Randall Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 For the govt but as competition brings prices down it would save money for consumers too. For those with employer based plans expensive healthcare delays raises. CBO: A Strong Public Plan Saves Lots of Money According to Congress Daily, the CBO says attaching the public plan to Medicare rates will save even more money than originally thought: In a bid to wrangle concessions from the Blue Dog Coalition on healthcare reform, House leaders Thursday released CBO estimates for liberals' preferred version of the public option that show $85 billion more in savings than for the version the Blue Dogs prefer. Rep. Stephanie Herseth Sandlin, D-S.D., a Blue Dog co-chair, said any possible new momentum toward a public option tethered to Medicare rates is, in part, "because of the cost issue" and the updated CBO score. The original House bill required the public plan to pay providers 5 percent more than Medicare reimbursement rates. But as part of a package of concessions to Blue Dogs, the House Energy and Commerce Committee accepted an amendment that requires the HHS Secretary to negotiate rates with providers. That version of the plan will save only $25 billion. In total, a public plan based on Medicare rates would save $110 billion over 10 years. That is $20 billion more than earlier estimates, a spokesman for House Speaker Pelosi said. In other words, the conservatives want to spend $85 billion more than the liberals do. Moreover, the CBO is estimating savings to the government. That is to say, the $85 billion reflects reduced federal spending on subsidies because premiums in the public plan will be lower. Savings to individuals and businesses paying lower premiums will be much larger than $85 billion, and politically, much more important. Meanwhile, a new New York Times poll shows that the public option is stil la god 20 percent more popular than health-care reform in general. http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klei...plan_saves.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushwacked Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Az has been posting CBO projections up the ying yang for the last 6 months. I'm sure he just hasn't gotten to this one yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Az has been posting CBO projections up the ying yang for the last 6 months. I'm sure he just hasn't gotten to this one yet. They only count when they support your position. (This works for both sides) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 so, this is comparing different versions of the public option, one with more stringent government price-fixing and one with less? ok, nice try Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pope Flick Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Do it already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 so, this is comparing different versions of the public option, one with more stringent government price-fixing and one with less? ok, nice try Really. Let's compare a dog turd and a horse turd. News flash, the horse turd is bigger. Did any of you morans even READ what was linked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushwacked Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Did any of you morans even READ what was linked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 I wondered if we'd get a sarchasm or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Like Soup Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Do it already. Why the rush? I don't get this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 reminded me of this quote from this interview I read a few weeks ago: Since arriving at Harvard in June last year, he has been consultant to several members of Barack Obama’s administration, including Hillary Clinton, and is a member of Richard Holbrooke’s special committee for Afghanistan and Pakistan policy. “I do a lot of work with policymakers, but how much effect am I having?” he asks, pronging a mussel out of its shell. “It’s like they’re coming in and saying to you, ‘I’m going to drive my car off a cliff. Should I or should I not wear a seatbelt?’ And you say, ‘I don’t think you should drive your car off the cliff.’ And they say, ‘No, no, that bit’s already been decided – the question is whether to wear a seatbelt.’ And you say, ‘Well, you might as well wear a seatbelt.’ And then they say, ‘We’ve consulted with policy expert Rory Stewart and he says ...’” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Why the rush? I don't get this. Because the majority of American's are against a public option, and because so many dems voted for the stealfromus packaged, they know that if they don't do it between now and the next election there is no way they can do it. You will also note that the house proposal didn't take affect until 2013, even thought they were voting on it now. Could it be because they know it will have a negative economic impact and want to at least give Obama a fighting chance in the 2012 election? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 NYT Buries Poll Result Showing Overwhelming Support for Public Health Care Option A new NYT poll found that the overwhelming majority of the public support giving people the option to be into a Medicare-type plan. The margin was 65 percent in favor and just 26 percent opposed. This was by far the strongest positive result related to President Obama's health care reform proposal. Many readers might have missed this striking poll result. It was only mentioned halfway through the second web page in a single paragraph. --Dean Baker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicCEO Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Because the majority of American's are against a public option This is simply not true and shows that you're getting your info from poor sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushwacked Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Because the majority of American's are against a public option, Perch dropping knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 (edited) NYT Buries Poll Result Showing Overwhelming Support for Public Health Care OptionA new NYT poll found that the overwhelming majority of the public support giving people the option to be into a Medicare-type