasn't salary based. They wanted better protection for Sanchez, and beleived Slauson who has been under O line Coach Callahan for 4 years, 3 at Nebraska and last year on the Jets, was a capable replacement. Callahan is reputed to be one of the best O line coaches in the game. Whether or not Faneca's departure will have any negative impact on the Jets O line performance overall is far from decided. Callahan and Ryan obviously disagree with such conjecture. Then they drafted Ducasse, who will need some time to be coached before he can start in the NFL. He promises to be a very good one.

 

And those dopey Jets, trying to improve the team through trades. Manning picked the secondary apart especially after Strickland got hurt. So the Jets traded for a CB and took one in the first round of the draft. Pure silliness. D backfield depth isn't important, right? They got rid of malcontent Rhodes who blew assignment after assignment last year and replaced him with Poole. Another bad move I suppose?

 

Every single time Greene got a chance to play, he was very good. That is unless his seasonal YPC of 5.0 sucks, and the 5.6 YPC he had in the playoffs says he sucks too. Last year, the more carries he got in a game, the higher his YPC was, with few exceptions.

 

Jones got every GL touch there was to be had last year. That isn't Greene's fault either, but you make it out to be one. I just don't get how you have the opinions you do, other than to say it's Jets bias, because the facts don't bear any of it out.

[piratesownninjas]

I'm plenty relaxed, LOL. I just don't understand the reasoning behind any of your opinions, they fly in the face of any objective analysis.

 

First, the Jets faced a stacked box the entire year. Teams tried to force the rookie Sanchez into throwing all year long, but the Jets continued to run the ball. You want to critisize Greene for having only one 100 yard game in the regular season? Grene only got over 13 carries twice all regular season. Is he supposed to have ran for 100 yards on 10 carries? In the 2 games he did get more than 13 carries:

 

Week 7, OAK- 19 carries, 144 yards, 33 yard TD run.

 

Week 16, IND- 16 carries for 95 yards.

 

Greene had 4 games including the playoffs in which he had more than 13 carries. in 3 of them, he was well over 100 yards rushing. In the other, he had 95 yards on 16 carries.

 

Greene's YPC in the regular season was 5.0, and 5.6 in the playoffs. The trend for Greene is the more carries he gets, the higher his YPC gets. He did have 168 carries before the bruised rib injury in the playoffs. That might have kept him out for a week, maybe two. His injury history does not suggest he is brittle, not when compared to just about any other RB in the NFL. The TC injury was an ankle. Not related to his running style. Lots of NFL'ers tweak ankles. I do however have some trepidation due to his running style, but 168 carries without injury does not imply he is injury prone per se.

 

So, it was hardly Greene's fault he didn't get carries, Jones was running plenty well enough and wisely, the Jets were slow to start two rookies in the O backfield, Sanchez's growing pains were more than enough to deal with. When Greene had his opportunites, he didn't just play well, he played very well, and any objective look at his whole year proves this out. Might as well say Mathews will be a bust, he hasn't done anything in the NFL. EVERY time Greene got an opportunity to play, he played extremely well. You base your opinion of Greene not on what he has done, but on what he hasn't done when not on the field.

 

FanEca was in decline. He had the worst OG pass blocking rating in the NFL last year. His in line blocking was not very good, he wasn't a good power blocker. What Faneca was and still is very good at is pulling and blocking in space at the second level. He has very quick feet still. There are reasons the Jets cut him, and it wasn't salary based. They wanted better protection for Sanchez, and beleived Slauson who has been under O line Coach Callahan for 4 years, 3 at Nebraska and last year on the Jets, was a capable replacement. Callahan is reputed to be one of the best O line coaches in the game. Whether or not Faneca's departure will have any negative impact on the Jets O line performance overall is far from decided. Callahan and Ryan obviously disagree with such conjecture. Then they drafted Ducasse, who will need some time to be coached before he can start in the NFL. He promises to be a very good one.

