Good article about how "flat" our tax system is

[H8tank]

I pay high taxes in my state and am happy to do so because my state takes care of the old, the disabled, the mentally handicapped, pays teachers, cops and firemen far more than almost the whole country. I expect my federal taxes to be used to help people also.

 

 

I also GUARANTEE you have a higher than average crime rate and a below average public school system.

 

Poor people are poor by CHOICE. To think or say otherwise you are a fektard idiot.

 

I hope I catch a poor person in my yard so I can excercise "make my day" rights. Stupid lazy class should be ground into food for animal shelters.

[Meat Face]

I hope I catch a poor person in my yard so I can excercise "make my day" rights.  Stupid lazy class should be ground into food for animal shelters.

 

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But, H8, what do you *really* think?

[Puddy]

I can excercise "make my day" rights. 

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Well all know those are privileges.

[skins]

I also GUARANTEE you have a higher than average crime rate and a below average public school system.

 

Poor people are poor by CHOICE. To think or say otherwise you are a fektard idiot.

 

I hope I catch a poor person in my yard so I can excercise "make my day" rights.  Stupid lazy class should be ground into food for animal shelters.

 

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Yer a slow. My county has crime levels far far below average. The only sirens we hear are ambulances picking up the old rich people who have fallen down.

 

We also have a public school system that is 17th largest in the country, graduates 92% of all students, and has an overall 1102 SAT average. We spend $10,500 per student (US average is around $8000). Demographics (cause I know how much this matters to you):

 

African American: 22.1%

American Indian: 0.3%

Asian American: 14.3%

Hispanic: 18.7%

White: 44.6%

 

Our public school system that has been ranked in or around the ten best counties in the country for decades. Our per capita income is top ten in counties also. 60% of the county has a college degree or higher (Maryland is 3d highest state).

 

Yer guarantee is worthless, H8er. Try again. High taxes, low crime, great services, tons of jobs, smart educated people, as blue a state as you could ask for. You should visit sometime.

[godtomsatan]

I hope I catch a poor person in my yard so I can excercise "make my day" rights.

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Isn't the judicial system stacked against people protecting their property?

 

Careful what you do, H8, you may end up with your head over a toilet, and your rearend as the depository for every higher crimerate statistic in the state.

[Meat Face]

Yer a slow. My county has crime levels far far below average. The only sirens we hear are ambulances picking up the old rich people who have fallen down.

 

We also have a public school system that is 17th largest in the country, graduates 92% of all students, and has an overall 1102 SAT average. We spend $10,500 per student (US average is around $8000). Demographics (cause I know how much this matters to you):

 

African American: 22.1%

American Indian: 0.3%

Asian American: 14.3%

Hispanic: 18.7%

White: 44.6%

 

Our public school system that has been ranked in or around the ten best counties in the country for decades. Our per capita income is top ten in counties also. 60% of the county has a college degree or higher (Maryland is 3d highest state).

 

Yer guarantee is worthless, H8er. Try again. High taxes, low crime, great services, tons of jobs, smart educated people, as blue a state as you could ask for. You should visit sometime.

 

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I'm only here to point out something (objectively): skins, you initially mentioned state taxes, and that's what H8 responded to. For crime you responded about your county, not the state. I thought that was not a fair comparison, so I looked up the info and found this...

link

the following is from year 2000

Maryland population = 19th (of 50 states)

Crime Index = 12th (of 50)

Violent crime = 3rd (of 50), 2nd in 2002

Property = 17th (of 50)

Murder = 3rd (of 50)

Rapes = 30th (of 50)

Robbery = 1st (of 50)

Aggravated Assualt = 5th (of 50)

Burglary = 21st (of 50)

Larceny = 19th (of 50)

Vehicle Theft = 6th (of 50)

 

so for crime, MD is above average (in a bad way)...otherwise the overall crime index would have been 19th (to match the population).

 

 

On to education, seems like you may have presented hybrid state/county info.

For 2000 those stats you gave do not seem to be accurate.

