Kid Cid Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Az, He asked you who you would have started, and you said Brown and McGahee. McGahee was a given, so that leaves either Brown or Jones. Brown should have done better against Houston, and all the commish wanted to know who you would have started. We left Thursday for a poker/golf weekend, so it's why it went undetected. Another thing to note is the scoring/playoff system. Everyone makes the playoffs. The big money goes to #1 and #2 in total points, and the only thing you gain by being top two in the division is a week 13 and 14 bye. What if McGahee got hurt? What if Jones stunk it up? It all comes down to your word, and that's all that defines what should happen. This league is about 10 years running and we're all friends. If you would have started Brown/McGahee, then it turned out like it should have. JMHO, and I assure you there wasn't an after-the-fact commish manipulation going on. He took you for your word... that's how life should work. Ummm, no. What should happen is what did happen. Both teams involved in the trade submitted lineups based on the trade not happening. Therefore, those teams should keep the points of the lineups submitted, not of some fanciful "what-if" lineup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aiea Sparks Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 I assure you there wasn't an after-the-fact commish manipulation going on It sounds like there was exactly this going on. There is no justifiable good reason to go in and change a starting lineup after games have been played. Even if the Commish thinks he is doing the right thing he is just starting a mess and ends up with exactly what you have here. The commish slacked off his duties, and because of this Az got a better result for his weekend. In no way do you punish the team when you as the commish are negligient in your duties. I agree with the other posters, keep bringing it up until it is corrected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted October 2, 2006 Author Share Posted October 2, 2006 If McGahee had went off to the tune of 200 yards and 3 TDs I expect he wouldn't be so inclined to make a retro-active change. and conversely i would probably be absolutely steaming that he was derelect. but i'm not sure i'd expect the trade to be implemented retroactively, especially without a clear statement about who i intended to start. and of course, i actually HAD that thought saturday night..."what if mcgahee goes off, do i throw a fit or what? do i make a post saying that my intent would have been to start mcgahee if the trade was timely approved?" i thought of all that and said screw it, MIN's run D has been very stout anyway, maybe the trade will go through next week, and let's go TJ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 there sure are a lot of f'd up leages and f'd up commishes out there. Ain't that the truth. I feel glad to be in well run ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thews40 Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 I'd raise a fuss. He thinks he can make up rules as he goes along. If the trade wasn't processed, then the line submitted stands. Why is this such a crime? If it went the other way and McNabb was put on the IR, does it change the outcome? Should it have been reversed? Sometimes people are so quick to judge. A man used to be held by his word... it meant something. Why is it so hard to believe this the right outcome when it's based on what should have happened? I know what happened and all the players involved, so it's kinda sad to even read this. If you had a league made up of all family members and your brothers had this situation, I doubt it would be a big deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thews40 Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Ummm, no. What should happen is what did happen. Both teams involved in the trade submitted lineups based on the trade not happening. Therefore, those teams should keep the points of the lineups submitted, not of some fanciful "what-if" lineup. Ok. I'll talk to the commish about it. He took you for your word, so I guess the trade should be reversed too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Why is this such a crime? If it went the other way and McNabb was put on the IR, does it change the outcome? Should it have been reversed? Sometimes people are so quick to judge. A man used to be held by his word... it meant something. Why is it so hard to believe this the right outcome when it's based on what should have happened? I know what happened and all the players involved, so it's kinda sad to even read this. If you had a league made up of all family members and your brothers had this situation, I doubt it would be a big deal. This would have ESPECIALLY raised a flag in that case Basically the reason any and all leagues have procedural rules is to avoid situations like this. The slap-on-the-back, we-trust-everyone approach eventually comes back to bite the league. I've seen it happen way to many times. The rosters stay as set via the site. That way everyone can stay friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 (edited) there sure are a lot of f'd up leages and f'd up commishes out there. No oh poopy. As a commish, there is no way I touch an owner's lineup unless specifically asked to before the week's games start - and never retroactively unless I have a time stamped item specifying changing out a player before games start that I can forward the rest of the league, and then I make sure the rest of the league knows what I am doing (for instance this week, when an owner's computer crashed & I entered his lineup for him, after posting at the message board what my actions were going to be). I have to give your commish this - he has wrecking ball sized cajones to pull something like this. Now, does the rest of the league have the balls to oust him immediately? If not, it's time to find a new league - and yes, I mean leaving the league hanging with an ownerless team in mid-season. Edited October 2, 2006 by Bronco Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Ok. I'll talk to the commish about it. He took you for your word, so I guess the trade should be reversed too? meow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Why