whoopazz Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Any managers or lawyers have experience with employment agreements. I'm reviewing one for my daughter for an offer she received and is very excited about. Its an entry level position, and the contract seems a little over the top to me. Has a non-compete section saying she won't do similar work for any competitor within 250 miles for a period of two years of termination of employment there. Huh? Negotiable? Can she just scratch that part off and initial. She doesn't want to mess up this opportunity though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Country Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Depending on the job and industry (not just the level of work), non-competes are pretty common. 2 years may be a little over the top and unenforceable, depending on the state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Any managers or lawyers have experience with employment agreements. I'm reviewing one for my daughter for an offer she received and is very excited about. Its an entry level position, and the contract seems a little over the top to me. Has a non-compete section saying she won't do similar work for any competitor within 250 miles for a period of two years of termination of employment there. Huh? Negotiable? Can she just scratch that part off and initial. She doesn't want to mess up this opportunity though. I'm presuming that noncompetes are enforceable in your jusrisdiction. I'm also presuming that there is law that mandates that the provisions in a noncompete agreement are reasonable. 250 miles sounds unreasonable to me, but it depends upon the nature of the job. Two years is probably the outer limit of reasonable. I would not advise her to just scratch it off. Whether it is negotiable or not is up to the employer. In my experience, they aren't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoopazz Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 I'm presuming that noncompetes are enforceable in your jusrisdiction. I'm also presuming that there is law that mandates that the provisions in a noncompete agreement are reasonable. 250 miles sounds unreasonable to me, but it depends upon the nature of the job. Two years is probably the outer limit of reasonable. I would not advise her to just scratch it off. Whether it is negotiable or not is up to the employer. In my experience, they aren't. Is it fairly easy for me to check on these laws? It is an analytical laboratory, doing entry level lab analysis work (mostly environmentally related). It also says "within 250 miles of the current location, or any future locations...." In any event it is probably unenforceable just by nature, I mean really, who would ever check or even care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Irish Doggy Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 In any event it is probably unenforceable just by nature, I mean really, who would ever check or even care. You might be surprised. I'm used to seeing 6 months, not 2 years. 2 years seems very unreasonable to me. It also severely limits her ability to rise up in the industry by effectively removing any ability to go to another company for more pay, promotion, etc. I'd be curious what the standard is in this industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Is it fairly easy for me to check on these laws? It is an analytical laboratory, doing entry level lab analysis work (mostly environmentally related). It also says "within 250 miles of the current location, or any future locations...." In any event it is probably unenforceable just by nature, I mean really, who would ever check or even care. I would advise you to see a lawyer. In Michigan, judges are allowed to modify noncompetition agreements to terms that they believe are reasonable. (for instance, a judge could reduce the 250 mile limitation to 50, but other enforce the other terms of the agreement). Whenther the employer would take steps to enforce the agreement is another matter entirely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliaz Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Any managers or lawyers have experience with employment agreements. I'm reviewing one for my daughter for an offer she received and is very excited about. Its an entry level position, and the contract seems a little over the top to me. Has a non-compete section saying she won't do similar work for any competitor within 250 miles for a period of two years of termination of employment there. Huh? Negotiable? Can she just scratch that part off and initial. She doesn't want to mess up this opportunity though. Each year we sign something similar here at Verizon. Most of the people I know in my line of work and at different companies have the same thing. Scratching it would more than likely disqualify her for the position. Mine also has the clause that if I leave I cannot contact, suggest or otherwise coach any currently employees to seek employment at where I work. back in 2009/2010 when most of our senior level management was axed they wouldn't even speak with us until the period defined in their contracts expired. Is she going for a large corporation? If you don't mind me asking, what will she be doing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcat2334 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 You might be surprised. I'm used to seeing 6 months, not 2 years. 2 years seems very unreasonable to me. It also severely limits her ability to rise up in the industry by effectively removing any ability to go to another company for more pay, promotion, etc. I'd be curious what the standard is in this industry. yup- 2 years for an entry level position is beyond ridiculous, negotiate it without question. Especially if you are in an at-will state. Most Sr. level peeps that have a built-in book of business won't sign a 2yr NC in a million years. Love these employers that can fire you without cause but want a 2 yr NC........ most of them aren't enforceable anyway, especially for an entry level resouce, but I would absolutely negotiate that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoopazz Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 I've been reading up on this and from what I've learned, this would not be enforceable. It seems to me broad and unreasonable for an entry level position (2 years, 250 miles), in a less than proprietary field (analytical lab). I suppose I could call the guy and see if its negotiable, but I don't want to screw up this opportunity for her. I think I'll advise her to just go ahead and hope that when she leaves, they won't try to enforce it (it specifically says "without written permission..."). Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 I've been reading up on this and from what I've learned, this would not be enforceable. It seems to me broad and unreasonable for an entry level position (2 years, 250 miles), in a less than proprietary field (analytical lab). I suppose I could call the guy and see if its negotiable, but I don't want to screw up this opportunity for her. I think I'll advise her to just go ahead and hope that when she leaves, they won't try to enforce it (it specifically says "without written permission..."). Thoughts? yeah, I'd just go along with it and cross that enforceablility bridge if and when she ever gets there, with the assumption that it probably won't ever have any effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polksalet Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 I wouldn't sign one of those if hugh's hair was aflame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yukon Cornelius Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 and u guys laugh at union demands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muck Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Have your daughter call to ask to see if they're flexible on any of the terms. If you call, you'll be undermining her from day one. Think about it ... you make an offer to a young woman not long after she gets out of college ... and her dad calls you to negotiate the non compete?!? That really would not sit well with me... Good luck to you / her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 yeah, I'd just go along with it and cross that enforceablility bridge if and when she ever gets there, with the assumption that it probably won't ever have any effect. This. Most likely the company has this as a standard and applies the same contract from the execs all the way to the janitor. The execs they will enforce, the interns and janitor they probably won't. If she argues it, they will almost certainly withdraw the offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electricrelish Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 This. Most likely the company has this as a standard and applies the same contract from the execs all the way to the janitor. The execs they will enforce, the interns and janitor they probably won't. If she argues it, they will almost certainly withdraw the offer. The key here is enforceable. Just cause you sign something that is ridiculous, doesn't mean it would ever stand up in court. I say sign it cause it's not enforceable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoopazz Posted July 1, 2011 Author Share Posted July 1, 2011 Lots of good opinions here, thanks. She went ahead on the unenforceable premise, accepted the offer and signed it. We didn't want to jeopardize the offer and its very unlikely we'll ever have to cross that bridge. I am now the proud father of a three income household Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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