 

State of Maryland Demographics:

White (non-hispanic): 62.1%

Black: 27.9%

Hispanic: 4.3%

Asian: 4%

 

As you'll see on that page I linked, the SAT scores could not possibly be that high because not even one single ethnic group averaged 1102 (year 2002). The state average comes out to about 1000 when accounting for all ethnic groups.

White: 1092

Black: 848

Native: 899

Asian: 1092

MExican: 1022

Puerto Rican: 987

other Hispanic: 974

 

Nothing looks spectacular here

Your school expenditure data doesn't seem to be correct although I don't know what year this page refers to.

75% state graduation rate this is class of 1998.

 

I'm tired now.

[skins]

I'm only here to point out something (objectively):  skins, you initially mentioned state taxes, and that's what H8 responded to.  For crime you responded about your county, not the state.  I thought that was not a fair comparison, so I looked up the info and found this...

link

the following is from year 2000

Maryland population = 19th (of 50 states)

Crime Index = 12th (of 50)

Violent crime = 3rd (of 50), 2nd in 2002

Property = 17th (of 50)

Murder = 3rd (of 50)

Rapes = 30th (of 50)

Robbery = 1st (of 50)

Aggravated Assualt = 5th (of 50)

Burglary = 21st (of 50)

Larceny = 19th (of 50)

Vehicle Theft = 6th (of 50)

 

so for crime, MD is above average (in a bad way)...otherwise the overall crime index would have been 19th (to match the population).

On to education, seems like you may have presented hybrid state/county info.

For 2000 those stats you gave do not seem to be accurate. 

 

State of Maryland Demographics:

White (non-hispanic): 62.1%

Black: 27.9%

Hispanic: 4.3%

Asian: 4%

 

As you'll see on that page I linked, the SAT scores could not possibly be that high because not even one single ethnic group averaged 1102 (year 2002).  The state average comes out to about 1000 when accounting for all ethnic groups.

White: 1092

Black: 848

Native: 899

Asian: 1092

MExican: 1022

Puerto Rican: 987

other Hispanic: 974

 

Nothing looks spectacular here

Your school expenditure data doesn't seem to be correct although I don't know what year this page refers to.

75% state graduation rate this is class of 1998.

 

I'm tired now.

 

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What does Baltimore have to do with where I live? It is over an hour away. Do you measure where you live based upon statistics for Compton?

 

When I say state I mean state and LOCAL taxes as distinguished with federal taxes. My county has an income tax and combined state and county income tax is aroung 40% of federal income taxes. I pay high state and LOCAL taxes and the services that directly impact me are state and LOCAL. All of the information I linked to was for my county, not Maryland, and I made that clear. So trying to compare the two isnt going to get you far because when you average in Bawlmer everything gets lowered.

 

By the way, Maryland overall for year 2004 was ranked 5th best state to raise a child.

 

Thanks for playing, Meat, even if yer effort wasnt on point.

[Meat Face]

What does Baltimore have to do with where I live? It is over an hour away. Do you measure where you live based upon statistics for Compton?

 

When I say state I mean state and LOCAL taxes as distinguished with federal taxes. My county has an income tax and combined state and county income tax is aroung 40% of federal income taxes. I pay high state and LOCAL taxes and the services that directly impact me are state and LOCAL. All of the information I linked to was for my county, not Maryland, and I made that clear. So trying to compare the two isnt going to get you far because when you average in Bawlmer everything gets lowered.

 

By the way, Maryland overall for year 2004 was ranked 5th best state to raise a child.

 

Thanks for playing, Meat, even if yer effort wasnt on point.

 

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So let me get this straight. You mention paying high state taxes and being proud of it. H8 says something in response to your high state taxes. You defend yourself with county stats, even though we're discussing the state, not your county. I show the actual state stats. You whine about it.

 

gotcha.

[H8tank]

Hey skins, checkmate bro, you just got bi+chslapped.

[skins]

So let me get this straight.  You mention paying high state taxes and being proud of it.  H8 says something in response to your high state taxes.  You defend yourself with county stats, even though we're discussing the state, not your county.  I show the actual state stats.  You whine about it.

 

gotcha. 

