keggerz Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 RG3 is second in the league in YPA. due in part to being #5 in YAC...he is #21 in Avg Pass Length and #20 in Avg Pass Length, completions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajncajn Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 I don't know...he's throwing to one of the best wr's in the league... Wayne played last year as well and he wasn't enough to keep the Colts from going 2-14. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 Luck seems to be the media darling but I think he would be 3rd of that trio for me. Luck having the Colts in the thick of a playoff run is simply amazing...and the Muscle Hampster is a big reason the Bucs are also in the thick of it, bu as much if not more credit goes to Schiano which is why I say Luck. Not to take anything away from RG3 but the Skins have really done a good job with play calling (IE: short passes) to help him succeed. You've just made a very odd argument for why Luck would be 3rd on that list for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 due in part to being #5 in YAC...he is #21 in Avg Pass Length and #20 in Avg Pass Length, completions. In fairness, the QB has something to do with good YAC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chargerz Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 plus add in rgIII's rushing yards and tds. love his minimal int's to boot. I agree. I voted for him in this poll although Luck is a close second, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 You've just made a very odd argument for why Luck would be 3rd on that list for you. Mis-typed...the first LUCK should have been RG3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 (edited) In fairness, the QB has something to do with good YAC. He does, but so does the play calling when so many passes are at or near the LOS.Shanny has really done a fantastic job with play calling to maximize and help RG3's performance...I guess at the end of the day I see just how bad the Colts were last year and where Luck has them this year and that is what makes me end up saying Luck...but it isn't like RG3 or Martin aren't deserving...of the three I will say that I think RG3 is the one that will be the biggest game changer and the face of the league in 3 yrs...his potential's surfaces seems to have barely been scratched so far. Edited November 30, 2012 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted December 1, 2012 Share Posted December 1, 2012 (edited) He does, but so does the play calling when so many passes are at or near the LOS. Shanny has really done a fantastic job with play calling to maximize and help RG3's performance...I guess at the end of the day I see just how bad the Colts were last year and where Luck has them this year and that is what makes me end up saying Luck...but it isn't like RG3 or Martin aren't deserving...of the three I will say that I think RG3 is the one that will be the biggest game changer and the face of the league in 3 yrs...his potential's surfaces seems to have barely been scratched so far. Agreed. If people made the case that Peyton Manning should have been the MVP last year because the Colts were infinitely worse without him (as silly of an argument that it is, because to get MVP you kinda have to, I dunno, PLAY, but you see the point), then you can make a pretty strong case for Luck for the same reason...And it isn't like they upgraded his supporting cast in the offseason either, quite the opposite with Garcon, Tamme and Saturday leaving. Is there anywhere you can say they're markedly better this year besides QB to account for a winning season? I also agree that the sky is the limit with Griffin's skillset and character, he really can do it all, but it seems obvious now why everyone was calling Luck the best and most NFL-ready QB prospect since Elway. He already has "it" beyond just the tangibles. Edited December 1, 2012 by delusions of grandeur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckDuckGoose Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 I don't see how Andrew Luck should be the Rookie of the Year, yes he led the dismal Colts from last year to this year into the playoffs, but he has thrown 18 INT to Griffin's 5. Heck even Russel Wilson has less than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Luck, and it isn't that close. Russell Wilson is as deserving as RG3. I'd put Martin 2nd to Luck. Wilson is having one hell of a season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gallagorilla Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 w the hawks schedule, you gotta give it to russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Russell Wilson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 (edited) I don't see how Andrew Luck should be the Rookie of the Year, yes he led the dismal Colts from last year to this year into the playoffs, but he has thrown 18 INT to Griffin's 5. Heck even Russel Wilson has less than that. Rookie record for yards? 