Randall Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 I think he should keep his job. Changes coaches now would move the program back and they really need to learn to catch the ball. What's with these guys? A better DC would help too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budlitebrad Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 It's hard for coaches nowadays with the "win now" mantra of most front offices. I think he deserves to stay as well. I mean, unless he may end up back in SF to resurrect what's left of the West Coast offense. You know, so Paul Brown can rest in peace again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phenom Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 It's hard for coaches nowadays with the "win now" mantra of most front offices. I think he deserves to stay as well. 647028[/snapback] I know....He's only been there 6 years. Have a little patience the Seahawks are on the 10 year plan............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolverines Fan Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 (edited) He's been there six years. No Superbowl. The Seahawks have been one and done in the playoffs two straight years. The WRs can't catch. Holmgren can't seem to motivate and keep KRob in line. This team doesn't play that well on the road. This team just doesn't seem to have any guts or any heart. Seattle fans, Holmgren has gotten you as far as he can. It's time for a new coach out there IMHO. Edited January 10, 2005 by Wolverines Fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RILETT Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 This team has a 500 record since The Big Show arrived, not quite what we had in mind. But I don't think you could find anyone out there at this point who would be better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budlitebrad Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 To be truly honest, I'm a pack fan, so I guess that makes me partial... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilwoman Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 (edited) As a long time Seattle Hawks fan I really cant blame Mike. It all comes down to execution defensively and catching a freaking pass. The guy I really feel the most for this season is Matt Hasselbeck. This guy has come a long ways...from poor decisions throwing from his rear, to becoming a real leader and making great decisions. They have got to get a new DC and some new receivers. And someone on special teams that gives us a freaking chance to run a ball or two back. Then I think really we would have a pretty well rounded team. But now with free agency up in the air who knows who will be back...its a shame really for two years now nothing but a dissappointment...and for me wow making the playoffs should be a celebration...but for the last two years it was like the movie "Groundhogs Day". Anyway best of luck to the Jets. Edited January 9, 2005 by devilwoman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rattsass Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 I heard from an unreliable source that Homgren is going to be fired, and San Francisco will try to get him. That would not surprise me, and would be a fitting punishment for Mikes failings in Seattle. You can shift the blame away from Holmgren, but the fact remains that he KNOWS his players shortcomings and has continued to put his team in situations ill fitting to its capabilities. And that is the mark of a coach that does not get the most out of his team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylive5 Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 You can shift the blame away from Holmgren, but the fact remains that he KNOWS his players shortcomings and has continued to put his team in situations ill fitting to its capabilities. And that is the mark of a coach that does not get the most out of his team. 647367[/snapback] I have tried to stay away from this thread because I have always disliked Homegrins and didn't want that to get in the way. However..... I agree with the above quote all the way. You watch his teams come out at the half flat. You watch his teams play with hardly any emotion no matter what the circumstances. You stand by for 6 years and get nothing but disappointment. The team has the talent. It has the skills. It has never played up to its potential. The guy has got to go. Seattle homers deserve more than what he delivers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted January 9, 2005 Author Share Posted January 9, 2005 I heard from an unreliable source that Homgren is going to be fired, and San Francisco will try to get him. That would not surprise me, and would be a fitting punishment for Mikes failings in Seattle. You can shift the blame away from Holmgren, but the fact remains that he KNOWS his players shortcomings and has continued to put his team in situations ill fitting to its capabilities. And that is the mark of a coach that does not get the most out of his team. 647367[/snapback] He's from the SF area and still wants to build a system. Maybe someone shopuld punish me by giving me a new job paying millions in the town I love. From what I have seen the players have failed more than Holmgren. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonehand Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 He's from the SF area and still wants to build a system. Maybe someone shopuld punish me by giving me a new job paying millions in the town I love. 647382[/snapback] Yeah, but York's a freaking idiot, & Holmgren is not... