Azazello1313 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 That's not leadership - that's Congress doing the minimum possible to maintain status quo. I was using the word "leadership" rather sarcastically. Apparently, Brooks likes to have his cake and eat it too. I agree with his general argument in both columns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yo mama Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 I was using the word "leadership" rather sarcastically. Ah. Then I concur with your sarcasm. Washington is incompetent. The US is now likely to get downgraded even if the debt ceiling is raised because these ass clowns can't get over themselves and come to grips with the fact that a combination of increased tax revenue *and* spending cuts is the only long-term fiscal solution. Everyone is going to have to share the pain; nothing is sacrosanct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sundaynfl Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 You should not have your money invested in ANYTHING that you don't have immediate control over. I also maintain my long-term position of being heavy cash or cash equivalents. Have zero dollars invested long-term in stocks or bonds (munis & corporate). Even US government bonds will be too risky to hold eventually, I still think those are safe (short-term is safer) right now. Along with cash, having gold and silver on hand is smart. The deflationary depression has been underway for a couple years now and it's finally becoming more evident to anyone who is paying attention. Deflation = rising dollar and a declining everything else basically. Once the deflationary trend becomes obvious to "Joe the plumber' (the bankers already know it and are bracing themselves), the system is going to unravel in a hurry. My position has not changed in over 2 years and now more than ever. Riding out this debt-based money system anticipating a never-ending bull market is foolish. The jig is up and the bankers know it. Get out while you still can and realize nobody knows when the rug will be puuled - just know it will be pulled. I am curious as to what cash and cash equivalents you are holding?? If we default on our debt the dollar will collapse... Also, when did you change your stance on gold and silver? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 a combination of increased tax revenue *and* spending cuts is the only long-term fiscal solution. Everyone is going to have to share the pain; nothing is sacrosanct. And there, in one line, we have it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushwacked Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 And there, in one line, we have it. Yup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pope Flick Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Ah. Then I concur with your sarcasm. Washington is incompetent. The US is now likely to get downgraded even if the debt ceiling is raised because these ass clowns can't get over themselves and come to grips with the fact that a combination of increased tax revenue *and* spending cuts is the only long-term fiscal solution. Everyone is going to have to share the pain; nothing is sacrosanct. One other add on - if they do pull this off (and at this point, it's at about 150 hours and I'm kinda doubting it) and those MF'ers on wall street do pull the downgrade then I hope that's the straw to finally prosecute these ass clowns (who should already be in jail) for pulling their chit a few years ago, much less inserting themselves with veiled threats into the political process, which I do believe to be a first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 And there, in one line, we have it. We could always just close out our currency and start fresh from scratch. Who will stop us? This "world" economy has proven to be an utter failure anyway. We'll look after ourselves only with no help from outside. Unemployment would be .0001% as we cranked up factories across America. Our debt would be zero. The weak will have to be sacrificed as we re-boot the economy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 So basically there is not an American Dream as the corporations and laws have seen to that. And the best economic system in the world is about to default to the new superpower of the world, Communist China. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaterMan Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 (edited) The weak will have to be sacrificed as we re-boot the economy. I say we start sacrificing the CEOs who never had to lift 20 lbs. Edited July 27, 2011 by WaterMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 I say we start sacrificing the CEOs who never had to lift 20 lbs. I can live with that. No one on this planet that hasn't cured cancer is worth that kind of money anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brentastic Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 (edited) I am curious as to what cash and cash equivalents you are holding?? If we default on our debt the dollar will collapse... Also, when did you change your stance on gold and silver? I'm holding just cash, my friend. Cash equivalents would be T-bills. As far as gold/silver, I never really had a strong conviction either way. I thought the two were peaking (making a top) and still do but I still think it makes sense to have some on hand because of all the uncertainty regarding the financial system. Gold and silver are too tricky to speculate on, imo which is why I don't talk about it all that much if ever. Although I think the US could default eventually, I don't see it happening anytime soon. If/when the US defaults, we're all screwed but it doesn't mean the dollar will collapse necessarily (at least not initially). You gotta remember that the biggest catalyst of this deflationary depression will be mass defaults which means all those I.O.U.s go to zero. The deflation won't be in real dollars, just credit. And 80% of the credit/debt in the world is denominated in US dollars - so when all that debt gets defaulted on, there will be a mad rush for US dollars. Even if the US defaults, I'm not so sure that would collapse the dollar, at least not initially. There would certainly be some long-term ramifications for the dollar but that's anybody's guess at this point. E2A: To clarify my position on gold/silver (which isn't all that strong). I still believe they will retrace a good chunk over the coming years but if you're holding cash or equivalents, I still think it's a good idea to be diversified by holding gold and silver. This does not mean I think gold/silver will increase in value in the coming years, I'm only 'recommending' it as a diversification tool for cash. Edited July 27, 2011 by Brentastic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brentastic Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Ah. Then I concur with your sarcasm. Washington is incompetent. The US is now likely to get downgraded even if the debt ceiling is raised because these ass clowns can't get over themselves and come to grips with the fact that a combination of increased tax revenue *and* spending cuts is the only long-term fiscal solution. Everyone is going to have to share the pain; nothing is sacrosanct. I disagree. The other (better) solution is to default on our debt with the Federal Reserve - they just monetized it anyways. The plan to raise taxes screws Americans out of more of their hard-earned money while making the Fed richer. The Fed doesn't need to get richer especially considering the whole fractional reserve system is free money for the Fed at the expense of tax payers via inflation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 One other add on - if they do pull this off (and at this point, it's at about 150 hours and I'm kinda doubting it) and those MF'ers on wall street do pull the downgrade then