How do we fix this?

[SEC=UGA]

I've harped on this before, but it's been a few months so here goes...

 

We're screwed, thousands of jobs available and no one to fill them because Americans a freaking lazy and dumb. Even, seemingly, the college grads... Too dumb to get a job in manufacturing and the ones who do qualify, well, some of them are too lazy to do the job when offered to them.

 

 

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Northeast Indiana has a peculiar problem.

There are hundreds of factory jobs ready for the taking as the area's manufacturing sector has come back to life after the recession.

 

But even with an unemployment rate as high as the national average, companies are struggling to hire workers.

 

This situation is top of mind for Larry Davis, CEO of Daman Manifolds in Mishawaka. The company, which makes hydraulic valve manifolds, has 115 employees.

 

Industry demand has boosted Daman Manifolds' business significantly. "We need to hire 10 more workers in the next six months," Davis said.

 

His challenge: "I'll have to go through 500 applicants just to get the 10 that I need. And there's no guarantee that those 10 hires will work out. (More: Trade school enrollment soars)

 

The longer it takes him to hire new workers, the greater the risk Davis could start losing business.

Daman Manifolds is not alone.

 

Northeast Indiana is a hotbed of manufacturing and a microcosm of a problem afflicting many employers in areas where American factories have been revived: There's a widening gulf between open jobs and qualified applicants to fill them.

 

Factories in northeast Indiana primarily support the medical device, aerospace, rail and defense industries, said Kris Deckard, executive director of "Ready Indiana," the workforce development initiative of the Indiana Chamber of Commerce.

 

The area -- 10 counties covering over 4,000 square miles -- has the country's highest concentration of manufacturing jobs, with 26% of the workforce employed in the industry.

Related: Manufacturing is my future

 

But manufacturers are having a tough time boosting their workforces, Deckard said.

A labor shortage isn't the problem. Companies are getting hundreds of applicants, she said. But they are either not the right fit or unqualified.

 

"Applicants are failing drug tests," she said. "Some apply and then decide they want to wait until their unemployment benefit runs out before taking a factory job."

 

Then there are the candidates with four-year college degrees who can't find other work. Manufacturers shy away from hiring them, believing they'll leave as soon as they find a job that's a better fit.

 

At Daman Manifolds, among hundreds of applications the company will review in coming weeks, half will likely get dumped because folks won't fill out the entire eight-page form, Davis said. Another big chunk won't make it past the phone interview.

 

Several more will fail the hands-on assessment because they lack the right skills.

 

"The No. 1 comment I'm hearing right now from manufacturers in northeast Indiana is that 5% to 10% of jobs are going unfilled because of lack of skilled workforce," said Matt Bell, president of Corporate College, a unit of Ivy Tech Community College of Indiana, the nation's largest statewide community college system.

 

All 26 Ivy Tech campuses across the state teach certificate courses in manufacturing skills, such as computer-aided manufacturing, welding and tooling.

Related: American manufacturers importing workers

 

Bell estimates that the state needs about 40,000 to 50,000 manufacturing workers right now to meet the uptick in production.

 

Corporate College graduated about 25,000 students last year from its manufacturing and business courses.

 

Given Indiana's running shortage of skilled factory workers, Bell said manufacturers are importing workers from other states such as Ohio and Michigan.

 

At Fort Wayne Metals Research, business has also picked up. The company has added 200 workers over the past two years.

 

"Our forecast is to add another 100 workers this year, too," said Mark Michael, the company's president and chief operating officer.

 

But the hiring process is long and arduous.

 

"In May we accepted 129 applications and we screened those down to 40," said Michael. "We administered three industry tests to the 40 and four people passed."

 

All four were offered a job, and only one accepted, he said. "These statistics are not unusual at all among manufacturers here," he said.

 

[detlef]

First step, every time some just spouts off, "This is the greatest country in the world" without even thinking about what they're saying, they get punched in the balls.

 

We've been the greatest country. We still can be the greatest country. But it's been some time since we've been acting like it.

 

Until we stop pretending that we're already the best just becasue we're Americans, it's not going to get fixed.

