wiegie Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 It amazes me how scared some of you are of people who practice religion. 1316556[/snapback] Since you quoted me and then posted this response, I will assume it was directed towards me. Let me therefore say that you are a moran. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duchess Jack Posted February 9, 2006 Author Share Posted February 9, 2006 Absolutely. That is why we have a system of checks and balances. The House represents the teeming masses, while the Senate provides stability and a sound business climate. Both are made to balance out each other. 1316577[/snapback] ...and that's working a-okay right now (the checks and balances) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiegie Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 You went to a Catholic school, and yet you have posted many times in these forums with thoughts/ideas that would not correlate with your religeous indoctrination. 1316690[/snapback] Links please--I'm interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengal Mania Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 Since you quoted me and then posted this response, I will assume it was directed towards me. Let me therefore say that you are a moran. 1316691[/snapback] I am not a moran. I are smart. Actually, I was disagreeing w/ your idea to add conditions to vouchers directly. My comment you posted was more my general amazement about the common theme related to this that many express here, not at you solely. Wasn't meant as personal offense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duchess Jack Posted February 9, 2006 Author Share Posted February 9, 2006 I think that the idea that wiegie and I both were suggesting was doing away with public schools as they are clearly broken. I may be speaking out of turn with regard to weigie, but that at least is how I feel, and my wife is a public school teacher. I can see possibly having public schools for troubled kids that the private schools kick out, kind of one step away from juvenile detention, and for mentally chanlenged kids, but that is about it. 1316539[/snapback] so if somebody has some issues.... ADD, a bad childhood, whatever... and they are a bit disruptive in class and such.... they should be put with a whole bunch of people with similar issues - assuring that they don't learn anything? Put them in a super chaotic enviroment wherein a teacher cannot handle five of the childeren ((muchless 10, 20 or 30?)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 so if somebody has some issues.... ADD, a bad childhood, whatever... and they are a bit disruptive in class and such.... they should be put with a whole bunch of people with similar issues - assuring that they don't learn anything? Put them in a super chaotic enviroment wherein a teacher cannot handle five of the childeren ((muchless 10, 20 or 30?)) 1316699[/snapback] Not saying that is perfect, but it would be far better for that to happen where they are disruptive to other disruptive students than for them to be disruptive to all of them. However I'm one of those that feel that ADD is way over diagnosed, and is used as an excuse for bad behavior. My wife who teaches ADD students as well as mentally retarded and autistic students also believes that many of the kids in her classes do not belong, but are there because they are behavior problems in their regular classes yet their behavior isn't bad enough bassed on the number of infractions they need to be sent to alternative school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengal Mania Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 Links please--I'm interested. 1316694[/snapback] I don't know how to link to other posts, I was too busy prayin' in school. 1) You have expressed opinions (not saying ALL opinions) on this board that would align with Democrats/Left/Liberals. 2) The Republicans/Right/Conservatives are the toadies of the Religious fanatics. 3) Indoctrination by the Religious would NEVER allow a person to have contrary thoughts. Therefore, the much-feared religious agenda took a short stumble when it let you out without toeing the line. I'm gettin' punchy (and I have to leave, will revisit tonight at home) I just don't get objection to going to any school you want in a free country. Give everybody who pays taxes a tax refund. Say the public school tuition is exactly equal to the refund. Those who want public school, fine. Those who want Catholic (or any private school), use you money and go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duchess Jack Posted February 9, 2006 Author Share Posted February 9, 2006 Not saying that is perfect, but it would be far better for that to happen where they are disruptive to other disruptive students than for them to be disruptive to all of them. However I'm one of those that feel that ADD is way over diagnosed, and is used as an excuse for bad behavior. My wife who teaches ADD students as well as mentally retarded and autistic students also believes that many of the kids in her classes do not belong, but are there because they are behavior problems in their regular classes yet their behavior isn't bad enough bassed on the number of infractions they need to be sent to alternative school. 1316715[/snapback] I believe in intergration on this end, something to set a a standard - a mean. If somebody can see that they are being a dumbOprah - maybe they try. Complacency kills. Despite the perceptions, its better to be the shortest of men than the tallest of midgets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 (edited) You could easily stipulate that the vouchers could not be used at any school that taught any form of religious indoctrination. (Basically make the schools follow the same rules that public schools already follow.) 1316674[/snapback] so it's like, let's have vouchers so people have freedom of choice....as long as they choose what we say they can choose. under what you're saying, these would in essence be public schools. i really don't think we need to invent new ways to throw money at public schools. Edited February 9, 2006 by Azazello1313 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh B Tool Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 Hmmmm a political topic that has completely turned towards religion............ things that make you hmmmmmmm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 I believe in intergration on this end, something to set a a standard - a mean. If somebody can see that they are being a dumbOprah - maybe they try. Complacency kills. Despite the perceptions, its better to be the shortest of men than the tallest of midgets. 1316731[/snapback] Well first off private secular schools are set up to make money. So if a private school set up to make money thinks your kid is more trouble than the profit is worth then he is probably a dumbOprah as you say. As far an philisophical statements here's one for you a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiegie Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 so it's like, let's have vouchers so people have freedom of choice....as long as they choose what we say they can choose. under what you're saying, these would in essence be public schools. 