is this such a crime? If it went the other way and McNabb was put on the IR, does it change the outcome? Should it have been reversed? Sometimes people are so quick to judge. A man used to be held by his word... it meant something. Why is it so hard to believe this the right outcome when it's based on what should have happened? I know what happened and all the players involved, so it's kinda sad to even read this. If you had a league made up of all family members and your brothers had this situation, I doubt it would be a big deal. I understand what you are saying about a man going by his word. and that is a cool thing. but if you don't get any answers by a certain date about a trade and a guy thinks he has 1 person playing and is sitting there rooting on him all day. how can you take that guy out of the lineup after the fact. the commish made a mistake and if he(the commish) left he should of had someone else take over for him during the week. people are paying good money to be in a league like that and that needs to be considered even in the friendliest of leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted October 2, 2006 Author Share Posted October 2, 2006 Az, He asked you who you would have started, and you said Brown and McGahee. McGahee was a given, so that leaves either Brown or Jones. Brown should have done better against Houston, and all the commish wanted to know who you would have started. We left Thursday for a poker/golf weekend, so it's why it went undetected. Another thing to note is the scoring/playoff system. Everyone makes the playoffs. The big money goes to #1 and #2 in total points, and the only thing you gain by being top two in the division is a week 13 and 14 bye. What if McGahee got hurt? What if Jones stunk it up? It all comes down to your word, and that's all that defines what should happen. This league is about 10 years running and we're all friends. If you would have started Brown/McGahee, then it turned out like it should have. JMHO, and I assure you there wasn't an after-the-fact commish manipulation going on. He took you for your word... that's how life should work. full disclosure, here is what i sent joe this morning: Sorry, I didn't see it. I executed it this morning. Who would you havestarted for RB's? you probably wouldn't believe me if i said i would've started mcgahee and t. jones. which is good, because i'd be lying! most likely i would've gone with brown and mcgahee, but as i'm sure you can imagine i'm not really interested in swapping jones out of my lineup after the fact. as you probably pick up from my email, i considered the question totally meaningless at that point and still do. it seems like everyone else here agrees with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Ok. I'll talk to the commish about it. He took you for your word, so I guess the trade should be reversed too? Now this is pathetic. this is like trying to extort a man. Jump out of this league Az. you are 4 games into it and evidence is piling up that this league is junk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Cid Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Ok. I'll talk to the commish about it. He took you for your word, so I guess the trade should be reversed too? Not sure why you're getting so defensive here. I know this is a league of friends so maybe you're used to doing things in the way that the commish handled it. All I'm saying is that by doing so he potentially opened a can of worms and Az's reaction shows why IMO it's not the correct way to do things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bier Meister Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Ok. I'll talk to the commish about it. He took you for your word, so I guess the trade should be reversed too? i don't see anything wrong with the trade (it should go through). owners would just need to specifiy who of the new players they would start (via email, message board, voicemail, whatever) thews, try not to take this too personally, or as an affront to you. the commissioner made several mistakes in how things were handled. it doesn't mean he should be dethroned or beheaded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatman Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Why is this such a crime? If it went the other way and McNabb was put on the IR, does it change the outcome? Should it have been reversed? Sometimes people are so quick to judge. A man used to be held by his word... it meant something. Why is it so hard to believe this the right outcome when it's based on what should have happened? I know what happened and all the players involved, so it's kinda sad to even read this. If you had a league made up of all family members and your brothers had this situation, I doubt it would be a big deal. Isn't it also important to honor the commitment you've made to others and, if you can't, make arrangements to see that they are taken care of? I have no doubt that everyone is trying to act fairly and justly, but the fact is that Az was forced to make a lineup choice based on all the info that he had. That info said that McGahee wasn't on his team. So he had to start Thomas Jones. I haven't heard anything that would change that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexgaddis Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 thews, try not to take this too personally, or as an affront to you. the commissioner made several mistakes in how things were handled. it doesn't mean he should be dethroned or beheaded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 (edited) Now this is pathetic. this is like trying to extort a man. Jump out of this league Az. you are 4 games into it and evidence is piling up that this league is junk. Man it is so hard getting in on leagues that are existing with a bunch of buddies. I joined one a couple of years ago where they had a member that regularly set his roster late (and everyone was fine with it, despite the rules saying otherwise). I raised cain, but ended up just quitting as they were unable to understand what my problem was with Bob sending in his roster at 1:15 (after a noon kickoff) on Sunday... Edited October 2, 2006 by cre8tiff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexgaddis Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Man it is so hard getting in on leagues that are existing with a bunch of buddies. I joined one a couple of years ago where they had a member that regularly set his roster late (and everyone was fine with it, despite the rules saying otherwise). I raised cain, but ended up just quitting as they were unable to understand what my problem was with Bob sending in his roster at 1:15 on Sunday... what a joke... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furd Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 This seems like a no-brainer. The trade wasn't processed until after the game. I don't see how you can start somebody that wasn't on your roster at the time that lineups were locked in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernus Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 this is occurring in a local league i'm in with another huddler (thews) and a bunch of guys he works with. the commish is a guy i don't really know. so anyway last wednesday, through the league website, i agree to a trade where i acquire willis mcgahee for donovan mcnabb (i have palmer as well, and he was relying on carr/brunell). the league requires commish approval on all trades, and he was off cavorting on a long golf weekend or something and i guess he didn't get around to processing the trade until this (monday) morning. by the time saturday night rolls around and the trade still wasn't processed, i go ahead and set my lineup with ronnie brown and thomas jones. i was a little annoyed the commish was awol, but i didn't feel strongly enough about mcgahee (who ended up with 82 yards and 1 TD) over either jones (107 yards, 2 TDs) or brown (111 yards) to feel like i needed to post on the league message board that i wanted to start mcgahee or anything like that. i mean, i could have easily created a time-stamped post with the lineup i wanted to declare, but i didn't...i just went with brown and jones and figured i'd have mcgahee next week. so this morning the commish sees the trade and processes it. then he emails me asking who i would have started, and i said, basically, well if the trade was processed when i set my lineup i probably would have gone with brown and mcgahee, but it wasn't so that's beside the point. so he went in and changed my lineup retroactively, taking jones and his two-TD performance (which of course i was pumping my fist and cheering for last night) and plopping him on my bench. oh and guess who i'm playing against this week? yeah, the commish. don't know for sure that it changes the outcome...i was about 6 down with akers and the eagles D still to play tonight against jennings for him, now i'm about 15 down....so the chances are pretty good it DOES change the outcome. so, if you were in my shoes what would you do? make a stink? take the lumps? i'm a little pissed about it. something like this happened to me in 32 more homers last year... me and someone else made a trade on a tuesday and it wasn't processed until the following tuesday...after the week.... what was worse, I made that trade in lieu of another trade I made, but found out it couldn't be processed because he was my hometown player.....so I got cornholed big time aha... in my local, I am commish and I usually catch wind of a trade before it even happens....so I don't miss much.... as a commish...he has to be reliable....if he isn't, then he should be replaced.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thews40 Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 meow. Just how small does your dick have to be to go looking for fights on the internet? Az, Just talked to the commish... he'll change it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Billy Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 He took you for your word... that's how life should work. Yeah, and people who accept responsibility should perform accordingly. If the commish was going to be out of town, there were multiple ways of handling his responsibility - the two that immediately come to mind are that he could have assigned a temporary deputy commish, or he could have gone to a library/internet cafe to check the league transactions if he couldn't allow himself to delegate authority. I find it very interesting that the commish seems to have the authority to decide whether a trade goes through - or else why would he have to approve trades? This guy seems like he has control issues & he has now overstepped his bounds. That's a bad sign for a league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grits and Shins Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Once a lineup is submitted and the games have been played there is no going back. You can't ask AFTER the fact which players an owner would or would not have started. We all wrestle with lineup decisions and nobody knows for sure what they might have done had the trade occurred BEFORE you knew how the individual players actually performed. The ONLY way a lineup can be changed after the fact is if AZ had posted/emailed to the entire league his intentions of starting McGahee once the trade was processed. Because there is no league wide specification that he would start McGahee you must go with the lineup he started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Beatings Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Thews you are too close to the situation to see it objectively. Az came here and asked a very legitimate question and you seem to be reacting, frankly a bit immature about the whole thing. Doesn't it mean anything that the overwhelming reaction by people here reading this situation is to say that the Commissioner screwed this one up by trying to retroactively approve a trade and reset lineups? I'm sure you want to avoid conflict in this long standing league of friends, but avoiding conflict should not be at the expense of the new owner's team. This doesn't have to be a huge deal if all of the people invloced can just calmly present their reasons justifying their positions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexgaddis Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Just talked to the commish... he'll change it. Problem solved Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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