Harbaugh sticking with Alex Smith?

[byron2112]

He did have a great 4th quarter against the Saint's, but IMO it's hard to hang you hat on that becasue the Saints have an awful defense.

 

I just think we still don't really know(I don't think much of him personally) what Smith's ceiling is other than with an outstanding running game, an elite D, and a very smart HC he won't torpedo your team.

[rajncajn]

He did have a great 4th quarter against the Saint's, but IMO it's hard to hang you hat on that becasue the Saints have an awful defense.

 

I just think we still don't really know(I don't think much of him personally) what Smith's ceiling is other than with an outstanding running game, an elite D, and a very smart HC he won't torpedo your team.

My exact thought almost word-for-word when I began to read the first sentence & that's coming from a Saints fan.

 

I don't think Smith is a horrible player by any means and I think he proved himself this year and I do think that he actually has some room to grow. Not as an elite QB, but a QB who works well in that system, who complements the defense. As Matt said early in the thread, Trent Dilfer. Whether they can win a Superbowl with him is uncertain. What is certain is that with him they should remain in contention & in the postseason everyone has a shot.

[caddyman]

Dude. Some "shiatty" QBs have proven to be pretty solid performers over time in the NFL, given the right coach and opportunity. Drew Brees and Rich Gannon come immediately to mind, but there are plenty others. I'm not quite sure why you're offended by discussing QBs on a FF MB - especially during the offseason, but if it's that bad why don't you just save yourself the aggravation and not get involved?

First of all...I am not offended by discussing QBs. I am just tired of watching 90% of the board argue with you about these pitiful QBs. There are a hell of a lot more ones that never develop than there are that with "good coaching" turn into Rich Freaking Gannon. Athough I am pretty confident that neither of your most recent lovefest sublects will amass anything close to what Rich Gannon has in the name of stats or even wins. Frankly I could give twi shiats about how you think I should spend my time. I am just trying to save my good friend Bushy from wasting his valuable Daily Kos search time debating Alex Smith. He certainly has better things to do than defend that bum.

[bushwacked]

He did have a great 4th quarter against the Saint's, but IMO it's hard to hang you hat on that becasue the Saints have an awful defense.

 

Wurd. Matt Hasselbeck had the game of his career against them in the playoffs the year before.

[piratesownninjas]

yeah .. . and those scary weapons at WR were soooo underutilized.

 

get him a real threat besides Crabtree (who caught something like 70 passes?) and see what happens.

Did you watch the Giants game? He wouldn't look to his WR's. Just Vernon Davis, Delanie Walker, and the backs. He doesn't trust his arm, or he has no arm.

 

Watching him skip pass after pass 10 feet in front of his open WRs late in the NFC Conference Championship game is a pretty telling sign he's not even good.

fixed. Those skipped passes reminded me of Blaine Gabbert this year. At least Gabbert can use the rookie excuse. I just looked over the starting QB's in the league, and I think Smith is around the 24-25th best QB in the league. He's not great, he's not even good. He's just a guy. Absolutely average.

[Bronco Billy]

First of all...I am not offended by discussing QBs. I am just tired of watching 90% of the board argue with you about these pitiful QBs. There are a hell of a lot more ones that never develop than there are that with "good coaching" turn into Rich Freaking Gannon. Athough I am pretty confident that neither of your most recent lovefest sublects will amass anything close to what Rich Gannon has in the name of stats or even wins. Frankly I could give twi shiats about how you think I should spend my time. I am just trying to save my good friend Bushy from wasting his valuable Daily Kos search time debating Alex Smith. He certainly has better things to do than defend that bum.

 

Wow. Are you off your meds?

[detlef]

Here's another way of looking at it. That Harbaugh feels Smith is as good an option as there is out there right now. I've heard some less than glowing reports coming from Indy about Manning's arm right now, so maybe Harbaugh doesn't want to get involved in that circus. Who can blame him? Even if Manning structures his contract in a low-risk manner, you still run the risk of becoming a side-show and wasting time with a QB who is not physically able to do the job. I do think Smith was the weak link this year, but they still were one OT loss away from the SB. With some improvement, and a full season and non-lock-out summer could bring that...