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheezhed Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 Holmgren had a winning team in GB. He obviously had more regular season and playoff victories with them. I personally hope he continues to lose anywhere and everywhere he goes. I know, I'm a hater!! Gotta feel for Hasselbeck He'd be better off putting Trufant on O as a WR. Or he could just throw the ball and go catch the *** thing himself!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted January 9, 2005 Author Share Posted January 9, 2005 Yeah, but York's a freaking idiot, & Holmgren is not... 647397[/snapback] He has been a failure there. My point was simply that fixing problems there may be better than firing him and probably starting over. If he is fired they don't believe it can be fixed. I wouldn't give up just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonehand Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 (edited) He has been a failure there. My point was simply that fixing problems there may be better than firing him and probably starting over. If he is fired they don't believe it can be fixed. I wouldn't give up just yet. 647404[/snapback] I hear you. My point was based on your previous comment that Holmgren is from the SF area, and still wants to build a system. Even if Mike were to leave the Hawks, The SF front office is a shambles with York at the helm, and I don't believe that he would be stupid enough to take that job. After all, York makes Jerry Jones look like a football mind of staggering proportions. On the topic at hand, I am on the whole a Holmgren believer. I think your assertion that Holmgren has been a failure in Seattle is a little strong. Winning the division twice, 3 playoff appearances (albeit losses) and a record of 50-46 in 6 years is pretty far from failure to a club with the history of that Seattle Seahawks. Although I will not argue that he has not come close to meeting the expectations that this city has had since he was hired. The main problem the last few years has been with the defense. Let's face it, If the Hawks could somehow stop the Rams even HALF the time on 3rd & long, we're probably talking about whether the Hawks will visit Atlanta or Philly today. Now, if the defense is underperforming, whose fault is it? Ultimately, the buck has to stop with Holmgren. However, the Hawks have had 2 years of being absolutely snakebit with defensive injuries. The 3 players that the Hawks pay the most money to on D (Brown, Simmons & Wistrom) spent significant time on the injured list this year, leaving a ragtag bunch of rookies & fill-ins to carry the mail, which they were Ill equipped to do. For instance, who got burned on Torry Holt's TD yesterday? Marquand Manuel. This guy was on the practice squad at the start of the season, and now he's gamely trying to cover a pro bowl receiver in a do or die playoff game. Given the injury sitch, the Hawks simply don't have the horses to compete on defense, so in my mind I cut Homgren a little slack. However, things cannot continue like this, so if Holmgren stays at the very least Ray Rhodes needs to be replaced by someone who can more effectively motivate this D, and I would like to see a new secondary coach to train a talented but young squad. Additionally, the Special teams coach needs to be gone. Personnel wise, the D needs a veteran free agent defensive tackle, to match with & bring along Marcus Tubbs, depth at the linebacker position, & to resign Ken Lucas. On offense, I believe Alexander will be gone, so his money can be used to sign Hass, Big Walt, Itula Mili, & a big name free agent receiver who is HUNGRY. The backfield will become mired in RBBC as Mo Morris & Kerry Carter split time, maybe not with the flash of SA, but ably. Anyway, that's my opinion, and I know it's not the popular one as a great many of my fellow Seattle fans want Holmgren gone. Edited January 9, 2005 by Bonehand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilwoman Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 As a long time Seattle Hawks fan I really cant blame Mike. It all comes down to execution defensively and catching a freaking pass. The guy I really feel the most for this season is Matt Hasselbeck. This guy has come a long ways...from poor decisions throwing from his rear, to becoming a real leader and making great decisions. They have got to get a new DC and some new receivers. And someone on special teams that gives us a freaking chance to run a ball or two back. Then I think really we would have a pretty well rounded team. But now with free agency up in the air who knows who will be back...its a shame really for two years now nothing but a dissappointment...and for me wow making the playoffs should be a celebration...but for the last two years it was like the movie "Groundhogs Day". Anyway best of luck to the Jets. 647290[/snapback] I hear you. My point was based on your previous comment that Holmgren is from the SF area, and still wants to build a system. Even if Mike were to leave the Hawks, The SF front office is a shambles with York at the helm, and I don't believe that he would be stupid enough to take that job. After all, York makes Jerry Jones look like a football mind of staggering proportions. On the topic at hand, I am on the whole a Holmgren believer. I think your assertion that Holmgren has been a failure in Seattle is a little strong. Winning the division twice, 3 playoff appearances (albeit losses) and a record of 50-46 in 6 years is pretty far from failure to a club