Is Health Care a Right?

[bushwacked]

Oh my how embarassing WV . . . . the CBO says it will SAVe money?

 

However this means you have to beleive the CBO . . and not just some nutbag who writes a blog . . .

 

CBO forecasts only matter for some select Huddlers some of the time. Az will post some blog disputing how this isn't accurate or how it really isn't saving money while trumpeting every anti-Obama CBO forecast.

Edited March 20, 2010 by bushwacked

[WaterMan]

Slavery

Child labor

Seven day working weeks

Strikers shot by the militia

Lynchings

Grinding poverty

Early death

Pestilence unchecked

Tenement slums

 

Yes, our nation sure did survive it's first 150 years. Ah, the good old days.

 

Let's not forget discrimination based on race, sex, religion, and disability.

[gbpfan1231]

Probably not the right place to mention this but I have never had so much disgust for politicians!! I also have never had less trust in a POTUS!!!! What a joke.

 

A health care bill will be passed by people who don't even really know what it says. Awesome!!!

[WaterMan]

Probably not the right place to mention this but I have never had so much disgust for politicians!! I also have never had less trust in a POTUS!!!! What a joke.

 

A health care bill will be passed by people who don't even really know what it says. Awesome!!!

 

It's just another day in Congress.

 

I think this bill will be less likely to immediately put people in jail like passed bills that were passed and no one knew what was in them.

[i_am_the_swammi]

we have a family in our area that is suffering thru a devastating issue with their child...she slipped into a coma just before Christmas, out of the blue, and has been in and out for the last 3 months. Their insurance is maxed, so now everyone in their church, the girls elementary school (of which my 8 year old is a classmate) and the local community is chipping in with anything extra we can to help the family. The parents are alternating staying at the Ronald McDonald house, but they in addition to being worried to death about their child, they are also strought with panic that they have blow thru their life savings, their kids college funds (she has an older sister who is 11, I beleive), and every piece of equity they have to give their young girl the best chance to pull thru.

 

Sick system that needs a complete overhaul.

 

Blog put together from the church updating her condition daily

 

Sadly, the local community, neighbors and classmates could have donated a fraction of what they have thus far if a system was in place if that required everyone to give just a smaller amount. Instead, we live in a "whats mine is mine" country, and its truly very sad and pathetic.

[bpwallace49]

we have a family in our area that is suffering thru a devastating issue with their child...she slipped into a coma just before Christmas, out of the blue, and has been in and out for the last 3 months. Their insurance is maxed, so now everyone in their church, the girls elementary school (of which my 8 year old is a classmate) and the local community is chipping in with anything extra we can to help the family. The parents are alternating staying at the Ronald McDonald house, but they in addition to being worried to death about their child, they are also strought with panic that they have blow thru their life savings, their kids college funds (she has an older sister who is 11, I beleive), and every piece of equity they have to give their young girl the best chance to pull thru.

 

Sick system that needs a complete overhaul.

 

Blog put together from the church updating her condition daily

 

Sadly, the local community, neighbors and classmates could have donated a fraction of what they have thus far if a system was in place if that required everyone to give just a smaller amount. Instead, we live in a "whats mine is mine" country, and its truly very sad and pathetic.

 

I am very sorry to hear about your neighbors . . .

[bpwallace49]

!! I also have never had less trust in a POTUS!!!!

 

If only we can dust off GWB's "Mission Accomplished" sign for when we can actually take care of our own citizens instead of Iraqis . . . . .

[cliaz]

In 1970, SS, Medicare, and Medicaid took up 17% of budget spending. In 2006, they took up 43%. This abomination will.....well, I don't even want to think about it....

[Dr. Sacrebleu]

This bill and the procedural shennanigans stinks too much for Pelosi's own House Whip.

 

just so I have this straight, you find procedural shennanigans stinky and stupid, but just a post earlier you were applauding Coburn for threatening to hold up any nomination for any post of a politician who may lose an election this coming november if he voted yes on the health car bill?

Hypocrite much?

[Jimmy Neutron]

We used to use people like you as sandbags.........

