EliteXC on CBS

[budlitebrad]

I'm probably gonna watch it more because I'm interested in the reaction to MMA on a major network, but the card itself isn't exactly exciting.

 

Kimbo is a great striker and has an interesting story, but he's still a rookie and to quote Dana White, Thompson "might get knocked out before he gets into the cage". Slice will probably beat him down in under a minute to become the face of "mainstream MMA".

[SheikYerbuti]

I'm probably gonna watch it more because I'm interested in the reaction to MMA on a major network, but the card itself isn't exactly exciting.

 

Kimbo is a great striker and has an interesting story, but he's still a rookie and to quote Dana White, Thompson "might get knocked out before he gets into the cage". Slice will probably beat him down in under a minute to become the face of "mainstream MMA".

 

I don't know the sport at all, but I saw the guy Kimbo is fighting is 2-6 lifetime. That spells tomato can in any language. Too bad. . I would like to see some fighting before the guy eats canvas.

[SheikYerbuti]

Thompson's ear. . . .

[whomper]

First time I ever watched one of these fights. It has a very WWF feel to me as far as the production. The fighting is certainly real and the action is great. They stopped the kimbo fight a little early. Although the cauliflowered ear popped I think Thomspson was going to take him down and possibly do damage like he did in the 2nd rd. It was enjoyable to watch. I just kept waiting for Mean Gene Okerland to show up.

Edited June 1, 2008 by whomper

[budlitebrad]

Wow, that was bad.

 

-Kimbo was completely exposed by Thompson, but the ref saved his ass with a BS stoppage.

 

-Smith got poked in the eye, but never got his 5 mins and was screwed with a BS stoppage.

 

-The female match was actually decent, but was also stopped too soon.

 

If this is what MMA is gonna be like on network TV, I don't want it.

Edited June 1, 2008 by budlitebrad

[fitzkek]

Wow, that was bad.

 

-Kimbo was completely exposed by Thompson, but the ref saved his ass with a BS stoppage.

 

-Smith got poked in the eye, but never got his 5 mins and was screwed with a BS stoppage.

 

-The female match was actually decent, but was also stopped too soon.

 

 

If this is what MMA is gonna be like on network TV, I don't want it.

The two best fights in my opinion were the women and Smith/Lawer. Extrememly entertaining. The Dr. was horrible. I wouldn't be surprised if she's ever asked to work another sporting event again. Unless it's tennis or something.

Edited June 1, 2008 by fitzkek

[Gopher]

Wow, that was bad.

 

-Kimbo was completely exposed by Thompson, but the ref saved his ass with a BS stoppage.

 

-Smith got poked in the eye, but never got his 5 mins and was screwed with a BS stoppage.

 

-The female match was actually decent, but was also stopped too soon.

 

If this is what MMA is gonna be like on network TV, I don't want it.

Agreed.

 

The two best fights in my opinion were the women and Smith/Lawer. Extrememly entertaining. The Dr. was horrible. I wouldn't be surprised if she's ever asked to work another sporting event again. Unless it's tennis or something.

That's what I thought, too. Rules weren't any different, and the refs last night also work for UFC, so the only difference that can explain the premature stops was the doctor(s). That chick was looking at cuts as though they're potentially life-threatening, when we've seen 100 cuts worse on UFC/WEC with no stoppage.

 

My thoughts on last night - I pretty much expected it, because they're aiming towards a more mainstream audience, but they clearly tried to make it have more of a pro wrestling feel for the audience. Cheerleaders, fireworks, etc..... ghey. It's too bad, because that crap just gives the UFC haters more ammunition, in my opinion. Anyone who watched last night with a somewhat skeptical eye is going to say "I told you so." As far as the fights themselves:

 

- The first heavyweight fight was nothing more than a bar brawl, and the winner has heavy hands, but not much as far as MMA skills. He would get crushed, more than likely, by the likes of Crocop, Herring, Verdum, Gonzaga, etc., etc., etc. The only reason I say "more than likely" is because all it takes is one lucky punch for someone who is totally outclassed to win a fight, so you never know. But, clearly, the majority of the fighters in the UFC have more skill and are a lot more versatile than the guys I saw in this fight last night.

 

- The second fight (middleweight?) was a joke. Phil Barone is all show, no skill. The guy is ripped, but with an MMA record of 10-10, he shouldn't be fighting on TV. The fact that EliteXC would have that as one of their debut fights on primetime is pretty sad.