with the history of that Seattle Seahawks. Although I will not argue that he has not come close to meeting the expectations that this city has had since he was hired. The main problem the last few years has been with the defense. Let's face it, If the Hawks could somehow stop the Rams even HALF the time on 3rd & long, we're probably talking about whether the Hawks will visit Atlanta or Philly today. Now, if the defense is underperforming, whose fault is it? Ultimately, the buck has to stop with Holmgren. However, the Hawks have had 2 years of being absolutely snakebit with defensive injuries. The 3 players that the Hawks pay the most money to on D (Brown, Simmons & Wistrom) spent significant time on the injured list this year, leaving a ragtag bunch of rookies & fill-ins to carry the mail, which they were Ill equipped to do. For instance, who got burned on Torry Holt's TD yesterday? Marquand Manuel. This guy was on the practice squad at the start of the season, and now he's gamely trying to cover a pro bowl receiver in a do or die playoff game. Given the injury sitch, the Hawks simply don't have the horses to compete on defense, so in my mind I cut Homgren a little slack. However, things cannot continue like this, so if Holmgren stays at the very least Ray Rhodes needs to be replaced by someone who can more effectively motivate this D, and I would like to see a new secondary coach to train a talented but young squad. Additionally, the Special teams coach needs to be gone. Personnel wise, the D needs a veteran free agent defensive tackle, to match with & bring along Marcus Tubbs, depth at the linebacker position, & to resign Ken Lucas. On offense, I believe Alexander will be gone, so his money can be used to sign Hass, Big Walt, Itula Mili, & a big name free agent receiver who is HUNGRY. The backfield will become mired in RBBC as Mo Morris & Kerry Carter split time, maybe not with the flash of SA, but ably. Anyway, that's my opinion, and I know it's not the popular one as a great many of my fellow Seattle fans want Holmgren gone. 647450[/snapback] Seems we are in agreement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonehand Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Looks like Holmgren is staying put. However Special teams coach Mark Michaels has been fired. http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/football/207368_hawk11.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devilwoman Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Sorry Mark...butcha gotta go...bye bye now. So Bone, who is out there that is going to make a difference in our special teams??? They need some crazy motha who dont take no shi^%(+ from anyone and. You gotta be a little crazy to be on special teams and to be a special teams coach...guess thats why they call em special Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
major-tom Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 (edited) From what I have seen the players have failed more than Holmgren. 647382[/snapback] Don't you understand though, that it is Holmgren's job to make sure that his players succeed. If he fails to motivate the players that he has, ultimately it comes back to him. If he or his coaching staff cannot get through to the WRs and improve their pass catching ability then that's on the coaches. Now, if the problem is lack of talent then I guess the GM is responsible. The general opinion around the league doesn't support the lack of talent theory. Since Seattle has so many free agents maybe changing over the roster instead of changing the coaches(Holgrem & DC) is the option the Hawks front office prefers. Edited January 11, 2005 by major-tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godtomsatan Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Anyway, that's my opinion, and I know it's not the popular one as a great many of my fellow Seattle fans want Holmgren gone. 647450[/snapback] I'm of the opinion that it's not like you're going to bring in Bill Belichek and all will be better with the hawks, so what difference does it makes if Holmgren sticks around? Then again, if you're Mike Holmgren, and year 6 of a 7 year deal just finished, you no longer have the personnel responsibilities you had when you were hired, you don't get along with the guy (Whitsett) the big cheese has running the football team, there's a lot of free agents on the roster this offseason, and your hometown team and first franchise has the whole enchilada available for you to bite into if you want it.........could you blame him if he wanted to go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonehand Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Since Seattle has so many free agents maybe changing over the roster instead of changing the coaches(Holgrem & DC) is the option the Hawks front office prefers. 650419[/snapback] That's a great point. To see the Colts go about methodically signing their best players in season while the 'Hawks sit tight waiting to "see what happens" speaks volumes to me about the difference between the front office of a successful team and that of an also-ran. The confidence in knowing that your best players & team leaders are going to be there I think is an imprtant motivating factor. However, it doesn't surprise me that this kind of crap would go on with Whitsett at the helm. The long term success of the 'Hawks will always be compromised as long as this no-account is a part of the organization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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