7 fourth quarter or OT drives to win the game? Colts were the worst team in the league last year and then cut everyone and started over? His offensive line is awful and he has no running game whatsoever to lean on like RGIII and Wilson have? The defense has been crippled by injuries and is starting guys that are special teamers or guys that were on the street a month and a half ago? Edited December 24, 2012 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delusions of grandeur Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Wilson has been great, but it isn't like he's jsut carrying that team. They're clicking in all facets to where they could still win without him having to do anything. Luck on the other hand doesn't have a strong defense and running game to ease the pressure. It's all on him and he's delivered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delicious_bass Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 (edited) I say Luck. Asked to replace a legend and pick up an organization that had fallen a long ways down. Played well despite hugh pressure and has the Clots in the playoffs. Yes, he had Reggie Wayne but the other WR and TE were new/unproven. Running game was mediocre (at best) I would say? Defense nothing special either. RG3 definitely a close 2nd, IMO. Russell WIlson has played very well, too, but is getting a lot of support from a strong running game and defense. Substitute officials helped a little bit, too. Martin had a great season but I actually think he came into the best situation to succeed of all these players. Edited December 24, 2012 by Delicious_bass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 (edited) I'm going to say this first RGIII and Luck have been great and an honest argument can be made that they deserve it. When I look at the teams they've had to face and there schedules..... Luck Jags twice (lost to them once, ouch), Tenn twice barely scrapped bye, KC, Browns, and Buf there schedule hasn't been all that rough. They got beat up by Chicago, Jets and NE and lost close to Houston and as said before the Jags. The argument which is a fair one is just how dismal Indy was last year, which is defiantly in favor of Luck. RGIII had a tough schedule. In the first half they lost all the games you'd think they'd lose, but since week 11 they've been on fire no doubt. One game Kirk Cousins came in at the end and won and the other game RGIII didn't play and they won, hmm. Wilson on the other hand, I think has had a tougher schedule or at least as tough as RGIII. Maybe i'm being bias here, you tell me. They've won vs the Jets, NE, 49ers, Panthers, Chicago and GB (lets not let the discussion go off the rails here). The entire offense was changed to adapt to RGIII while Wilson had to learn a whole new offense. He also had to battle to win the job were it was pretty much a given that the other guys would be the starters. Of course this is just one side of the argument. I guess the reason I am bringing this up is that I think people dismiss Wilson way to fast. He probably won't get it, but I think he's just as deserving as the two mentioned above. Edited December 24, 2012 by Seahawk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckDuckGoose Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Rookie record for yards? 7 fourth quarter or OT drives to win the game? Colts were the worst team in the league last year and then cut everyone and started over? His offensive line is awful and he has no running game whatsoever to lean on like RGIII and Wilson have? The defense has been crippled by injuries and is starting guys that are special teamers or guys that were on the street a month and a half ago? I understand your point and I agree he has some great drives and led that colts team to a good record. However, I look at efficiency and he just doesn't seem as efficient as the other two. It might be a close vote but the Redskins were craptacular last year as well, the Seahawks not so much. If I'm looking at the overall package as a Rookie, Luck has the most passing yards beating Cam Newton and that's great, or that means he had to pass with no legit RB. RGIII he passes, he runs, and makes exceptional plays. He might not have as many comebacks or fourth quarter drives, but you can say because they didn't need that because he took care of the ball. Luck had to bring the back after throwing the ball away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tripleshot Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 When do they vote on this? Is it after the regular season ends and before the playoffs, or after the playoffs? If they vote after the playoffs, even if the intent is to vote based on the regular season, I wonder if how each team does in the playoffs will add more fuel to the debate and possibly influence the vote, since it looks like all three could be in the playoffs. If Washington beats Dallas and wins the NFC East, The Redskins play the Seahawks in Washington, right? Would the outcome of that game influence your vote? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenkinssssss Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 Sorry I really have to laugh at all the Luck homers in this thread. The award is called the "OFFENSIVE Rookie of the Year" - not the "Rookie MVP." Stats clearly show that RG3 and RW are > Luck. So what, Luck threw for a ton of yards vs bad teams with a bad completion rate, average TD:INT, #29 Rating, below average QBR (I could go on). Luck's last 5 games he has 1 game > 50% completion rate versus some of the worst Ds in football. If you want to argue intangibles and all that other BS which are irrelevant for this award, the Colts have beaten only 1 good team all season. Their schedule has been a joke. It's pure luck that they're in the playoffs. The Colts will be giving 6.5+ in any Wildcard game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 (edited) Sorry I really have to laugh at all the Luck homers in this thread. The award is called the "OFFENSIVE Rookie of the Year" - not the "Rookie MVP." Stats clearly show that RG3 and RW are > Luck. So what, Luck threw for a ton of yards vs bad teams with a bad completion rate, average TD:INT, #29 Rating, below average QBR (I could go on). Luck's last 5 games he has 1 game > 50% completion rate versus some of the worst Ds in football. If you want to argue intangibles and all that other BS which are irrelevant for this award, the Colts have beaten only 1 good team all season. Their schedule has been a joke. It's pure luck that they're in the playoffs. The Colts will be giving 6.5+ in any Wildcard game. Colts have played 5 games against teams contending for the playoffs and won two of them. You clearly haven't seen the Colts play, because the Colts o-line is awful. They can't run the ball and the running backs are average at best. The Colts also throw the ball down the field more than the Redskins and Seahawks do. Both of those teams have a back that has rushed for over 1400 yards. Alfred Morris has 1,413 yards. Marshawn Lynch has 1,490 yards. The Colts leading rusher has 790. Probably a little easier to throw the ball when you have a legitimate running threat. Hell, Cousins was able to lead the Redskins to a win! Seven game winning drives in the fourth quarter or OT is something that cannot be overlooked. 21 touchdowns passing. 5 touchdowns rushing. Rookie record for passing yardage. 10 wins. I understand that RGIII and Wilson have equally compelling arguments, and I could see any of the three win it, but to dismiss Luck is stupid. Edited December 28, 2012 by CaptainHook 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 When do they vote on this? Is it after the regular season ends and before the playoffs, or after the playoffs? If they vote after the playoffs, even if the intent is to vote based on the regular season, I wonder if how each team does in the playoffs will add more fuel to the debate and possibly influence the vote, since it looks like all three could be in the playoffs. If Washington beats Dallas and wins the NFC East, The Redskins play the Seahawks in Washington, right? Would the outcome of that game influence your vote? the Pro Football Weekly awards which are voted on by members of the Pro Football Writers of America are published on Jan 14th...ballots are due by Jan 5th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 I understand that RGIII and Wilson have equally compelling arguments, and I could see any of the three win it, but to dismiss Luck is stupid. They have much more compelling arguments. In any other year, Luck would be a lock, but the other 2 rookie QBs have outshined him, and in particular when looking at ball security vs. scoring. Luck: Pa - 323/599 (53.9%), 4183 yards, 6.98 YPA, 21 TDs, 18 INTs Ru - 54 att, 259 yds, 4.79 YPC, 5 TDs, 5 FUM Griffin: Pa - 250/376 (66.4%), 3111yards, 8.27 YPA, 20 TDs, 5 INTs Ru - 112 att, 770 yds, 6.88 YPC, 6 TDs, 2 FUM Wilson: Pa - 237/374 (63.4%), 2868 yards, 7.66 YPA, 25 TDs, 10 INTs Ru - 84 att, 431 yds, 5.13 YPC, 3 Ds, 3 FUM Griffin's stat line is clearly the most impressive, especially with the TD/turnover ratio. Luck has turned the ball over way too much in comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainHook Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 (edited) They have much more compelling arguments. In any other year, Luck would be a lock, but the other 2 rookie QBs have outshined him, and in particular when looking at ball security vs. scoring. Luck: Pa - 323/599 (53.9%), 4183 yards, 6.98 YPA, 21 TDs, 18 INTs Ru - 54 att, 259 yds, 4.79 YPC, 5 TDs, 5 FUM Griffin: Pa - 250/376 (66.4%), 3111yards, 8.27 YPA, 20 TDs, 5 INTs Ru - 112 att, 770 yds, 6.88 YPC, 6 TDs, 2 FUM Wilson: Pa - 237/374 (63.4%), 2868 yards, 7.66 YPA, 25 TDs, 10 INTs Ru - 84 att, 431 yds, 5.13 YPC, 3 Ds, 3 FUM Griffin's stat line is clearly the most impressive, especially with the TD/turnover ratio. Luck has turned the ball over way too much in comparison. Griffin has fumbled the ball 12 times. Only two have been recovered by the opposition. Quite a bit of luck in that. I honestly don't think Luck will win it. He has not played well the last month of the season, unless it's at the end of a half. Then he's been pretty damn good. A strong showing vs Houston might change things, but without it, I think one of the other two win ROY. Edited December 28, 2012 by CaptainHook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 (edited) I know which way I am leaning with my pick but I have flip flopped a few times...this week will hopefully make my decision easier. Edited December 28, 2012 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electricrelish Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 I know which way I am leaning with m pick but I have flip flopped a few times...this week will hopefully make my decision easier. Do you get a vote? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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