 

- Carano vs. Young - Maybe the best fight of the night. At least they went after each other and seemed to know what they're doing out there, unlike some of the guys. This fight wouldn't have been stopped when it was if on UFC. Not sure if it's because it was girls fighting, or the chick doctor, or if the general instructions were to take more caution because it's on CBS (family show), or what. That was a nasty golf-ball sized welt under Young's eye, but unless her cheek bone or eye socket was broken, or if she told the doctor that she couldn't see out of it, I don't understand why it was stopped. She even asked "Why?" as soon as it was stopped, and looked pissed, so I don't think she said anything like that. Probably would have gotten knocked out early in the third, anyway, but lame nonetheless that it was stopped.

 

- Lawler vs. Smith - The only other decent fight of the night. Both of these guys have UFC experience, and I think they'll be back. Maybe not Smith, but Lawler should be. He's got the skills to fight with a lot of the guys in his weight class (Anderson Silva excluded). Smith has beaten Pete Sell in one of he most entertaining UFC fights I've seen, and I knew going into last night that he's a guy who can take punches and should never be counted out. He proved it again last night... very entertaining. The fact that the fight was stopped is an absolute joke. That doctor should never see the cage again. That's going to hurt CBS more than the entertainment helped them. Fans don't want to see stoppages in between rounds, especially when they're not warranted.

 

- Slice vs. Thompson - Not much to say. Slice has ZERO ground skills, other than that he was strong enought to simply push Thompson off of him. Wouldn't happen against somebody with more experience. Slice should have been done in the second round, up against the cage, but he was saved by the bell and/or Thompson's ineptitude. Slice certainly has powerful hands/punches, but not much more. He's got potential, but would need to obviously improve his conditioning in order to last in the UFC. He definitely needs to work on his ground skills as well. I consider him to be a poor man's Brock Lesner at this point... too early to tell if he's going to turn into anything significant in the world of MMA, yet.

 

Overall, mostly overrated hype, with a couple of OK fights mixed in. I like the idea of having fights on every Saturday night, but there are some details that I obviously would like to see change (less hype, more quality fights). But, in order for that to happen, you have to actually be able to bring in the fighters, and not just attract the garbage that the UFC/WEC rejects or doesn't want.

[SheikYerbuti]

Anyone who watched last night with a somewhat skeptical eye is going to say "I told you so."

 

And sure enough, the front page of Yahoo Sports confirms your theory. . .

 

MMA’s network debut mocks true sport

 

It sounded like such a good idea when the news broke a few months ago that CBS would broadcast a series of mixed martial arts cards in prime time.

 

But after watching its effort on Saturday’s Elite XC show from the Prudential Center in Newark, N.J., the good news might be if CBS opts not to do another show.

 

These were supposed to be the professionals who would show the amateurs at the Ultimate Fighting Championship, who do their own production, how it’s supposed to be done.

 

And while neophyte play-by-play man Gus Johnson acquitted himself well and analysts Mauro Ranallo and Frank Shamrock didn’t embarrass themselves, the broadcast dragged on interminably.

 

There was more chatting than “The Tonight Show.” Fighters were introduced as they made long, slow walks to the cage, then were introduced again once they hit the cage. Given that the show went 45 minutes over its allotted time, what do you want to bet the ring walks will be eliminated if there is another show on CBS?

 

For some reason, particularly early in the broadcast, CBS chose to use its overhead camera to repeatedly show Elite XC’s skanky-looking cheerleaders doing nothing more than shaking their butts.

 

This wouldn’t have been so bad had there actually been a fight on the air every now and then. But after the show had been on the air for 32 minutes, there had been 61 seconds of actual fighting. When it was 70 minutes into the show, there had been just 2:12 of fighting.

 

The whole show was built around Kimbo Slice, the Internet-generated star whose street fights made him into something of a mythical figure in the sport before he’d ever faced a serious opponent.

 

Slice’s name and face was everywhere in the days and weeks leading up to the bout. Considering the way this dragged on, though, you have to wonder how many folks were still awake when the bell rang to begin Slice’s bout with James Thompson at 11:27 p.m. ET, nearly a full half-hour after the show was supposed to have been over.

 

While it was mostly C-level talent on display, the fighters by and large held up their end of the bargain. Brett Rogers delivered a one-punch knockout of one-time Syracuse linebacker Jon Murphy in just 1:01 in the first fight of the night.

 

After glorifying loutish middleweight Phil Baroni as some sort of star – ignoring the fact he’d lost three of his last four and was just a decidedly mediocre 10-9 coming in – CBS looked bad when he was knocked out in 1:11 by Joe Villasenor.

 

The next two bouts were sensational. Gina Carano outslugged Kaitlin Young after two rounds and middleweights Robbie Lawler and Scott Smith went at it fiercely until Smith was inadvertently poked in the eye in the third, forcing a premature end to their middleweight title bout.

