LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I will not say that Green's play calling cost them this game. Any coach in the same position would do the same against a pathetic Bears offense and with a rookie QB. If you dont agree than I just cant understand your logic. However, it was poor coaching that caused the Cardinals to loose their heart, stamina, and focus in the fourth quarter. It was poor coaching that led to a hole the size of Theismans fat head on the biggest punt coverage situation of the season thus far. It was poor coaching that didnt give the right tackle enough sense to even look at Mark Anderson and leave the prized rookie QB exposed. I am not saying Green isnt a bad coach, but it sure as hell wasnt the play calling that did it. Okay, i agree. The play calling was just ONE area of his I had a problem with. You could argue it wasn't a weak point, and you'd have a valid argument. You could say any other coach would've done the same thing, and stuck with it the way he did even when it wasn't working. And you'd still have a valid argument and a great point. But I dont think it would be true if you're arguing it was ok logic in the 3rd quarter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameltosis Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Okay, i agree. The play calling was just ONE area of his I had a problem with. You could argue it wasn't a weak point, and you'd have a valid argument. You could say any other coach would've done the same thing, and stuck with it the way he did even when it wasn't working. And you'd still have a valid argument and a great point. But I dont think it would be true if you're arguing it was ok logic in the 3rd quarter. Well, since it didnt work your argument is fueled. But when there is 9 minutes left and you're up 13, I think your still in great shape. Eat the clock. Dont fumble. Dont give up a return. If they can do one of these things, ONE OF THESE THINGS, not even all of them, then they win. I actually do agree with some of your points, and if the Bears would have been moving the ball, or if the Cardinals have an experienced QB, then maybe you do keep it open a bit. I dont know if BB would have done anything different with that Cardinals team than Green did, but he probably would have with Brady at QB. And I hope that Green would have too. Never can tell. I guess we will just have to agree that Green sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebartender Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 You have to feel bad for the guy. He's done everything in his power to get this team to where it needs to be, and he has coached them well enough to where they now should be 4-2. Maybe they should have put more into building their O-line before going out and getting a stub RB. If there are no holes and the QB has no time how good can the O be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Well, since it didnt work your argument is fueled. But when there is 9 minutes left and you're up 13, I think your still in great shape. Eat the clock. Dont fumble. Dont give up a return. If they can do one of these things, ONE OF THESE THINGS, not even all of them, then they win. I actually do agree with some of your points, and if the Bears would have been moving the ball, or if the Cardinals have an experienced QB, then maybe you do keep it open a bit. I dont know if BB would have done anything different with that Cardinals team than Green did, but he probably would have with Brady at QB. And I hope that Green would have too. Never can tell. I guess we will just have to agree that Green sucks. I will always agree that Green sucks. You said if they just could eat the clock. To eat the clock, you have to get at least 1 first down. just one. that could equal like 6 minutes instead of 2. Running was not getting first downs and therefore, not eating the clock. Screw even opening it up a bit. Just some screen plays. a swing pass. a shovel pass. A QUCK TOSS. A MISDIRECTION. AN END AROUND. ANYTHING. Not run up the gut for no gain. 2nd and 10: Run up the gut for loss of 1. 3rd and 11: run up the gut for a loss of 2. 4th and 13. Punt, (but probably consider a fake up the gut) As long as there is not one person on the planet that doesn't hate Green and realize he's almost as bad as Shell, I'm happy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Standale Connection Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I love the Fire - I don't know how much more pissed and embarrased you can get, unless your Neil Rackers. What a bone head!! I wonder how many fantasy teams lost by a point because he missed that - I don't care about the Cardinals or the Bears I feel for the poor fantasy owners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 You have some valid points, however, when you say ultra conservative, you have to remember, the running game was not working up the middle. At all, and when the ball got stripped and yatta yatta it was no longer time to play conservative. If the team was motivated, that punt return never gets run back. Even with it, the rookie drove well all night, and then Green calls 2 running plays that I would bet almost equaled a loss of 2. I seriously doubt BB would've started going into his ultra conservative mode in the 3rd quarter. I can easily see him TRYING to run for one series, when it fails terribly, I can see him going for one series hard and fast trying to get up by over 20 points, THEN hitting his ultra conservative mode. Keep in mind that Denny's team had a 6-point lead with 3 minutes left in the game. There's absolutely no reason to start flinging the ball downfield Grossman-style