 

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Great logic, mini-Thews. I mention paying high state taxes and loving the services I get in return. I dont say state and local though I am thinking it. I abjectly apologize. H8 says my schools and crime are bad. I dont think of crime and schools on the state level and so respond with local county figures.

 

You are still stinging because I called you greedy like a Republican and fascinated like a kid with trendy political fads, and you want to pick at some bs, so you come along to point out that overall Maryland stats are worse than my county.

 

Good one. You got me. I was trying to fool everyone.

[H8tank]

I dont think of crime and schools on the state level and so respond with local county figures.

 

So let me get this straight... although you are flat wrong, I'll play along. You point to your high state taxes as a good thing and the proof is the county you live in and it supposed low crime, whats the excuse for the other county's in your state doing horrible? Are they sending tax money in just to help your county out?

 

Don't you always rail againts the Red States being subsidized by the blue states?

 

You got served homey, your state has some of the highest taxes in the nation, and the one of the highest crimes rates and worst school systems. Typical liberal communist utopia, you screw all the minorites and keep all the money to yourself and the fellow elitests all bunch up in your gated communities and brag about how diverse you are while the fros kill each other in the streets.

[Puddy]

Nothing sadder than MH on MH crime, really. We're headed for self-destruction.

[Azazello1313]

I shouldnt say you are a Republican, just that you sound like one. You want me to provide evidence that poor people arent lazier than the middle class? 

 

No thanks. I am content to let you keep believing that. Tip though, I wouldnt say it out loud around people you dont know very well. They might think yer a slow.

 

Libertarianism! Wow! Fair tax! Wow! Get rid if social security! More money in my pocket! Yer like an excited kid with new toys.

 

About my beliefs, I think there will always be poor people. I think a society and an individual are both measured on how they help others. I sit on the board of directors of a nonprofit and give far more than just money. I pay high taxes in my state and am happy to do so because my state takes care of the old, the disabled, the mentally handicapped, pays teachers, cops and firemen far more than almost the whole country. I expect my federal taxes to be used to help people also.

 

If you disagree with those values, fine. So far, most of what I pick up from yer political positions is that you want more money in yer pocket and you kind of like trendy stuff. I can relate, trust me. I am a clawing aggressive bassturd (lawyer remember). I just dont only think about myself.

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bottom line is skins just wants his republican government to take all his money and thus to shift the balance of power between the individual and his republican tom delay government heavily in favor of the republican government. why? you'll have to figure that one out yourself.

Edited April 24, 2005 by Azazello1313

[Azazello1313]

I didn't read the artilce, but doesn't this argument assume the tax rate for the top 1% was set at the proper level when the study began?  You say it's flatter now and therefore unfair... but maybe it was too steep before?

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also notice that the article takes 1979 as its baseline. the end of the carter era. this is not a coincidence. if it took 1983 as it's baseline it would tell a completely different story.

[skins]

So let me get this straight... although you are flat wrong, I'll play along.  You point to your high state taxes as a good thing and the proof is the county you live in and it supposed low crime, whats the excuse for the other county's in your state doing horrible?  Are they sending tax money in just to help your county out? 

 

Don't you always rail againts the Red States being subsidized by the blue states?

 

You got served homey, your state has some of the highest taxes in the nation, and the one of the highest crimes rates and worst school systems.  Typical liberal communist utopia, you screw all the minorites and keep all the money to yourself and the fellow elitests all bunch up in your gated communities and brag about how diverse you are while the fros kill each other in the streets.

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What a slow you are. I didnt look into the accuracy of Meat's state facts, but Maryland school systeme are overall well above the national average. Overall crime in Maryland is probably average taking Bawlmer into account. The rest of yer assertions are just typical H8 made up hooey. Screw the minorities? Yer hilarious.

 

My county has its own property taxes to pay for our schools and its own income taxes. The other counties in my state arent doing horrible. Downtown Bawlmer is urban and has an inner city and attendant education and crime statistics. That pulls the averages down.

 

As for gated communities, you got me there. My condo development actually does have gates. I am guilty as charged and guilty of being kind of white.