 

The main event showcased two mediocre fighters in mediocre condition, though after listening to Johnson, Ranallo and Shamrock, you’d have thought we were watching the MMA equivalent of Ali-Frazier.

 

Have no doubt about this: Slice would be destroyed by any legitimate mixed martial artist. Had Slice faced ex-WWE champion Brock Lesnar, the current UFC rookie hopeful, he’d have been beaten in less than two minutes.

 

As it was, Slice struggled his way to a sloppy third-round knockout of a complete tomato can.

 

You can’t blame Slice, because he had no business being in a main event of a mixed martial arts bout at this stage of his progression. It takes years of training and sacrifice to reach the main event in MMA and Slice was only there because of the notoriety he’d gained in his YouTube street brawls.

 

It was kind of ironic that at the show’s opening, Shamrock said with a straight face, “You won’t find them fighting in a bar and you won’t find them fighting in the street.”

 

Really?

 

Well, this card featured a guy (Baroni) who fights in bars and another who made his name by fighting in the streets.

 

CBS should have known better.

 

The fans deserved better.

 

The sport deserved better.

 

The CBS folks ought to take a look at the WEC card on the cable network Versus on Sunday to see how an MMA show is supposed to be put together. They’ll learn from watching that show how to introduce the viewers to the fighters but not drag the show on like a book that goes on 200 pages too long.

 

They’ll see quality fights between trained and competitive MMA fighters.

 

Hopefully, CBS didn’t manage to turn off a large segment to the country to what is a classic and compelling sport.

 

There’s no question, though, that CBS didn’t do MMA any favors Saturday.

[piratesownninjas]

First time I ever watched one of these fights. It has a very WWF feel to me as far as the production. The fighting is certainly real and the action is great. They stopped the kimbo fight a little early. Although the cauliflowered ear popped I think Thomspson was going to take him down and possibly do damage like he did in the 2nd rd. It was enjoyable to watch. I just kept waiting for Mean Gene Okerland to show up.

Yeah, don't let EXC ruin it for you... They made it very cheap and just put up guys that like to throw punches. If you want to see real fighters check out the UFC's BJ Penn who won the world jiu jitsu championships just three years into his training, which is absolutely unheard of. Other guys like Georges St. Pierre, Matt Hughes, Anderson and Wand Silva do a lot of amazing things. The Elite XC did a disservice to the MMA world with a card like that. They were trying to get the casual fan which I get, but it made a mockery of the sport.

 

If this is what MMA is gonna be like on network TV, I don't want it.

Lets have some faith that Dana can put his ego behind him and get something worked out with Fox.

[WaterMan]

I watched it and was slightly entertained only because it felt like UFC meets the production team of WCW.

 

You can't expect EliteXC to be great, because almost all of the broadcast shows are garbage.

[piratesownninjas]

I watched it and was slightly entertained only because it felt like UFC meets the production team of WCW.

 

You can't expect EliteXC to be great, because almost all of the broadcast shows are garbage.

Elite XC has nothing in common with UFC, other than one claims to be MMA, where as another one actually is.

[WaterMan]

Elite XC has nothing in common with UFC, other than one claims to be MMA, where as another one actually is.

 

I know this. I was describing what I saw while under the influence.

[piratesownninjas]

It's heavily rumored that CBS will fire Gary Shaw from EXC... CBS and EXC have something in their contract in which CBS can buy 500,000 shares of EXC everytime a show is on CBS... Rumors are that CBS will hold a majority shaw and can Gary Shaw. As an MMA fan I only hope that this happens.

[Gopher]

Looks like there is another EliteXC event on CBS on 7/26, featuring the rematch of Lawler and Smith. Should be an entertaining fight, although I don't really have high expectations for the rest of the event. Nick Diaz, older brother of Nate (from the Ultimate Fighter a couple of seasons ago) is also fighting. I'll probably watch, only because it's free.

[piratesownninjas]

Nick Diaz, older brother of Nate (from the Ultimate Fighter a couple of seasons ago) is also fighting. I'll probably watch, only because it's free.

You don't have to qualify Nick Diaz. He's one of the best in his weight in any organization, and put Lawler on his ass when they were both in the UFC. Nick Diaz is also a legit Gracie BJJ black belt, and has one of the meanest jabs in mma. Nick is a beast.

[Gopher]

I don't think my post came out right. My comment about watching due to it being a free event was in reference to the event as a whole, not Diaz.

[piratesownninjas]

I don't think my post came out right. My comment about watching due to it being a free event was in reference to the event as a whole, not Diaz.