 

Then there's special K. For all we know, the kid could be lights out right now and primed to be great in a few years. Certainly we haven't seen enough to assume he won't. So, that sort of rules out the draft. A

 

Therefor, if you don't want to play the Manning sweepstakes, then who else? Now you're getting rid of a guy who was at least solid enough to hold it together through a 14-4 season in exchange for one of any number of guys who also weren't good enough to be kept by the teams they were on. Is there really anyone out there worth upsetting the chemistry over? Is Smith so bad that you'd roll the dice on basically anyone?

 

I'm not saying that Smith is certainly the answer, but...

[caddyman]

Wow. Are you off your meds?

good one! Carry on tool!

[caddyman]

Here's another way of looking at it. That Harbaugh feels Smith is as good an option as there is out there right now. I've heard some less than glowing reports coming from Indy about Manning's arm right now, so maybe Harbaugh doesn't want to get involved in that circus. Who can blame him? Even if Manning structures his contract in a low-risk manner, you still run the risk of becoming a side-show and wasting time with a QB who is not physically able to do the job. I do think Smith was the weak link this year, but they still were one OT loss away from the SB. With some improvement, and a full season and non-lock-out summer could bring that...

 

Then there's special K. For all we know, the kid could be lights out right now and primed to be great in a few years. Certainly we haven't seen enough to assume he won't. So, that sort of rules out the draft. A

 

Therefor, if you don't want to play the Manning sweepstakes, then who else? Now you're getting rid of a guy who was at least solid enough to hold it together through a 14-4 season in exchange for one of any number of guys who also weren't good enough to be kept by the teams they were on. Is there really anyone out there worth upsetting the chemistry over? Is Smith so bad that you'd roll the dice on basically anyone?

 

I'm not saying that Smith is certainly the answer, but...

Absolutely true....most people agree that they don't have a much better option as of now. But frankly if they did, they would excercise it. Even with all of his faults, they almost made it to the big game. We will see what happens next year though. But you know damn well if Harbaugh was offered guys like Shaub, Ryan, Bradford, cutler, Dalton, Flacco, or Freeman he would take them in a heartbeat.

[detlef]

Absolutely true....most people agree that they don't have a much better option as of now. But frankly if they did, they would excercise it. Even with all of his faults, they almost made it to the big game. We will see what happens next year though. But you know damn well if Harbaugh was offered guys like Shaub, Ryan, Bradford, cutler, Dalton, Flacco, or Freeman he would take them in a heartbeat.

And of course, it makes no sense for Harbaugh to come out and say, "What the hell? It's not like there's anything better out there. We may as well stick with Smith." Even if he's thinking that, he may as well make it sound like Smith is his guy.

[Sunday Couch Potatoe]

And of course, it makes no sense for Harbaugh to come out and say, "What the hell? It's not like there's anything better out there. We may as well stick with Smith." Even if he's thinking that, he may as well make it sound like Smith is his guy.

exactly... confidence goes a long way for a guy like Smith. He got some for the first time in his NFL career this year because of Harbaugh's praise and coaching. And if he's gonna be our guy then we need him overflowing with the stuff!

[Ice1]

I just looked over the starting QB's in the league, and I think Smith is around the 24-25th best QB in the league.

 

While you may not like the guy, this statement is not remotely accurate in my opinion looking at this past season.

 

36 QB's as an example threw more interceptions

Only 10 QB's had a better completion percentage

Only 8 QB's had a better QB Rating

Only 14 had more total Touchdowns

Ranked 9th in scoring

He was the QB that led his team to the #2 seed overall in the NFC.

 

While there are several uber studs at the position the 49's have no shot at them and the guy that disagrees with you by far the most is the NFL Coach of the year. Maybe Manning is a possibility but not likely as his situation is as clear as mud today.

 

No doubt this team was conservative in the red zone by design due in large part to a superior defense but this team scored well this season. This is a balanced team on offense. They didn't throw ball more than 28 times per game on average because they didn't have to as evidenced by the fact they only lost 3 games by a total of 15 points and finished third in rushing attempts. The only game they were not really competitive in was a road night game at the Ravens when they lost by 10.

 

Again, as I have stated he is not elite but he had a solid year in a new system with the a great new coach. I would very surprised if they made any changes at the position as he looks to have a solid future in the organization.

 

The stats and the record shows he did his job in this system and certainly looked to have the support of his team all season.