 

And those dopey Jets, trying to improve the team through trades. Manning picked the secondary apart especially after Strickland got hurt. So the Jets traded for a CB and took one in the first round of the draft. Pure silliness. D backfield depth isn't important, right? They got rid of malcontent Rhodes who blew assignment after assignment last year and replaced him with Poole. Another bad move I suppose?

 

Every single time Greene got a chance to play, he was very good. That is unless his seasonal YPC of 5.0 sucks, and the 5.6 YPC he had in the playoffs says he sucks too. Last year, the more carries he got in a game, the higher his YPC was, with few exceptions.

 

Jones got every GL touch there was to be had last year. That isn't Greene's fault either, but you make it out to be one. I just don't get how you have the opinions you do, other than to say it's Jets bias, because the facts don't bear any of it out.

You've made my point for me. Shonn Greene hasn't had to carry the load against stacked boxes for a season. He's unproven, which is why I don't think he deserves to be in the top 10 RB's or the area he's usually listed in. He doesn't catch the ball well, and who knows if he can stay healthy. Don't be so defensive and try and pull a jets bias card. It's a difference of opinion.

[Rovers]

You've made my point for me. Shonn Greene hasn't had to carry the load against stacked boxes for a season. He's unproven, which is why I don't think he deserves to be in the top 10 RB's or the area he's usually listed in. He doesn't catch the ball well, and who knows if he can stay healthy. Don't be so defensive and try and pull a jets bias card. It's a difference of opinion.

 

If you read your first post... it was rife with disdlike for the team, the players, the FO and the coach. Whatever...

 

In any case, I never said I'd draft him as a top 10 RB, what I said was if, IF he stays healthy, he's a lock for top 10. He is going to get 300 carries, if healthy.

[Avernus]

If you read your first post... it was rife with disdlike for the team, the players, the FO and the coach. Whatever...

 

In any case, I never said I'd draft him as a top 10 RB, what I said was if, IF he stays healthy, he's a lock for top 10. He is going to get 300 carries, if healthy.

 

yo you hear what dis dike said? OH SNAPPP

[piratesownninjas]

If you read your first post... it was rife with disdlike for the team, the players, the FO and the coach. Whatever...

Ok. I will re-read it.

 

 

Potentially the most over-rated player in my mind heading into drafts this season. 99% of this guys hype is based off of 2-3 games. He was dinged up and missed action at two times last season after carrying the ball 109 times. Pair that with the fact he can't/wont catch the ball enough to merit a first or second round pick.

People will point to how great the Jets were last year, but they did lose a leader at guard in Fanica. They're now going to feel all of the pressure placed on them by the media from last years run, bringing in every free agent possible, and a loud-mouth coach. Teams are going to stack the box and make Sanchez beat them. If Revis is holding out there defense takes a significant hit. I just don't buy into him or a team that had to have two teams lay down for them in weeks 16 and 17 for them to make there playoff run. I'm staying away from all Jets this year.

The only part that I can see where you'd think I had dislike for the team is calling Ryan a loud-mouth. Uh, he's a Ryan, of course he's a loud mouth. It's like calling Terrell Owens a diva. He is what he is. I think you're a bit sensitive for having an opinion that isn't in line with the perception that you have with your team. It's a discussion and I have a different point of view. Absoultely zero Jets bias, as I care not about the New York Jets.

[BS Miscreant]

I agree with much of this. I don't know about staying away from all Jets this year but as of now I have mid to late first round picks in my leagues and that's just too early to take him even with my second rounder. Otherwise, I might consider him late in the second but more likely the third. Given where I know I'm drafting the third is the earliest I would seriously consider him. Granted, 500 - 600 carries for a team means he has plenty of opportunities even if sharing but like my feelings on J Charles I've gotta see more than just a few real good games to draft a guy in the top 15 - 20.

As for the LT effect, it was discussed quite a bit last year early on about how the SD O-line was a question mark and that LT might suffer. Well, he did and so did Sproles from a yds/car perspective so I'm not sure you can completely write LT off just yet.