Edited April 24, 2005 by skins

[Squeegiebo]

So, is it the fault of a poor kid that he's born into a crappy situation?  No. 

Is it his fault if he doesn't take advantage of all the great opportunities America has to offer - college, etc?  Yes.

Is it the fault of more wealthy people (you, for example) that the poor are the way they are?  No.

Should you be required to subsidize someone who chooses to sit on their ass their whole life?  No.

Can you if you want to?  Yes, it's called charity.

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Do you really think all poor people are poor becase they choose to sit on their asses their whole lives? That certainly may explain some of them, but things like being born stupid, or disabled, or into a poor family that could not afford to pay for a decent education can certainly explain a lot of them too.

 

What are all these great opportunities these poor kids have if you take away tax-funded programs? Tax dollars pay for school, tax dollars pay for grant programs, tax dollars pay for guaranteed student loans. Are you seriously suggesting that these same opportunities will be there if we rely on charity to fund them? I wasn't born into a poor family, and I certainly could not have obtained the education I did without tax dollars.

 

I have no sympathy for the people who are broke because they're lazy, and I'm certainly not happy that many people take advantage of welfare programs to subsidize that lifestyle. But I don't think that those people negate the need for social programs, and I certainly don't think our society would benefit from making it even more difficult for children born into unfortunate circumstances to reach their potentials. I'm more than happy to pay higher taxes for these programs, if only for the selfish reason that one of those kids who otherwise would never have had the ability to get the education ends up being the doctor who keeps me healty, or the lawyer who wins my case, or the scientist who figures out cold fusion or the cure for cancer, or a President.

 

But, then again, I am a commie.

[H8tank]

But I don't think that those people negate the need for social programs,

 

Would you support a program that has 7 abusers for every 2 people helped?

[Yukon Cornelius]

Would you support a program that has 7 abusers for every 2 people helped?

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what are you talking about... special intrest money or somthing

[Meat Face]

Do you really think all poor people are poor becase they choose to sit on their asses their whole lives? 

 

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I'm just saying I don't feel sorry for the ones that don't try to do anything about their situation. Not in America. If you work your butt off, you can dig yourself out of crap.

 

edit: Also, regarding education, no one is too poor to get a college degree. My girlfriend got into Duke, but had absolutely zero money to pay for it (very tiny family was VERY poor). She took out loans to pay for every cent that was not paid for by grants, etc. You can make it happen if you really want it. I don't feel sorry for lazy douchebags.

Edited April 25, 2005 by Meat Face

[Azazello1313]

I'm just saying I don't feel sorry for the ones that don't try to do anything about their situation.  Not in America.  If you work your butt off, you can dig yourself out of crap.

 

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i think that's true without question. who are the poor in america? from what i've seen, mostly they're either families (unsually single-parent) who have fallen on rough times (and i'm all for helping this category of folks in some way, though creating government dependency is probably the worst thing we could do for them), or they're people who just don't try. maybe they don't try because they're mentally ill, or drug-dependent, or because life has just dealt them a terrible series of blows, or maybe they are just plain lazy. but it's awfully hard for society as a whole, through their government, to help people who just won't try to help themselves.

[godtomsatan]

Would you support a program that has 7 abusers for every 2 people helped?

 

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What program has 7 abusers for every 2 people helped? I ask out of ignorance of what you are referring to.

 

Or were you making that number up?

[Yukon Cornelius]

What program has 7 abusers for every 2 people helped? I ask out of ignorance of what you are referring to.

 

Or were you making that number up?

 

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of course he is

[H8tank]

What program has 7 abusers for every 2 people helped? I ask out of ignorance of what you are referring to.

It's a theoretical question douchebag.

 

Either answer it or shut the F up like yuke the illiterate public education characature.

[Squeegiebo]

She took out loans to pay for every cent that was not paid for by grants, etc. 

 

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Government grants? Federally-subsidized loans?

[Yukon Cornelius]

It's a theoretical question douchebag.

 

Either answer it or shut the F up like yuke the illiterate public education characature.

 

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what the hell is a theater question... like how are the back drops comming along