 

That was a great line...

 

In 1970, SS, Medicare, and Medicaid took up 17% of budget spending. In 2006, they took up 43%. This abomination will.....well, I don't even want to think about it....

 

That's the problem. I recently watched a program that explained that SS and MC were origninally funded at 6 and 11 times less than they actually cost today.

 

While the CBO may interpret the bill to be deficit neutral or even favorable right now - that is only based on the plan. The plan may be good - it may be bad. Based on previous government projections and management abilities...

 

A recent example is the projection on unemployment that accompanied the stimulus - they missed by a friggin' mile and explained later that they "didn't really know how bad it was before the stimulus." They got part of it right - they didn't know, or more rightly didn't have the smallest speck of a clue.

[bpwallace49]

enjoy

 

[evil_gop_liars]

enjoy

 

 

Facts is facts.

[The Mucca]

Facts is facts.

 

 

True

[bushwacked]

True

 

That's a good read, did you actually read it? Glad to know you're on board with the rest of us who don't think this bill doesn't do nearly enough. Have you contacted you're local representatives demanding a public option?

[The Mucca]

That's a good read, did you actually read it? Glad to know you're on board with the rest of us who don't think this bill doesn't do nearly enough. Have you contacted you're local representatives demanding a public option?

 

Yeah, I told them to put a 15% flat tax, balance the budget, make a law that if any administration spends over the budget it is an

automatic impeachment, then out of that budget pay for your health care reform.

 

Harry Reid didn't reply by the way, he pretty much abandoned his state.

[bushwacked]

make a law that if any administration spends over the budget it is an automatic impeachment

 

You might want to change your sig line then considering what happened to our budget under the guy you are quoting. You seem deeply conflicted in what you want to believe. You are now for more significant health care reform when you were against it and now you are against deficit spending although you admire the guy who set historical trends doing it. Fascinating stuff.

[Scooby's Hubby]

Couldn't Congress have written a better bill that would fix the easy fixes and the immediate needs and then come back and write another one to tackle the more complicated issues?

 

How can this bill make healthier people pay less on their premiums?

 

And, will this bill make it to where a small company (and I am thinking of the 10 or less employee size) can get their HEALTHY people pooled with other healthy people just like them but who are paying LESS b/c they are in a bigger pool?

[evil_gop_liars]

Couldn't Congress have written a better bill that would fix the easy fixes and the immediate needs and then come back and write another one to tackle the more complicated issues?

 

How can this bill make healthier people pay less on their premiums?

 

And, will this bill make it to where a small company (and I am thinking of the 10 or less employee size) can get their HEALTHY people pooled with other healthy people just like them but who are paying LESS b/c they are in a bigger pool?

 

2) For people who buy their own insurance or for small businesses: Instead of leaving small businesses and individuals to negotiate on their own with insurance companies, the bill would set up exchanges where insurers offer plans. Each state would set up its own exchange, but the idea is to provide a regulated marketplace to select a plan. You could look through the different available plans, compare them on one Web site and enroll directly through the exchange.

People who couldn't afford the insurance offered on the exchange would get subsidies to help them. Subsidies would be available for families of four making up to $88,000 a year -- or 400 percent of the federal poverty level. Medicaid would be available for families with incomes up to 133 percent of the poverty level. Out-of-pocket expenses would be capped at $11,900 per year per family, or $5,900 per year for individuals. That's still a lot of money, but Democrats say it's less than many are spending now. You would be required to buy insurance, either on the exchange or through your job, or pay a fine to the IRS. Small businesses would be eligible for tax credits for up to 35 percent of the cost of healthcare premiums if they offer insurance for employees.

Abortions could not be covered by plans that get subsidies; if women who use the exchanges wanted to make sure their insurer would cover abortions, they'd have to pay separately for an additional policy.

The net effect would be to dramatically reduce the number of people who don't have insurance. Twenty-four million people would get coverage through the exchanges, according to the Congressional Budget Office; another 16 million would enroll in Medicaid. Thirty-two million people, total, would get insurance who don't have it now. The exchanges, like the ban on preexisting condition denials, would be set up in 2014. Ninety-two percent of the population that isn't old enough to get Medicare would have insurance -- up from 81 percent now.