against the best defense in the league. Especially when CHI's offense couldn't get into the endzone all game. If Leinart would've thrown a pick earlier in the second half, you would've been complaining that Denny played "too aggressively" against a very good Bears defense. And also keep in mind that when the Cards lost the lead, Green went right back to the passing game to get them in position to score. And he did it the right way: He played safely and got to the 20 for the FG. That's the right thing to do in that situation and any HC in the NFL would've done the same thing. And sure, Viniatairi would've made that FG, but it would've never come down to a game winning FG with BB at the helm. Are you freaking kidding me? Did you not watch SB 36 and SB 38? Not to mention the '01 playoff game against the Raiders. And those weren't chip-shots, either. Green is not half of half of the coach BB is. Not even half of that. BB would've made adjustments. He would've won this game.... THAT'S why I blame Denny. Not to mention they're 1-5 only beating SF with tons and tons and tons of talent. Arguably the most power offense in the league. Agreed that getting is not even 1/4 of the coach that Belichick is. Also agreed that Belichick does a far superior job of preparing his players to execute in critical situations. But Belichick would've coached the game in the exact same way that Green did last night. You can't "adjust" players who bite it in critical situations. ARI needs either better players or coaches who do a better job of preparing their players. But they DO NOT need better play-calling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexgaddis Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Keep in mind that Denny's team had a 6-point lead with 3 minutes left in the game. There's absolutely no reason to start flinging the ball downfield Grossman-style against the best defense in the league. Especially when CHI's offense couldn't get into the endzone all game. If Leinart would've thrown a pick earlier in the second half, you would've been complaining that Denny played "too aggressively" against a very good Bears defense. I am pretty sure NOBODY is saying they should have started flinging the ball downfield...I 'll say it one more time... RUNNING UP THE GUT WITH EDGE WASN'T WORKING...CONTINUING TO CALL THE SAME PLAY OVER AND OVER AND OVER WHEN IT IS NOT WORKING IS BAD PLAY CALLING... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 I am pretty sure NOBODY is saying they should have started flinging the ball downfield...I 'll say it one more time... RUNNING UP THE GUT WITH EDGE WASN'T WORKING...CONTINUING TO CALL THE SAME PLAY OVER AND OVER AND OVER WHEN IT IS NOT WORKING IS BAD PLAY CALLING... They weren't able to run the ball up the gut, off the guard, off tackle, or via misdirection plays last night. They couldn't run ANYWHERE AT ALL last night. Passing the ball was the only other optoin. But they WERE able to get the ball down to the CHI 23. If you kicker can't make a FG from there, he shouldn't be playing in the NFL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Okay, i agree. The play calling was just ONE area of his I had a problem with. You could argue it wasn't a weak point, and you'd have a valid argument. You could say any other coach would've done the same thing, and stuck with it the way he did even when it wasn't working. And you'd still have a valid argument and a great point. But I dont think it would be true if you're arguing it was ok logic in the 3rd quarter. mike shanahan did it for FOUR quarters against the raiders. some people think he's an OK coach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameltosis Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I love the Fire - I don't know how much more pissed and embarrased you can get, unless your Neil Rackers. What a bone head!! I wonder how many fantasy teams lost by a point because he missed that - I don't care about the Cardinals or the Bears I feel for the poor fantasy owners. That missed field goal won me my game! I love Rackers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Are you freaking kidding me? Did you not watch SB 36 and SB 38? Not to mention the '01 playoff game against the Raiders. And those weren't chip-shots, either. THIS GAME BILL!! THIS GAME!!! Stay with me here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 (edited) mike shanahan did it for FOUR quarters against the raiders. some people think he's an OK coach haha. Okay, now we're comparing Green to Bill AND Shanny huh? And the bears to OAK? Edited October 17, 2006 by LooGie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 (edited) THIS GAME BILL!! THIS GAME!!! Stay with me here. Yes, but you're missing the point. Belichick's teams have been in THE SAME POSITION before (tied or trailing in the last couple minutes of the game). And the Pats have come out on top, in part, because their players are better that ARI's. The play-calling from the last drive in last night's game was essentially the same as what Belichick called in the waning seconds of SB 36 and 38. LOL at all of the Monday Morining QBs who blame two fumbles, a punt return, and a missed 40-yd field goal on Denny Green. Take away ONE of those blunders and these morans wouldn't be saying crap about Green's play-calling. Edited October 17, 2006 by Bill Swerski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Yes, but you're missing the point. Belichick's teams have been in THE SAME POSITION before (tied or trailing in the last couple minutes of the game). And the Pats have come out on top, in part, because their players are better that ARI's. The play-calling from the last drive in last night's game was essentially the same as what Belichick called in the waning seconds of SB 36 and 38. Bill, jesus. THIS GAME VS THE ARIZONA CARDINALS AND CHICAGO BEARS... With BB at the helm LAST F'ING NIGHT, IT NEVER COMES DOWN TO A FG WITH A 20 POINT LEAD. arrrghhhhhhh... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 Bill, jesus. THIS GAME VS THE ARIZONA CARDINALS AND CHICAGO BEARS... With BB at the helm LAST F'ING NIGHT, IT NEVER COMES DOWN TO A FG WITH A 20 POINT LEAD. arrrghhhhhhh... Apparently you haven't grasped the difference between coaching the players during practice and play-calling during a game. I'll give you a minute to mull that over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Apparently you haven't grasped the difference between coaching the players during practice and play-calling during a game. I'll give you a minute to mull that over. oh my god. there's not an emoticon to describe this feeling... I've said the play calling was ONE of his weak points last night. if you want to argue that, fine, you cannot argue that he did a piss poor job last night, though. Player motivation, play calling, clock managment, looking smart on the sidelines. none of it. The truth is, the play calling regarding running straight at the beasr defense for 20 straight plays is what I'm bitching about. You're right. You dont open it up, air it out or anything like that with a rookie QB and the best d in the league (even if it was working beautifully). But you do need to try other run plays. You said they weren't working. they didn't try. those plays were not called. go back and look, they were nearly ALL up the gut. He was terrible last night, but his play calling was only about 20% of it. His clock managment was about 30% (meaning, he should've worked alot harder to eat more time off the clock. you have to get first downs to truly eat the clock) and his player motivation was the other 50%. 36 runs for how many yards? yah. IT WASN'T WORKING GREEN! IT WASN'T WORKING SWERSKI!! GET AWAY FROM IT! WIN A GOD DAMNED GAME Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Swerski Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 oh my god. there's not an emoticon to describe this feeling... I've said the play calling was ONE of his weak points last night. if you want to argue that, fine, you cannot argue that he did a piss poor job last night, though. Player motivation, play calling, clock managment, looking smart on the sidelines. none of it. You're a complete freak. Agreed that Green does a poor job of preparing his players during practice, isn't much of a disciplinarian, and probably isn't the best motivator, either. But the bottom line is that his team lead 23-3 at the tail end of the third quarter and blew it on two offensive turnovers, horrible specials teams play, and a complete choke-job on a makeable 40-yd field goal. Green's defense only allowed SIX points and forced SIX turnovers. And his offense put up 23 points against the best defense in the NFL. Only a moran would argue that Denny Green's play-calling last night was bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakenbake Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 ahahah sorry joining this thread a little late, but just got to enjoy watching that press conference. It gave me flash backs to this piece of gold: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaFreak Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I just heard on SIRIUS SATRAD that Denny Green let his offenisive coordinator go and promoted the quarterback coach to OC. Somebody else thought the coaching stunk! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 You're a complete freak. Agreed that Green does a poor job of preparing his players during practice, isn't much of a disciplinarian, and probably isn't the best motivator, either. But the bottom line is that his team lead 23-3 at the tail end of the third quarter and blew it on two offensive turnovers, horrible specials teams play, and a complete choke-job on a makeable 40-yd field goal. Green's defense only allowed SIX points and forced SIX turnovers. And his offense put up 23 points against the best defense in the NFL. Only a moran would argue that Denny Green's play-calling last night was bad. I think it was only 3 points. And only a moran would argue that his play calling was good. If there were some misdirection plays, or shovel/swing/screen passes, I wouldn't even be talking about play calling. Again, it was only about 20% of the problems last night, by my judgement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAUgrad Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I just heard on SIRIUS SATRAD that Denny Green let his offenisive coordinator go and promoted the quarterback coach to OC. Somebody else thought the coaching stunk! Link? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaFreak Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Link? I said "heard" not "read".... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooGie Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I just heard on SIRIUS SATRAD that Denny Green let his offenisive coordinator go and promoted the quarterback coach to OC. Somebody else thought the coaching stunk! I would attempt to use this to prove my point Swerski, but if Denny let him go, it was a bad decision and the play calling was magnificent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaFreak Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Link: http://www.azcardinals.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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