Edited February 10, 2012 by Ice1

[byron2112]

Some other interesting #'s... Smith ranked 20th in attempts(445), no one with less attempts started more than 14 games(and that was Blaine Gabbert)... Smith also led the League, taking 44 sacks. Tarvaris Jackson backed him up with 42... Ben Roethlisberger and Blaine Gabbert tied for 3rd with 40...

[piratesownninjas]

While you may not like the guy, this statement is not remotely accurate in my opinion looking at this past season.

 

36 QB's as an example threw more interceptions Because he's captain checkdown.

Only 10 QB's had a better completion percentage Because he's captain checkdown.

Only 8 QB's had a better QB Rating Really? You're using a formula no one really gets?

Only 14 had more total Touchdowns 14 more than a dumpster fire. He went from dumpster to average. Wow

Ranked 9th in scoring

He was the QB that led his team to the #2 seed overall in the NFC. This part is amusing... Justin Smith, Pat Willis, and company got them to the number 2 seed.

He had 7 turnovers, which is nice, but he put up a total of 19 touchdowns. This isn't 1993, this is a new era, and 19 TD's isn't getting it done. He wasn't asked to do much at all, and when he had to make plays against a legit team in the Giants, he was clearly rattled. completion percentage and low INTs mean nothing when you're incapable of throwing anything further than 10 yards... But if we need to go over my statement that you think is not remotely accurate...

 

Off the top of my head

Rodgers

Stafford

Cutler

Vick

Romo

Manning

Brees

Freeman

Ryan

Newton

Bradford

Rivers

Palmer

Tebow

Hasselbeck/Locker

Schaub

Roethlisberger

Dalton

Flacco

Sanchez

Brady

Fitzpatrick

 

Alex Smith doesn't win games... He checks down and lets his defense beat the hell out of the other guys, then hands off left, hand off right, checkdown to Delanie Walker, 7 yard pass that VD turns into a TD. He's just a guy.

[piratesownninjas]

He had 7 turnovers, which is nice, but he put up a total of 19 touchdowns. This isn't 1993, this is a new era, and 19 TD's isn't getting it done. He wasn't asked to do much at all, and when he had to make plays against a legit team in the Giants, he was clearly rattled. completion percentage and low INTs mean nothing when you're incapable of throwing anything further than 10 yards... But if we need to go over my statement that you think is not remotely accurate...

 

Off the top of my head

Rodgers

Stafford

Cutler

Vick

Romo

Manning

Brees

Freeman

Ryan

Newton

Bradford

Rivers

Palmer

Tebow

Hasselbeck/Locker

Schaub

Roethlisberger

Dalton

Flacco

Sanchez

Brady

Fitzpatrick

 

Alex Smith doesn't win games... He checks down and lets his defense beat the hell out of the other guys, then hands off left, hand off right, checkdown to Delanie Walker, 7 yard pass that VD turns into a TD. He's just a guy.

Add Griffin and Luck and then Smith... at 25.

[hardway]

He had 7 turnovers, which is nice, but he put up a total of 19 touchdowns. This isn't 1993, this is a new era, and 19 TD's isn't getting it done. He wasn't asked to do much at all, and when he had to make plays against a legit team in the Giants, he was clearly rattled. completion percentage and low INTs mean nothing when you're incapable of throwing anything further than 10 yards... But if we need to go over my statement that you think is not remotely accurate...

 

Off the top of my head

Rodgers

Stafford

Cutler

Vick

Romo

Manning

Brees

Freeman

Ryan

Newton

Bradford

Rivers

Palmer

Tebow

Hasselbeck/Locker

Schaub

Roethlisberger

Dalton

Flacco

Sanchez

Brady

Fitzpatrick

 

Alex Smith doesn't win games... He checks down and lets his defense beat the hell out of the other guys, then hands off left, hand off right, checkdown to Delanie Walker, 7 yard pass that VD turns into a TD. He's just a guy.

 

Tebow? Sanchez? You must be kidding. I've hated Alex for years, but c'mon man! Tebow is straight junk, and Sanchez gets worse every season.

 

Harbaugh is going to go with Alex again this season, and who can really blame him? We were one game away from the Superbowl this year.

 

As for Peyton, forget that! The guy is one of the greats, but I would rather add some receiving talent, get the O line built up, or just keep the whole D unit together than spend the money on Manning.

 

Peyton should go to Miami. They have a serious receiving corps that is only being held back by terrible QB play. Peyton could get the best out of Marshal, and that would be scary!