I love Greene's upside, just not enough to take him that early.

I'd like to know which parts of that you agree with. Most of his post was anti-Jets ranting, and, factually incorrect.

Did you read my entire post in which I explained fairly clearly where I'd be willing to draft him and the reasons for it or did you get hung up on the first line during which you feel I'm aligned somehow with what you feel is Jets bashing?

 

- Overrated, in that I'm regularly seeing him taken late 1st and early 2nd in mocks. ADP says later but I'm still seeing it.

- Relatively small sample size

- He's not a 3-down back, at least not at the moment and not with LT in the mix.

 

Based solely on performance he could be outstanding. I'm just not ready to drink the kool-aid. But hey, I'm a skeptic.

[Randall]

I'd like to know how his receiving work has improved(if it has). I have heard the Jets considered him the top RB in the draft for what they wanted last year and he has been working on catching screens and dump offs.

 

Has anyone seen how he has been doing?

[BearBroncos]

I'd like to know how his receiving work has improved(if it has). I have heard the Jets considered him the top RB in the draft for what they wanted last year and he has been working on catching screens and dump offs.

 

Has anyone seen how he has been doing?

 

I've heard that is passing game has improved but can't track that article down. However, I do have the byte about how his pass protection has improved big time. He has grown allot in the short time.

 

New York Jets RB Shonn Greene has really impressed head coach Rex Ryan during training camp. "I've been really impressed with Shonn," Ryan said. "He's much better in the pass protection game. He's stepping up. He's facing people up in blitz packages. That's something that's going to be important, obviously if you're the bell cow." Ryan went on to say the team basically has two No. 1 running backs with LaDainian Tomlinson also on roster. "Hopefully, he (Greene) won't have to carry it 30 times a game," Ryan added.

[Avernus]

I've heard that is passing game has improved but can't track that article down. However, I do have the byte about how his pass protection has improved big time. He has grown allot in the short time.

 

New York Jets RB Shonn Greene has really impressed head coach Rex Ryan during training camp. "I've been really impressed with Shonn," Ryan said. "He's much better in the pass protection game. He's stepping up. He's facing people up in blitz packages. That's something that's going to be important, obviously if you're the bell cow." Ryan went on to say the team basically has two No. 1 running backs with LaDainian Tomlinson also on roster. "Hopefully, he (Greene) won't have to carry it 30 times a game," Ryan added.

 

 

yeah, I know his pass blocking skills have vastly improved, but I don't know if he's catching the ball out of the backfield....

[Coach1310]

Regardless of what he did or didn't do.... a team like the Jets and as successful as they were running the ball last year on a defensive team with a game managing QB, the RB has to carry quite a bit of value no matter who it is. Michael Turner never carried the load in San Diego, but he showed promised and his first season carrying that load..... it went pretty well. If you can get him in the 3rd, I think you should consider yourself very fortunate. Greene in the 3rd and LT in the 8th, 9th, 10th.... then you have little to worry about. LT has lost about 2 steps and I don't forsee him being more than the 3rd down back and getting 8-10 carries a game.... the only thing that scares me is how LT factors in at the goal line.... I have no problem spending a mid to late second/3rd round pick and a 10th to grab the pair...

[BeeR]

yo you hear what dis dike said? OH SNAPPP

Don't disbespect. Serious.

 

Greene should have a great year running but couldn't catch a cold and I doubt that changes. In PPR (which it seems most are now) low-end RB1 or great RB2 IMO.

 

 

That being said, there is no question that the strength of this team is in the running game. BeeR's post indicating that Shonn Greene will get the vast majority of the work in the running game leads me to believe that BeeR thinks he should be valued kinda like Rudi Johnson was in his heyday (not sure if he'd say that, but it's the best comparison I can think of).

Missed this earlier. Yeah I think that's a great comparison.

Edited August 15, 2010 by BeeR

[Avernus]

Don't disbespect. Serious.