I hope that's the straw to finally prosecute these ass clowns (who should already be in jail) for pulling their chit a few years ago, much less inserting themselves with veiled threats into the political process, which I do believe to be a first. Yep. Side note - anyone find it ironic in a vaguely amusing way that it's S&P, Fitch and the other ratings companies that are doing the threatening here? The same rating agencies who were so attached to the Goldman Sachs nutsack that they were still rating worthless scribble paper at AAA long after it was becoming apparent that the whole fraud was collapsing? They above all have escaped the wrath, such as it is, of the public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheikYerbuti Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 As of tomorrow morning I'm roughly 95% in cash. I can't have my net worth riding on the whims of people who act like they're 4 years old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Holy Roller Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 Yep. Side note - anyone find it ironic in a vaguely amusing way that it's S&P, Fitch and the other ratings companies that are doing the threatening here? The same rating agencies who were so attached to the Goldman Sachs nutsack that they were still rating worthless scribble paper at AAA long after it was becoming apparent that the whole fraud was collapsing? They above all have escaped the wrath, such as it is, of the public. Excellent observation. Like an ugly girl making fun of the retarded kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 As of tomorrow morning I'm roughly 95% in cash. I can't have my net worth riding on the whims of people who act like they're 4 years old. Gonna ride it out. Too many penalties if I need to move back in quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 I'm holding just cash, my friend. Cash equivalents would be T-bills. As far as gold/silver, I never really had a strong conviction either way. I thought the two were peaking (making a top) and still do but I still think it makes sense to have some on hand because of all the uncertainty regarding the financial system. Gold and silver are too tricky to speculate on, imo which is why I don't talk about it all that much if ever. Although I think the US could default eventually, I don't see it happening anytime soon. If/when the US defaults, we're all screwed but it doesn't mean the dollar will collapse necessarily (at least not initially). You gotta remember that the biggest catalyst of this deflationary depression will be mass defaults which means all those I.O.U.s go to zero. The deflation won't be in real dollars, just credit. And 80% of the credit/debt in the world is denominated in US dollars - so when all that debt gets defaulted on, there will be a mad rush for US dollars. Even if the US defaults, I'm not so sure that would collapse the dollar, at least not initially. There would certainly be some long-term ramifications for the dollar but that's anybody's guess at this point. E2A: To clarify my position on gold/silver (which isn't all that strong). I still believe they will retrace a good chunk over the coming years but if you're holding cash or equivalents, I still think it's a good idea to be diversified by holding gold and silver. This does not mean I think gold/silver will increase in value in the coming years, I'm only 'recommending' it as a diversification tool for cash. the fundamentals are in place for gold and silver to take off....but that really may not even fully transpire until 2016....it's going to take some years for some things to unravel.....but with the way things are going, I may feel good about unloading my metals within the next 6-9 months if the price is right... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brentastic Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 the fundamentals are in place for gold and silver to take off....but that really may not even fully transpire until 2016....it's going to take some years for some things to unravel.....but with the way things are going, I may feel good about unloading my metals within the next 6-9 months if the price is right... I agree about your short to intermdediate term call of selling. I'm just not a big metal follower but gun-to-my-head I'd say gold/silver will pullback quite a bit before making any sort of substantial new high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 I agree about your short to intermdediate term call of selling. I'm just not a big metal follower but gun-to-my-head I'd say gold/silver will pullback quite a bit before making any sort of substantial new high. I agree with what you say partially..... with gold? no with silver? yes silver is just simply more volatile by nature but gold just goes up and has gone up for a decade straight - I see no change in that....my money for the next 5 years would be on silver and then move all my silver into gold after that if I was into this long term but I don't think things will get that bad, I will be happy with probably more than tripling my money over 3.5 years of investing in metals and then moving that into real estate.... between fall and spring will be the time to do that imo....if not, I will hold onto the cash from my metals and wait because I don't think the time to buy will be much further away than that - but I could be wrong...this stuff can tend to be umm...unpredictable... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Irish Doggy Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 I'm feeling Monday will be the day to buy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 As of tomorrow morning I'm roughly 95% in cash. I can't have my net worth riding on the whims of people who act like they're 4 years old. I moved mine over about a week and a half ago. Figured the downside far outweighs the upside until this mess is figured out. It ain't like Fidelity Investments little green line told me to bail last time and then get back in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 I agree about your short to intermdediate term call of selling. I'm just not a big metal follower but gun-to-my-head I'd say gold/silver will pullback quite a bit before making any sort of substantial new high. I also wanted to link this clip of Ron Paul vs Ben Bernanke which is comedy gold if you haven't seen it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBoog Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 Proverbs 22:26-27 (NIV) 26 Do not be one who shakes hands in pledge or puts up security for debts; 27 if you lack the means to pay, your very bed will be snatched from under you. Seems pretty clear to me. My sleep number is 55. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 "Unfortunately, Congress consistently brings the government to the edge of default before facing its responsibility. This brinkmanship threatens the holders of government bonds and those who rely on Social Security and veterans benefits. Interest markets would skyrocket. Instability would occur in financial markets and the federal deficit would soar. "The United States has a special responsibility to itself and the world to meet its obligations. It means we have a well-earned reputation for reliability and credibility -- two things that set us apart in much of the world." Ronald Reagan 1987 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brentastic Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 I also wanted to link this clip of Ron Paul vs Ben Bernanke which is comedy gold if you haven't seen it.... From 4:12 on is simply comical. And you can tell Paul has his brain working. Ben is really focusing in on his questions. He gets caught in a lie and it's so obvious. Wow. And people still buy into this scheme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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