Press 1 For English

[detlef]

Sorry but that is the point. An American should NOT be excluded from a job that does NOT require a second language (and frankly, that needs to be substantiated!), though the employer would prefer a second language speaking person because of his/her preference. Disregard ethnocentrism if you want, but it can be a case for reverse discrimination! A national language could help to prevent discriminatory hirings due to an employer's preference/prejudice to hire "Their Own"! Let's face it, many low end jobs (7-11, Macs, White Hen, etc.) are controlled by non-Americans. They might want to hire "their own" for many reasons (CONTROL, subservience, dominance, etc.) . So an American is disqualified because they don't know a second language for cavalier reasons................That's BS!

And an employer should not be bullied into thinking that speaking a second language is no less important than many of the other skills required of the job. An employer should not have to jeapordize his business by having to hire someone who will lose him money. If I run a BK in a neighborhood that is primarily latino, I will cost me money if my manager does not speak any spanish. Why shouldn't I be able to decide that is an important skill that all manager applicants have? Forget dealing with the employees, what about the customers?

 

You can go ahead and declare English the official language in the US, but it isn't the one that's gonna make me money at my BK.

 

So, now I gotta stick some redneck who thinks it's lame that he should learn another language to manage my BK in the middle of the freaking barrio. How's that going to work for anyone? Anyone who complains about Affirmative Action shouldn't be much of a fan of that either.

[Bill Swerski]

And an employer should not be bullied into thinking that speaking a second language is no less important than many of the other skills required of the job.

 

And American employees, who are full citizens that have been working and paying taxes into the system for years, shouldn't be discriminated against because their employers suddenly feel the need to hire people who don't speak the de-facto official language that has been taught in this nation's public schools for centuries.

 

An employer should not have to jeapordize his business by having to hire someone who will lose him money.

 

If I run a BK in a neighborhood that is primarily latino, I will cost me money if my manager does not speak any spanish. Why shouldn't I be able to decide that is an important skill that all manager applicants have? Forget dealing with the employees, what about the customers?

 

If the job description specifically calls for fluency in Spanish, then you're within your right to do so. But you can't suddenly fire or demote an existing manager for such a reason.

 

So, now I gotta stick some redneck who thinks it's lame that he should learn another language

 

So, the American citizen who doesn't know Spanish and doesn't feel the need to cater to all of the major immigrant groups by becoming fluent in a dozen different languages is a "redneck," yet the immigrant who doesn't know a lick of English and expects all of America to cater to him/her is simply an "immigrant." How typical.

Edited July 31, 2007 by Bill Swerski

[H8tank]

If I run a BK in a neighborhood that is primarily latino, I will cost me money if my manager does not speak any spanish.

 

 

THANK YOU!!!!

 

This single sentence has made your whole arguement nothing more that vocal flatulence.

 

I feel sorry for you... one of your beaners is going to typhoid your ass.

[AtomicCEO]

People like money.

 

If a company can make more money by supporting two languages, I encourage it.

 

The rest of this is masturbation.

[evil_gop_liars]

People like money.

 

If a company can make more money by supporting two languages, I encourage it.

 

 

ummm, America is free market English only system....please move to any number of countries in the world. TIA

[detlef]

 

THANK YOU!!!!

 

This single sentence has made your whole arguement nothing more that vocal flatulence.

 

I feel sorry for you... one of your beaners is going to typhoid your ass.

Oh well gee, you got me there. Lookie! Lookie! Detlef made a typo! Ooh! Ooh!

 

Well H8, that's pretty much as close as you are ever going to get to pwning me, so I hope you enjoy it.

[isleseeya]

I find a lot of this nuts

 

Is it ok that so many languages are spoken in US ? Sure , its america and has been a melting pot for many , many years ...

 

Is it ok for companies to favor bilingual employees if it helps that business make money ? Sure no problem

 

But the fact that we may be making it easier for foreigners to not learn english and allow them a free pass using their native language only without having to learn english and or allowing them to get by 100 percent without learning english is wrong in my opinion

 

As was said many times in this thread , if anyone of us moved to a south american country we would have to learn spanish to really have any chance of survival and living a normal life with a job etc ..we are making it too easy right now in the US and it was not always this way

 

In the 40's , 50's , etc , this was not always the case ...immigrants did not have it so easy and learning english was nearly a must if you wanted to survive in the US

[detlef]

And American employees, who are full citizens that have been working and paying taxes into the system for years, shouldn't be discriminated against because their employers suddenly feel the need to hire people who don't speak the de-facto official language that has been taught in this nation's public schools for centuries.

If the job description specifically calls for fluency in Spanish, then you're within your right to do so. But you can't suddenly fire or demote an existing manager for such a reason.

So, the American citizen who doesn't know Spanish and doesn't feel the need to cater to all of the major immigrant groups by becoming fluent in a dozen different languages is a "redneck," yet the immigrant who doesn't know a lick of English and expects all of America to cater to him/her is simply an "immigrant." How typical.

I haven't said it is OK to demote anyone for not speaking another language.

 

I think that the fundamental difference between our stances is the fact that I see learning another language as way to keep up with the changing times and stay competitive in the job market in much the same way that one must adapt to other changes like technology. Thus, those prepared to bring those additional skills to the workplace should be rewarded. Now, since most things are net zero gain. If someone is being rewarded, someone else is being passed over. Much like the fact that there have always been people in this country who don't speak English well, better adapted workers have always managed to move up the ladder more quickly. Neither of these things are new. The only new thing is that everything is more and more competitive. Once upon a time, you could have a 3 point something and some good test scores and get into a school like UC Berkeley. Now you have to have like a 4.5, 1500 SAT and be a member of like 17 school clubs. Similarly. employers are looking for more and more to differentiate candidates for everything.

