Flip_Side Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 He wasn't crying. He was "attempting" to read a speech. Pathetic. No way? Like I said I tuned in at the end, I had my tv muted. It sounded like he was crying and gasping for air..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xMRogers Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 He definitely got choked up - interesting really, but I really have to simply question his football intelligence in that he thought at any moment that was a good idea knowing it's a penalty (especially in the 4th Q of a close game) also, is it me, or does he sound a lot like Shannon Sharpe in the way he speaks....and that's not a good thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xMRogers Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 this is going to get crazy in terms of the media coverage of something that didn't happen.... btw, is stokely like 5 foot 5 or something.....he's a midget compared to everyone else on the field in that play Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belushi Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 It would have been pretty dumb if he'd been allowed to carry through with it. If he'd gotten a 15 yard unsportsmanlike penalty at that point in the game, it could have changed the outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rai Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 (edited) On the one hand good for Stokley who knew what Dumbo was up to and why it was a bad idea. On the other hand, I would have loved for the act of stupidity to been allowed to occur leading to.. 15 yard penalty and Cleveland win followed by $50K fine by Godell and hopefully Brandon being suspended by Dever for a game followed by Den missing the play-offs by a tiebreaker, in my minds eye I would have loved Brandon Marsh-mellow brain to have done his racist celebration. Edited November 7, 2008 by rai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 I'm watching the NFL network post game conference and Warren Sapp asked him about it. Marshall said he wanted to pay homage the the two African Americans in the 68 olympics who threw up the black panther fists. Marshall had a glove, half white-half black, that he said represented the progress America has made through this past election. his racist celebration. ??? Listen, I'm not saying that anyone would have figured it out, nor am I defending Marshall's thought process on it. However, it would appear that his celebration was, at least intended to be, the exact opposite of racist. To show how far we've come in 40 years. Again, I'm not saying this guy should be the spokesman for racial progress in America but don't pretend that he was trying to make a racist statement. Oh and as far as the guys in 68 are concerned? I don't think anyone who didn't have to walk in their shoes should judge them for what they did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 ??? Listen, I'm not saying that anyone would have figured it out, nor am I defending Marshall's thought process on it. However, it would appear that his celebration was, at least intended to be, the exact opposite of racist. To show how far we've come in 40 years. Again, I'm not saying this guy should be the spokesman for racial progress in America but don't pretend that he was trying to make a racist statement. Oh and as far as the guys in 68 are concerned? I don't think anyone who didn't have to walk in their shoes should judge them for what they did. Watch the interview after the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 Watch the interview after the game. That just confirms even more that rai's assessment is way off. Again, who knows if anyone would have figured it out but the intention was to be a display of unity, not a racist statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 It could have been a lot worse. He could have been reaching for something else to pull out - and I'm not talking foreign objects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rai Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 It could have been a lot worse. He could have been reaching for something else to pull out - and I'm not talking foreign objects. the full monty talk about wardrobe malfunction and Randy Moss mooning to an all new level Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 That just confirms even more that rai's assessment is way off. Again, who knows if anyone would have figured it out but the intention was to be a display of unity, not a racist statement. I agree. The election of a black president may do much to unite this country, whether you like him or not. I haven't heard any racist statements from the minority communities so far. Time to move beyond race in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 (edited) I would have loved Brandon Marsh-mellow brain to have done his racist celebration. Seems like you're the racist here. Can we please rename this thread, "Knee Jerkers Unite" ? Edited November 7, 2008 by WaterMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdmanJones Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalEmpire.com Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 The only thing that doesn't make sense to me... and MIGHT be conveyed as racist... is why tie it to the protest at the '68 Olympics? The gloved fist was a nod to the Black Panthers, no? And the Black Panthers were a militant, anti-order group that routinely made violent, threatening acts or suggestions against police and (my history books say) white folks. In essence, they were a hate group. So Marshall making a reference to a black, hate group in citing "unity" seems uninformed at best and potentially counter-intuitive to his message altogether (racist?) at worst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackshi17 Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 The barefoot raised fist actions by Carlos and Smith was a salute to Black Power not Black Panthers. They were banned from the Olympics for life. The explanation by Marshall said it was a glove painted half black and half white showing how far we have come since the '60 and 70's with the election of Obama. Good sentiment but I'm