plan. The margin was 65 percent in favor and just 26 percent opposed. This was by far the strongest positive result related to President Obama's health care reform proposal. Many readers might have missed this striking poll result. It was only mentioned halfway through the second web page in a single paragraph. --Dean Baker the article you linked contains no such paragraph. if there is such a poll, your link does not reference it in any way. I read the whole thing AND I did a CTRL+F on "65" just to make sure I didn't miss something. but, you know, if you DO find this purported poll listed somewhere, I would like to know exactly what question was asked, and what the sampling of democrats to republicans to independents was -- because revealing those facts should result in some good comedy. here randull, I will show you how to do it correctly. Fifty-six percent (56%) of voters nationwide now oppose the health care reform proposed by President Obama and congressional Democrats. That’s the highest level of opposition yet measured and includes 44% who are Strongly Opposed. Edited September 25, 2009 by Azazello1313 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 the article you linked contains no such paragraph. if there is such a poll, your link does not reference it in any way. I read the whole thing AND I did a CTRL+F on "65" just to make sure I didn't miss something. but, you know, if you DO find this purported poll listed somewhere, I would like to know exactly what question was asked, and what the sampling of democrats to republicans to independents was -- because revealing those facts should result in some good comedy. here randull, I will show you how to do it correctly. Fifty-six percent (56%) of voters nationwide now oppose the health care reform proposed by President Obama and congressional Democrats. That’s the highest level of opposition yet measured and includes 44% who are Strongly Opposed. I'm going to guess the wording in Randall's poll didn't say "do you support the public option which would lead to rationing and death panels and the end of life as we know it in Amerika?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 I'm going to guess the wording in Randall's poll didn't say "do you support the public option which would lead to rationing and death panels and the end of life as we know it in Amerika?" No, but it might have asked "If there was a public option, what type of plan would you like it to be?" 65% say it should be like medicare and BAM - "NYT says 65% of voters want medicare-like public option!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Holy Roller Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 All these numbers are just make believe anyway. Someone is projecting ten years into the future? Let's just get this over with. Government control of all insurance companies. Getter done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 All these numbers are just make believe anyway. Someone is projecting ten years into the future? Let's just get this over with. Government control of all insurance companies. Getter done. Completely agree on 10 year projections. No public option, no control of insurance companie, but much stronger regulation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicCEO Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 the article you linked contains no such paragraph. if there is such a poll, your link does not reference it in any way. I read the whole thing AND I did a CTRL+F on "65" just to make sure I didn't miss something. Look harder. hint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Look harder. hint [az] [/az] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Look harder. hint well it doesn't contain a paragraph on the second page, it contains a tiny little link to a graphic. so remember my question about the sampling? 22% republican, 37% democrat, 33% independent. well there you go. The party split in the sample has Republicans at 22%, Democrats at 37%, and independents at 33%. That would make sense — if Barack Obama had won the presidential election by 20 points last November. Since Obama won by seven points, with strong support from independents and some crossover Republicans, the notion of a 15-point gap in party affiliation was ludicrous then, and is even more ludicrous now. Their July sample had a 14-point gap, which means the pollsters must feel that Democrats have gained ground over the last two months. In fact, one might suspect that the gap has narrowed since the election, especially considering the public reaction to Obama’s plans. However, the NYT/CBS polling a week before the election — when they were trying to pick the results as closely as possible to bolster their credibility — showed a seven point gap between Democrats and Republicans, 30/37/27, respectively. It seems that the NYT/CBS pollsters know how to find a reliable, predictive sample when it suits their purposes, and how to avoid one as well. Even with the artificially inflated partisan imbalance and the use of adults rather than registered or likely voters (which are more predictive), the poll has bad news for Obama. there are plenty of ways for you, randull and the ny times to try and spin it to make it look like the public is yearning for a public option, but even the times has to admit in the link randull provided that "poll shows obama losing ground on health care, afghanistan". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Because the majority of American's are against a public option, and because so many dems voted for the stealfromus packaged, they know that if they don't do it between now and the next election there is no way they can do it. The majority of Americans elected these people into Congress/POTUS too. Time to start signing those papers Obama. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Latest poll numbers show public support for current health care reforem at lowest point yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Latest poll numbers show public support for current health care reforem at lowest point yet. I am quite sure that using Rasmussen polling of a sample of only 1,000 people is not included in teh Constitution. Why do you hate America and the Constitution Perch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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