 

Greene should have a great year running but couldn't catch a cold and I doubt that changes. In PPR (which it seems most are now) low-end RB1 or great RB2 IMO.

 

 

 

Missed this earlier. Yeah I think that's a great comparison.

 

 

he's your Michael Turner type RB at RB2 and I think that's the role these players play in PPR leagues...

 

my RB2 will likely just be a pure runner, but RB3 and 4 will be in a RBBC where they catch often ala Hightower or Bush

[Randall]

Regardless of what he did or didn't do.... a team like the Jets and as successful as they were running the ball last year on a defensive team with a game managing QB, the RB has to carry quite a bit of value no matter who it is. Michael Turner never carried the load in San Diego, but he showed promised and his first season carrying that load..... it went pretty well. If you can get him in the 3rd, I think you should consider yourself very fortunate. Greene in the 3rd and LT in the 8th, 9th, 10th.... then you have little to worry about. LT has lost about 2 steps and I don't forsee him being more than the 3rd down back and getting 8-10 carries a game.... the only thing that scares me is how LT factors in at the goal line.... I have no problem spending a mid to late second/3rd round pick and a 10th to grab the pair...

 

 

I have read the Jets are working on him taking fewer hits do he stays healthy. Stepping out of bounds occasionally would help AP I think too and perhaps limit his fumbles.

[Rovers]

Regardless of what he did or didn't do.... a team like the Jets and as successful as they were running the ball last year on a defensive team with a game managing QB, the RB has to carry quite a bit of value no matter who it is. Michael Turner never carried the load in San Diego, but he showed promised and his first season carrying that load..... it went pretty well. If you can get him in the 3rd, I think you should consider yourself very fortunate. Greene in the 3rd and LT in the 8th, 9th, 10th.... then you have little to worry about. LT has lost about 2 steps and I don't forsee him being more than the 3rd down back and getting 8-10 carries a game.... the only thing that scares me is how LT factors in at the goal line.... I have no problem spending a mid to late second/3rd round pick and a 10th to grab the pair...

 

I think the Turner comparison is an excellent one. Turner never had near the 168 carries in a season with SD that Greene had last year with the Jets, but their stats are otherwise very similar, as is their running style. Neither catches the ball very often. Neither is a burner, but both can occassionally get loose on the second level. Their YPC's were both very good. Turner never got over 20 carries in a game (IIRC), while Greene has. Both ran behind good O lines. Both were backing up pro bowl RB's.

 

I think the Jets want to run the ball about 30 times a game, and I see Greene getting around 20 of them on a weekly basis.

[Scooby's Hubby]

+1

 

If I was going to draft him, I'd do it with the mindset that I'd likely be trading him after his frist few stellar weeks. I just don't see him being a 25-30 touch guy all season.

 

Duly noted for the BLNY draft as we are nearing your 3rd round pick. LoL

 

Non PPR - Early to Mid Second Rounder with little doubt

PPR - He drops to third round, maybe even fourth

 

He doesn't catch passes...that really hurts him, I've heard and seen nothing to indicate that is going to change.

 

Tomlinson getting carries? Did anyone watch last year? It wasn't his line that was the problem, it was his inability to accelerate and hit holes and get into space. He won't even get the business down by goal line.

 

Thank you for tipping your cards ...

[cvbfantasyfootball]

Green dominated last night against the Giants (5 yards per carry). LT is only going to be a change of pace back with a little swing pass thrown in. LT will get 40 to 50 yards a game with an occasional TD.

[piratesownninjas]

Hate much? Now that you got yer Jet hatred rant over, let's dispell your "facts".

 

Teams stacked the box last year. Nuthin new there. Status quo. His hype is 99% what? Only to people who are blinded by the light, or live in the darkness of ignorance. Allow me:

 

 

Most of his post was anti-Jets ranting, and, factually incorrect.

 

It's only been one game, but it looks a lot more than it just being my "Jets hatred"

Edited September 14, 2010 by piratesownninjas