not sure it was the right place or time and I doubt that it would have been understood right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalEmpire.com Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 The barefoot raised fist actions by Carlos and Smith was a salute to Black Power not Black Panthers.They were banned from the Olympics for life. The explanation by Marshall said it was a glove painted half black and half white showing how far we have come since the '60 and 70's with the election of Obama. Good sentiment but I'm not sure it was the right place or time and I doubt that it would have been understood right away. Was it not the Black Panthers who originated the black gloved fist? I could be totally wrong (the Black Panthers and the '68 Olympics predate my by at least a decade), but my memory of Civil Rights history says Carlos and Smith were imitating Black Panther displays with their actions at the Olympics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackshi17 Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 Was it not the Black Panthers who originated the black gloved fist? I could be totally wrong (the Black Panthers and the '68 Olympics predate my by at least a decade), but my memory of Civil Rights history says Carlos and Smith were imitating Black Panther displays with their actions at the Olympics. No. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raised_fist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalEmpire.com Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 That doesn't seem like an undeniable no based on the link. Among blacks in the 1960's, socialist, anti-establishment, defiance equalled the Black Panthers. They are even mentioned as a group who used it. So just because some groups before them used it, I don't think that changes the meaning (defiance, anti-establishment) and reason why Carlos and Smith were inspired to raise their fists in a gloved display. It's not like those guys were inspired by Andre the Giant or Earth First! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackshi17 Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 That doesn't seem like an undeniable no based on the link. Among blacks in the 1960's, socialist, anti-establishment, defiance equalled the Black Panthers. They are even mentioned as a group who used it. So just because some groups before them used it, I don't think that changes the meaning (defiance, anti-establishment) and reason why Carlos and Smith were inspired to raise their fists in a gloved display. It's not like those guys were inspired by Andre the Giant or Earth First! It appears pretty clear to me: "At the 1968 Summer Olympics in Mexico City, medal winners John Carlos and Tommie Smith gave the raised fist salute during the American national anthem as a sign of black power and protest on behalf of the Olympic Project for Human Rights. For this, they were barred from further Olympic activities." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detlef Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 (edited) The barefoot raised fist actions by Carlos and Smith was a salute to Black Power not Black Panthers.They were banned from the Olympics for life. The explanation by Marshall said it was a glove painted half black and half white showing how far we have come since the '60 and 70's with the election of Obama. Good sentiment but I'm not sure it was the right place or time and I doubt that it would have been understood right away. This is my opinion exactly. He's paid to help win games and if his political display ended up drawing a flag and giving CLE good field position, possibly leading to them not winning the game... that triggers the time and place deal. Brian Billick was on Dan Patrick this morning and made that point very well. He realizes the historical significance of this past week's events and wouldn't dream of squashing another man's right to celebrate that, just not to the detriment of the team. Frankly, as it turns out, it worked perfectly. He did enough to get everyone wondering what he was up to, so the question was asked of him in the post game and he was able to explain what he wanted to do and illustrate that it was intended to be a gesture of unity. I honestly don't see why there's any need to analyze it any further. Lastly, while I agree that 68 salute was about black pride, I honestly don't understand the amount of vitriol directed towards the Black Panthers. Their methods were often horrible and warlike but they represented a population that was subject to unfounded violence and hatred wherever they went. One can perhaps make an argument now that we've done plenty to level the playing field and that has somewhat diminished the validity of the race card. However, we could certainly, in no way, shape, or form say so 40 years ago. For a nation that seems to applaud the mentality that if you f with us, you're going to get a boot up your ass, I find it odd that we bash a group for doing that very thing. Blacks did not come to this country looking for a fight. Some just happened to give us a fight once it was made abundantly clear that they were unwelcome and hated. I would have certainly preferred that none of this ever got to that point. Then again, I would have preferred that nobody was ever hated for being black. Now there are always degrees, but as someone who was far too young to understand those times, far be it from me to claim that any group was overreacting. Edited November 7, 2008 by detlef Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rai Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 another point, it's great that Obama won etc. but that's not a green light to disrupt a game and/or violate a strict game rule a-la the sharpie incident I'm fairly sure Brandon Marshall knows what is allowed and what is not. It's very clear, and even he has good intentions it's not the time or place for this especially in a close game, but even if it was not a close game it seems such a display by BM would be a selfish (anti team) act and also really disrespectful to Cleveland.. this is not the XFL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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