1316743[/snapback] the system wouldn't be in the least like public school systems as they exist now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duchess Jack Posted February 9, 2006 Author Share Posted February 9, 2006 Well first off private secular schools are set up to make money. So if a private school set up to make money thinks your kid is more trouble than the profit is worth then he is probably a dumbOprah as you say. As far an philisophical statements here's one for you a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. 1316748[/snapback] Garbage. I think that a dumb kid in a smarter class will be held to higher standards. In fact the helping of explaining things might help everyone else in the class - as well as a dumb kid. (including - break out your dictionary, compassion) On the other hand. A class of dumb (misbehaved) kids is doomed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 the system wouldn't be in the least like public school systems as they exist now 1316762[/snapback] If vouchers are given, parents should be able to decide whether or not their children go to secular or religious schools. The government wouldn't be supporting religion, the parents would with what is basically a tax rebate that can only be used on education similar to an educational roth in a way, or should roths be changed to where if your child goes to a religious school like ND, BYU, Baylor etc...that you have to pay taxes on the interest earned on the investment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 Garbage. I think that a dumb kid in a smarter class will be held to higher standards. In fact the helping of explaining things might help everyone else in the class - as well as a dumb kid. (including - break out your dictionary, compassion) On the other hand. A class of dumb (misbehaved) kids is doomed. 1316771[/snapback] I can see your side of it, but unless the kid is super dumb or a real bad behavior problem then the schools will take him, because they will profit off of him being there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmanzzzz Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 alternative energy heath care reform education Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duchess Jack Posted February 9, 2006 Author Share Posted February 9, 2006 I can see your side of it, but unless the kid is super dumb or a real bad behavior problem then the schools will take him, because they will profit off of him being there. 1316779[/snapback] I've seen your idea of 'profit' and it has nothing to do with the betterment of mankind as a whole - only your own pocketbook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 I've seen your idea of 'profit' and it has nothing to do with the betterment of mankind as a whole - only your own pocketbook. 1316786[/snapback] How so? Because I don't believe government should be everything to everyone? Because I think it should be stream lined and that people should be responsible for themselves? How have I profitted by harming others? That is really quite insulting. I would think a liberal like you would understand sacraficing of the few to help the many. That is basically what the progressive tax system and big government most of you so love does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiegie Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 To be honest, I don't really give a sh|t whether or not the vouchers can get used in religious schools or not. I do think a voucher system would work better than what we have now. My comment about not letting the vouchers be used in religious schools was a direct response to Az saying that my idea had potential constitutional problems. So I merely pointed out that my idea would not violate the constitution if the ban on religion were imposed on the schools where vouchers could be redeemed. (I wasn't saying that was my preference--although I have severe reservations about the possibility that vouchers could be used to fund purely religious schools such as fundamentalist Islamic madras.) The benefits from my voucher plan come a lot less from having prayer in the classroom to having competition, choice, and a semblence of equality in childrens' education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 I've seen your idea of 'profit' and it has nothing to do with the betterment of mankind as a whole - only your own pocketbook. 1316786[/snapback] yeah well, in reality, the profit motive has done more for the betterment of mankind than so many sappy "good intentions". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiegie Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 yeah well, in reality, the profit motive has done more for the betterment of mankind than so many sappy "good intentions". 1316801[/snapback] That is almost a direct quote from Paul Krugman. (Although he was saying it with regards to free trade and markets versus foreign aid in helping poorer nations develop and get wealthier.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 yeah well, in reality, the profit motive has done more for the betterment of mankind than so many sappy "good intentions". 1316801[/snapback] True my profit motive employs about 50-60 people at a given time 1/3 of which make over $65,000 a year. But that is forgot by communists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiegie Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 I've seen your idea of 'profit' and it has nothing to do with the betterment of mankind as a whole - only your own pocketbook. 1316786[/snapback] interestingly enough--one of the best ways to make a profit (and perhaps the only way to make one in the long-run) is to do things that benefit other people (thereby causing them to give you money and hence better your own pocketbook). It might seems distasteful, but we don't live in the world we want to live in, we live in the world that we do live in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 interestingly enough--one of the best ways to make a profit (and perhaps the only way to make one in the long-run) is to do things that benefit other people (thereby causing them to give you money and hence better your own pocketbook). It might seems distasteful, but we don't live in the world we want to live in, we live in the world that we do live in. 1316808[/snapback] Apparenlty we must be doing that, because we've been profitable 58 out of 60 years. And you are right, in order to maintain clients you have to treat them well, part of treating them well is having qualified employees that know them. The best way to do that is to reduce/eliminate turnover, and the best way to do that is to treat your employees fairly and pay them well, and take care of them when things aren't going well, not just when they are going well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 That is almost a direct quote from Paul Krugman. (Although he was saying it with regards to free trade and markets versus foreign aid in helping poorer nations develop and get wealthier.) 1316804[/snapback] this must be back when he was a real economist and not a shrill partisan hack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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