Edited February 11, 2012 by hardway

[tazinib1]

, but I would rather add some receiving talent

 

 

You can add all the WR talent you could ever wish for..the fact is, Smith can't deliver the ball. You better hope you get a Welker that can cross and not be afraid to get murdered upon catching the ball. If you are expecting a deep threat, you are seriously over-rating Smiths arm. The dude has been in the league for how many years? 6? Cmon man....

[Pancake]

He had 7 turnovers, which is nice, but he put up a total of 19 touchdowns. This isn't 1993, this is a new era, and 19 TD's isn't getting it done. He wasn't asked to do much at all, and when he had to make plays against a legit team in the Giants, he was clearly rattled. completion percentage and low INTs mean nothing when you're incapable of throwing anything further than 10 yards... But if we need to go over my statement that you think is not remotely accurate...

 

Off the top of my head

Rodgers

Stafford

Cutler

Vick

Romo

Manning

Brees

Freeman

Ryan

Newton

Bradford

Rivers

Palmer

Tebow

Hasselbeck/Locker

Schaub

Roethlisberger

Dalton

Flacco

Sanchez

Brady

Fitzpatrick

 

Alex Smith doesn't win games... He checks down and lets his defense beat the hell out of the other guys, then hands off left, hand off right, checkdown to Delanie Walker, 7 yard pass that VD turns into a TD. He's just a guy.

 

ok. I'll bite on the hook on your little fishing excursion.

 

I think your assessment is so far off on Smith that I think you are actually hiding some type of man love for him. You're hating on a man that you love to protect your vulnerabiltiy towards him. Just admit it. You love Alex Smith.

 

I think A. Smith was better than half of the starting QBs this year. His numbers clearly show it.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Pancake

[Ice1]

He had 7 turnovers, which is nice, but he put up a total of 19 touchdowns. This isn't 1993, this is a new era, and 19 TD's isn't getting it done. He wasn't asked to do much at all, and when he had to make plays against a legit team in the Giants, he was clearly rattled. completion percentage and low INTs mean nothing when you're incapable of throwing anything further than 10 yards... But if we need to go over my statement that you think is not remotely accurate...

 

So, since he does not call the plays and throws the ball;

1 time less per game than Houston

1.4 times less per game than the Bears

5.5 times less than the Steelers

6 times less than the Packers

 

and outscores all these teams but the Packers this deserves a 1993 reference.

 

While his arm is not considered elite, his yards per completion as an example was 11.5 yards. Brees as an example was 11.7 yards. His yards per attempt was 7.1 Yards vs. big armed Flacco at 6.7. Flacco had the same Yards per completion as Smith.

 

I am not a huge fan of Smith but when one actually analyzes his play it was very good by NFL standards this year. He runs the offense his coaching staff asks of him and did it effectively.

 

You can hate the guy but the bottom line is he was an effective NFL QB this past year. Comparing him to the Giants is interesting.

 

Ryan scored nothing on them with way better weapons.

Rodgers only managed a 56.5 completion percentage with a pick.

Brady 276 yards, a 6.7 Yards per attempt, and had a pick with two weeks to prepare.

 

In fact, Smith had the highest QB rating against the Giants in the playoffs. His body of work was far better than you are giving him credit for this year regardless of the 1993 reference.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Ice1

[darin3]

Why would they sign or draft another QB when they have already drafted the QB of the future in Special K? He might not be ready in 2012, but by 2013, it should be Special K's gig to lose.

Just because you draft a guy in all 108 of your dynasty leagues doesn't mean he's the Second Coming. He's a project at best and the Niners will likely bring in another QB to compete.

 

Brandon Weeden actually makes some sense.

[detlef]

Just because you draft a guy in all 108 of your dynasty leagues doesn't mean he's the Second Coming. He's a project at best and the Niners will likely bring in another QB to compete.

 

Brandon Weeden actually makes some sense.

How do we know this?

 

Regardless, the good news for the Niners is that they're young and stacked at many positions, so they can certainly afford to bring in another QB in the 1st 3 rounds to compete. But not because K is a "project at best", rather that, as history has shown, there's little reason to be sure he's the one.