[The Mucca]

You might want to change your sig line then considering what happened to our budget under the guy you are quoting. You seem deeply conflicted in what you want to believe. You are now for more significant health care reform when you were against it and now you are against deficit spending although you admire the guy who set historical trends doing it. Fascinating stuff.

 

No what I am saying is that if the Dems want health care reform, then do it without any further taxes, and within

a balanced budget. This Admin is not even comparable to RRs. You might want to go back and take a look at

our economy under RR.

[Scooby's Hubby]

2) For people who buy their own insurance or for small businesses: Instead of leaving small businesses and individuals to negotiate on their own with insurance companies, the bill would set up exchanges where insurers offer plans. Each state would set up its own exchange, but the idea is to provide a regulated marketplace to select a plan. You could look through the different available plans, compare them on one Web site and enroll directly through the exchange.

People who couldn't afford the insurance offered on the exchange would get subsidies to help them. Subsidies would be available for families of four making up to $88,000 a year -- or 400 percent of the federal poverty level. Medicaid would be available for families with incomes up to 133 percent of the poverty level. Out-of-pocket expenses would be capped at $11,900 per year per family, or $5,900 per year for individuals. That's still a lot of money, but Democrats say it's less than many are spending now. You would be required to buy insurance, either on the exchange or through your job, or pay a fine to the IRS. Small businesses would be eligible for tax credits for up to 35 percent of the cost of healthcare premiums if they offer insurance for employees.

Abortions could not be covered by plans that get subsidies; if women who use the exchanges wanted to make sure their insurer would cover abortions, they'd have to pay separately for an additional policy.

The net effect would be to dramatically reduce the number of people who don't have insurance. Twenty-four million people would get coverage through the exchanges, according to the Congressional Budget Office; another 16 million would enroll in Medicaid. Thirty-two million people, total, would get insurance who don't have it now. The exchanges, like the ban on preexisting condition denials, would be set up in 2014. Ninety-two percent of the population that isn't old enough to get Medicare would have insurance -- up from 81 percent now.

 

 

Why would how much money I make have anything to do with the fact that I am just as healthy as those in larger groups and why wouldn't I get the same subsidy for being just as if not more healthy?

[evil_gop_liars]

Why would how much money I make have anything to do with the fact that I am just as healthy as those in larger groups and why wouldn't I get the same subsidy for being just as if not more healthy?

 

Does your current insurance give you cheaper premiums because you are super healthy?

 

Should get cheaper premiums on my home owners insurance because my house has never burn't down?

Edited March 21, 2010 by evil_gop_liars

[Scooby's Hubby]

Does your current insurance give you cheaper premiums because you are super healthy?

 

Should get cheaper premiums on my home owners insurance because my house has never burn't down?

Your home premium is valued on the cost of total repair of your home just like auto, it costs more to repair a porsche than a Kia...,you make no sense.

 

If I am a low risk but only have 3 employees then why is the guy who works for say GM with the same health paying much less? when we both burden the system the same. We are both human and are valued the same (both Porsches so your auto and home argument makes no sense)

[The Mucca]

Does your current insurance give you cheaper premiums because you are super healthy?

 

Should get cheaper premiums on my home owners insurance because my house has never burn't down?

 

 

Typically yes, an unhealthy smoker will have a higher premium than a non-smoker.

[wiegie]

If I am a low risk but only have 3 employees then why is the guy who works for say GM with the same health paying much less?

Because of problems of adverse selection.

[evil_gop_liars]

Your home premium is valued on the cost of total repair of your home just like auto, it costs more to repair a porsche than a Kia...,you make no sense.

 

If I am a low risk but only have 3 employees then why is the guy who works for say GM with the same health paying much less? when we both burden the system the same. We are both human and are valued the same (both Porsches so your auto and home argument makes no sense)

 

So you want the same premium as the guy working for GM?

 

It seems to me by creating the state run "exchange" you would now have the same options as the big group policies.