 

I do find it odd that anyone who supports the ideals of capitalism would have a problem with this.

 

I would also like to add that nearly all immigrant workers I have ever worked along side or above were eagerly learning English as quickly as they could. It's just that they didn't magically become fluent the second they arrived here so giving them options in their native language really just eases the transition. You guys keep referring to this mass of immigrants who "refuse to learn English" and I really don't think it's as big a group as you claim.

 

Lastly, in regards to the "redneck" statement. I think that anyone who stubbornly refuses to adapt to changing times and willfully chooses ignorance over empowerment is foolish. So, perhaps I should have called him a fool, rather than a redneck. My apologies to all rednecks.

[detlef]

I find a lot of this nuts

 

Is it ok that so many languages are spoken in US ? Sure , its america and has been a melting pot for many , many years ...

 

Is it ok for companies to favor bilingual employees if it helps that business make money ? Sure no problem

 

But the fact that we may be making it easier for foreigners to not learn english and allow them a free pass using their native language only without having to learn english and or allowing them to get by 100 percent without learning english is wrong in my opinion

 

As was said many times in this thread , if anyone of us moved to a south american country we would have to learn spanish to really have any chance of survival and living a normal life with a job etc ..we are making it too easy right now in the US and it was not always this way

 

In the 40's , 50's , etc , this was not always the case ...immigrants did not have it so easy and learning english was nearly a must if you wanted to survive in the US

As I responded to your post about your parents. I think you need to substitute "thrive" for "survive". Then, just like now, you could survive in the US if you didn't want to learn English. You would just be destined to be a laborer. Your parents obviously had higher aspirations and thus adapted. This is commendable and is really no different than the current environment.

[evil_gop_liars]

My only problem with a bilingual America, is when you go to your kids assembly at school you have to spend twice as long in a 150 degree gymnasium.

[isleseeya]

Det , perhaps they could survive in 40's and 50's without learning english but its certainly much easier now to survive and thrive without knoiwing english , as compared to past decades and I think its a little too easy now and catered too often to allow for this now ..that's my main pt I guess

[detlef]

Det , perhaps they could survive in 40's and 50's without learning english but its certainly much easier now to survive and thrive without knoiwing english , as compared to past decades and I think its a little too easy now and catered too often to allow for this now ..that's my main pt I guess

I don't think that we are that far off in our opinions. It's just that I have worked with a ton of latino immigrants and have seen absolutely none move up past the lowest rungs of the ladder without learning some English. I don't deny that we are making it easier to to the basic things without speaking English, but there is still very much a ceiling on where you can get if you don't adapt and learn English.

 

Much, much more of a cap than the one that exists for Americans who refuse to learn another language. Of course, that's exactly how it should be. While some may think that I yearn for an America where nobody speaks English, I do think that English is and should be the most important language to speak in America.

 

I also again point out that I think the amount of immigrants who refuse to learn English is being exaggerated.

[wirehairman]

Lastly, in regards to the "redneck" statement. I think that anyone who stubbornly refuses to adapt to changing times and willfully chooses ignorance over empowerment is foolish. So, perhaps I should have called him a fool, rather than a redneck. My apologies to all rednecks.

 

Apology accepted.

[H8tank]

I think the amount of immigrants who refuse to learn English is being exaggerated.

 

Uhm, me thinks you don't know to much about reality.

[Bill Swerski]

I think that the fundamental difference between our stances is the fact that I see learning another language as way to keep up with the changing times and stay competitive in the job market in much the same way that one must adapt to other changes like technology. Thus, those prepared to bring those additional skills to the workplace should be rewarded.

 

I would agree with you if our public schools mandated fluency in Spanish in the same way that they mandate a basic level of computer literacy. Again, it's a bad comparison.

 

I would also like to add that nearly all immigrant workers I have ever worked along side or above were eagerly learning English as quickly as they could. It's just that they didn't magically become fluent the second they arrived here so giving them options in their native language really just eases the transition. You guys keep referring to this mass of immigrants who "refuse to learn English" and I really don't think it's as big a group as you claim.

 

Here's a novel concept: How about becoming functionally literate in English BEFORE immigrating to America. I realize that Mexico's economy is depressed, but they do have books, no? I would never even consider moving to France (where they REALLY don't appreciate people who don't know their language) before I was at least semi-fluent in French. Call me old-fashioned, but I've always thought that it was the immigrant's job to assimilate to the native language, not the other way around.

 

Lastly, in regards to the "redneck" statement. I think that anyone who stubbornly refuses to adapt to changing times and willfully chooses ignorance over empowerment is foolish. So, perhaps I should have called him a fool, rather than a redneck. My apologies to all rednecks.

 

I know a lot of "redneck" M.D.s and Ph.D.s who have clearly chosen "empowerment", yet feel no need to learn Spanish to appease immigrants.

 

Your use of that word tells me exactly what you think of people who don't share your philosophy and where those feelings are rooted.

 

I have nothing further to add.

Edited July 31, 2007 by Bill Swerski

[Yukon Cornelius]

I have nothing further to add.

 

not a chance that will happen

[darin3]

topetón

 

bosse

 

urto

 

pemyo

 

stob

[Chief Dick]

topetón

 

bosse

 

urto

 

pemyo

 

stob

 

This means "darin3 is ghey" in spanish.

 

 

:highfivemaverickandgoosestylefrontandbackfromtopgun:

[darin3]

This means "darin3 is ghey" in spanish.

:highfivemaverickandgoosestylefrontandbackfromtopgun:

You're hired.