[Ditkaless Wonders]

He had 7 turnovers, which is nice, but he put up a total of 19 touchdowns. This isn't 1993, this is a new era, and 19 TD's isn't getting it done. He wasn't asked to do much at all, and when he had to make plays against a legit team in the Giants, he was clearly rattled. completion percentage and low INTs mean nothing when you're incapable of throwing anything further than 10 yards... But if we need to go over my statement that you think is not remotely accurate...

 

Off the top of my head

Rodgers

Stafford

Cutler

Vick

Romo

Manning

Brees

Freeman Jury is still out on this Kid, IMO. I do like his upside still.

Ryan

Newton

Bradford He had a tough road with injuries to himself and those around him, but I like his potential. Still the jury is out

Rivers

Palmer He showed me nothing this year. I am tending towards thinking the guy is cooked. Let's stick a fork in him and find out.

Tebow As a passer Tebow would have to improve mightily to get to Smith's level. If he can the Broncos will be well pleased.

Hasselbeck/Locker Hasselbeck it done. Locker has not shown me enough to be considered in Smith's class yet. Of course Locker is young

Schaub

Roethlisberger

Dalton A good name for a bouncer at the Double Deuce, but a "Ginger" leading a team? I guess time will tell

Flacco I'm not sold.He exceeded expectations as a Rokkie and then has regressed. This will be a big year for determining where he stands.

Sanchez Hype and disappointment. I would rather have Smith. Sanchez is still young enough to show improvement, and he had better or he will be relegated.

Brady

Fitzpatrick I'm not convinced yet.

 

Alex Smith doesn't win games... He checks down and lets his defense beat the hell out of the other guys, then hands off left, hand off right, checkdown to Delanie Walker, 7 yard pass that VD turns into a TD. He's just a guy.

[piratesownninjas]

Tebow? Sanchez? You must be kidding. I've hated Alex for years, but c'mon man! Tebow is straight junk, and Sanchez gets worse every season.

 

Harbaugh is going to go with Alex again this season, and who can really blame him? We were one game away from the Superbowl this year.

 

As for Peyton, forget that! The guy is one of the greats, but I would rather add some receiving talent, get the O line built up, or just keep the whole D unit together than spend the money on Manning.

 

Peyton should go to Miami. They have a serious receiving corps that is only being held back by terrible QB play. Peyton could get the best out of Marshal, and that would be scary!

Tebow and Smith are actually similar in a lot of ways... Unimpressive numbers and all. Tebow won the division by throwing the team on his back. The entire offense was based off him. To call him junk is to say Alex Smith doesn't even deserve to play.

 

Sanchez put up 32 TD's, and has been to two AFC championship games. You can't talk about Smith driving the bus and then knock Sanchez. If we're talking about how many OC's SMith has had, then Sanchez gets the Brian Schottenheimer maybe the worst OC in the game excuse.

 

Nowhere did I say San Francisco should bring in Manning. I said that Alex Smith is the 25th best starter in the league. Saying that, I think the Niners have to go with Smith if they believe in Kaepernick. As it was mentioned above, Harbaugh has no real option other than to support his QB, but he is without a doubt the weakest link on the offense.

[piratesownninjas]

Ryan scored nothing on them with way better weapons.

Rodgers only managed a 56.5 completion percentage with a pick.

Brady 276 yards, a 6.7 Yards per attempt, and had a pick with two weeks to prepare.

 

 

In fact, Smith had the highest QB rating against the Giants in the playoffs. His body of work was far better than you are giving him credit for this year regardless of the 1993 reference.

This is where looking at the numbers as a whole will get you in trouble. He had one great throw on the VD wheel route, which was 20 yards that VD took to the house. The other was a short throw to VD that VD took to the house. Like I said, Davis accounted for the vast majority of Smith's total yards on two plays that DAVIS made incredible plays on. Watch the tape, the tape doesn't lie. Looking at numbers without actually knowing how they were produced is foolish. Aaron Rodgers had 8 drops by WR's. That's huge. Rodgers doesn't throw the ball downfield to himself. He hit guys in stride, they didn't make plays. Smith doesn't throw the ball further than 10 yards, and when he does, its to Davis, Walker, or the running back.

[tazinib1]

Just because you draft a guy in all 108 of your dynasty leagues doesn't mean he's the Second Coming. He's a project at best and the Niners will likely bring in another QB to compete.

 

Brandon Weeden actually makes some sense.

 

 

 

I have him in 1 league. 108? I'm not Henry Muto Darin.