I was just commenting on Nick Diaz being introduced in a way as Nate's older brother... Nick is a top class MMA for any organization and has a ton more skins on the wall than Nate. I just thought it was funny.

WAR DIAZ BROS!

[Primetime9287]

Nobody should be watching this fight tomorrow night. If you wanna see a real fight that has possibilities to be something special, check out Cotto-Margarito.

[piratesownninjas]

Nobody should be watching this fight tomorrow night. If you wanna see a real fight that has possibilities to be something special, check out Cotto-Margarito.

Get that boxing non-sense out of here. This is an MMA discussion, not boxing. To say no one should watch the fight tomorrow is asinine.

Robbie Lawler is a massive name in the MMA world, and his last fight with Smith was shaping up to be something epic.

Another big name and one of my favorites is the great Nick Diaz, who's a freaking Gracie Jiu-Jitsu black belt and has a jab most boxers would be envious of.

Jake Sheilds has trained with Chuck Liddell and Ceasar Gracie BJJ and holds a record of 20-4-1

Heck, Antonio Silva is even on the card... This is the card that Elite XC should have ran with in their first CBS event, so to say no one should be watching this is a joke.

[Primetime9287]

Get that boxing non-sense out of here. This is an MMA discussion, not boxing. To say no one should watch the fight tomorrow is asinine.

Robbie Lawler is a massive name in the MMA world, and his last fight with Smith was shaping up to be something epic.

Another big name and one of my favorites is the great Nick Diaz, who's a freaking Gracie Jiu-Jitsu black belt and has a jab most boxers would be envious of.

Jake Sheilds has trained with Chuck Liddell and Ceasar Gracie BJJ and holds a record of 20-4-1

Heck, Antonio Silva is even on the card... This is the card that Elite XC should have ran with in their first CBS event, so to say no one should be watching this is a joke.

 

Im as big of a MMA fan as anyone, but I also like Boxing. And tomorrow night, the Cotto-Margarito fight is going to be worth the money. Order this instead of the free stuff on CBS.

[piratesownninjas]

Im as big of a MMA fan as anyone, but I also like Boxing. And tomorrow night, the Cotto-Margarito fight is going to be worth the money. Order this instead of the free stuff on CBS.

for me, Free MMA card that's stacked>PPV Boxing... I've just been burnt way too many times with boxing ppv's... Although Kelly Pavlik doesn't let me down. That and one of my favorite fighters is on the card tomorrow night.

WAR DIAZ BROTHERS!

[forever in debt to mo lewis]

Im as big of a MMA fan as anyone, but I also like Boxing. And tomorrow night, the Cotto-Margarito fight is going to be worth the money. Order this instead of the free stuff on CBS.

 

ohhhhh yeah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

cant wait...i made a thread about this fight here on the board when it was made official....i actually cant believe people prefer the mma crap over a big prize fight....although i can see where people have been burned and dont wanna shell out the 50 bucks(although im a boxing junkie...hell i even ordered roy vs tito....lol...i was bored)....there is nothing like the atmosphere at a big fight....i was at cotto/mosley at msg last november...absolutely electric....mma cant touch it.....nice to see espn giving some coverage to this fight too...they had them on the front page wednesday....and covered the weigh in

[piratesownninjas]

ohhhhh yeah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

cant wait...i made a thread about this fight here on the board when it was made official....i actually cant believe people prefer the mma crap over a big prize fight....although i can see where people have been burned and dont wanna shell out the 50 bucks(although im a boxing junkie...hell i even ordered roy vs tito....lol...i was bored)....there is nothing like the atmosphere at a big fight....i was at cotto/mosley at msg last november...absolutely electric....mma cant touch it.....nice to see espn giving some coverage to this fight too...they had them on the front page wednesday....and covered the weigh in

Face it, boxing has lost a few steps, to call mma crap is asinine. You want electric? MMA has plenty of it. Only some Ricky Ricardo that has absolutely no clue what goes into MMA would make statements like you're saying...

Boxing, Jiu Jitsu, Muay Thai, Wrestling, Judo, it's everything mixed. More than just two guys standing up throwing bombs at each other for twelve rounds with massively padded gloves.

[forever in debt to mo lewis]

Face it, boxing has lost a few steps, to call mma crap is asinine. You want electric? MMA has plenty of it. Only some Ricky Ricardo that has absolutely no clue what goes into MMA would make statements like you're saying...

Boxing, Jiu Jitsu, Muay Thai, Wrestling, Judo, it's everything mixed. More than just two guys standing up throwing bombs at each other for twelve rounds with massively padded gloves.

 

lolol....yeah its two guys laying on a mat for 3 minutes a round...grappling and holding each other....lol...its funny to watch these guys gassed after 3 five minute rounds....lol...they put kimbo in with some bum and he can barely stand after the fight....lol....trust me...i understand what goes on in mma...i have friends who are fighters....but im not into it....what they do in an octagon cant compare to say the third fight of the marquez/vazquez trilogy....those are warriors

 

heres just a little highlight video of the last fight...i suggest watching the entire trilogy...the first two fights didnt go the distance

 

 

boxing hasnt lost anything...its been around for a 100 years...and its not going anywhere...oscar de la hoya packed 27,000 into a stadium for a glorified sparring session against steve forbes...lol...and dana white is just one of the biggest douchebags on the face of the planet...this is a guy who has the nerve to insult boxing time after time..why are his guys leaving?..well miguel cotto is making 6.5 mil flat for tonight(dont believe hes getting any ppv percentages this time)...there probably isnt a guy in ufc or the mma world who has 6.5 mil in liquid...lol....the only time you here boxers talk about mma is when they are responding to some mma fighters ridiculous claims that they could actually compete on a world class level in the fight game

 

dont get me wrong...mma is legit sport...some great athletes in there....but it appeals to the "i wear tight affliction skull shirts and listen to godsmack" crowd...who cant really appreciate true talent...these mma guys couldnt last 12 rounds with a volume puncher who throws 80 or more punches a round....

[piratesownninjas]

lolol....yeah its two guys laying on a mat for 3 minutes a round...grappling and holding each other....lol...its funny to watch these guys gassed after 3 five minute rounds....lol...they put kimbo in with some bum and he can barely stand after the fight....lol....trust me...i understand what goes on in mma...i have friends who are fighters....but im not into it....what they do in an octagon cant compare to say the third fight of the marquez/vazquez trilogy....those are warriors

 

heres just a little highlight video of the last fight...i suggest watching the entire trilogy...the first two fights didnt go the distance

 

 

 

boxing hasnt lost anything...its been around for a 100 years...and its not going anywhere...oscar de la hoya packed 27,000 into a stadium for a glorified sparring session against steve forbes...lol...and dana white is just one of the biggest douchebags on the face of the planet...this is a guy who has the nerve to insult boxing time after time..why are his guys leaving?..well miguel cotto is making 6.5 mil flat for tonight(dont believe hes getting any ppv percentages this time)...there probably isnt a guy in ufc or the mma world who has 6.5 mil in liquid...lol....the only time you here boxers talk about mma is when they are responding to some mma fighters ridiculous claims that they could actually compete on a world class level in the fight game

 

dont get me wrong...mma is legit sport...some great athletes in there....but it appeals to the "i wear tight affliction skull shirts and listen to godsmack" crowd...who cant really appreciate true talent...these mma guys couldnt last 12 rounds with a volume puncher who throws 80 or more punches a round....

You claim to know what you're talking about then mention Kimbo Slice. Grappling on the ground doesn't happen in every fight either, some guys like to stand and bang, others go for subs, but a lot of the wrestlers do just lay, so good job for taking a percentage of the fighters and applying to all of MMA. Talk about conditioning? Boxing and MMA are completely different games... MMA takes a lot more out of you a lot faster. You're not only reading and reacting to hands but from elbows, knees, and kicks while throwing them as well. And for your Octagon statement... Only three organizations use the Octagon, so once again, your knowledge is lacking.

Boxing has been around 100 years. Jiu Jitsu, Karate, Muay Thai and Greco Roman wrestling have been around far longer. MMA is a combination of all of this, which is why boxing elitist are clowns when they try to bash MMA. Where the hell are you going with how much money fighters are making? Baseball players make more money than any American sport, does that make it the best? This was an MMA discussion then you guys come in trying to say MMA is crap, and to say a mma fighter couldn't compete with a boxer in a fight is a joke. 90% of all fights go to the ground, what the hell is a boxer going to do on the ground? Probably get arm barred.

You sound like Dana White with your Affliction bashing, but that doesn't matter, I don't care about Godsmack nore Affliction clothing. You make an ass out of youself talking about true talent when you're so quick to dismiss guys that have learned fighting disciplines that are 1000's of years old. And I would put money on Georges St. Pierre, or any elite MMA talent dominating a boxer in a fight. Not a boxing match, but a fight. If you really disagree then you're too blinded as is, so discussing anything with you would be pointless.

 

Regardless of what we think, this is a MMA thread, please take your boxing and create your own thread. If you want to discuss it more send me a pm and we'll discuss it there.

Edited July 27, 2008 by piratesownninjas