[nuke'em ttg]

everyone wants the easy way out, peddle ass or drugs show up at a real job no thanks

[SayItAintSoJoe]

How about high school seniors that aren't going to go to college get trained for these specific jobs? They can go to regular school in the AM and then training in the afternoon. Get the parent involved to make sure the kids get enrolled in the program. Require a drug test to get in the program to make sure were not wasting everyone's time.

 

Back when I was in school there were a lot of vo-tech programs but the training was very generic. I'm talking about going to the plant and getting trained for the actual job you will be doing.

[detlef]

How about high school seniors that aren't going to go to college get trained for these specific jobs? They can go to regular school in the AM and then training in the afternoon. Get the parent involved to make sure the kids get enrolled in the program. Require a drug test to get in the program to make sure were not wasting everyone's time.

 

Back when I was in school there were a lot of vo-tech programs but the training was very generic. I'm talking about going to the plant and getting trained for the actual job you will be doing.

 

Because, starting in the 80s, anyone that wasn't going to college was considered a loser. The notion of being a tradesman was looked down upon and everyone wanted to wear suits and be a stock broker.

 

So, we ended up with people who may not be "book smart" trying to go that way anyway instead of just finding something they're good at. Now we don't have enough people actually making things and too many bankers that can't add.

[Perchoutofwater]

I'd like to hire one or two more people at my shop. I can't find anyone remotely qualified. The trades are dead.

[SayItAintSoJoe]

Because, starting in the 80s, anyone that wasn't going to college was considered a loser. The notion of being a tradesman was looked down upon and everyone wanted to wear suits and be a stock broker.

 

So, we ended up with people who may not be "book smart" trying to go that way anyway instead of just finding something they're good at. Now we don't have enough people actually making things and too many bankers that can't add.

 

 

That stereotype was alot easier to maintain in a good economy where college grads were getting jobs making 40K right out of school. Now with college grads coming out of school 50K in debt and applying for jobs at BK it may be a good time to change that way of thinking for both parents and students.

Edited August 8, 2012 by SayItAintSoJoe

[SEC=UGA]

That stereotype was alot easier to maintain in a good economy where college grads were getting jobs making 40K right out of school. Now with college grads coming out of school 50K in debt and applying for jobs at BK it may be a good time to change that way of thinking for both parents and students.

 

 

Det is dead on, and you are right, as well.

 

Kids need to understand that many of these "manufacturing" jobs pay roughly 17 to 20 per hour at start and then quickly climb to 40, 50, 70 per hour. You throw in overtime and some of these guys are getting close to 6 figures.

 

My BIL is a dirty, union thug, pipe fitter. HS diploma, no college, and on many of his projects he's knocking down 40 to 50 per hour (In the NE US that scale goes up to around 60), gets a 150 per diem and works six, ten hour shifts per week. Now, granted, due to lag between jobs and time he decides to take off he "only" clears about 75 K before taxes, but, that's pretty damn good money for a HS graduate.

[stevegrab]

Great thread, and spot on. I keep hearing the "there is no jobs BS" then seeing signs for skilled labor (machinists, etc) at various shops all around the area.

 

Heck we are trying to hire a couple people now and the person in charge says it is harder than ever. These are tech positions (a windows developer and a Unix/network hardware specialist) so a little different than factory work.

 

Agree that it is a cultural thing, with people thinking those jobs suck, or the "loser if no college" angle. I hate how people look down on a mechanic or plumber, because most of are not do it yourselfers anymore and need them.

[Yukon Cornelius]

They need to put the trades back into high schools. they have been cut repeatedly since the 80's, to the point were it is a joke. but i know someone will say that to much money is going into the schools already so it is a waist of time.

[Perchoutofwater]

They need to put the trades back into high schools. they have been cut repeatedly since the 80's, to the point were it is a joke. but i know someone will say that to much money is going into the schools already so it is a waist of time.

 

 

Too much money does go to most schools. They are too reliant on technology, and most of the new schools (I used to build them) are way to extravagant. Having said that, I'd love to see them put the trades back in the high schools.

[yo mama]

I've harped on this before, but it's been a few months so here goes...

 

We're screwed, thousands of jobs available and no one to fill them because Americans a freaking lazy and dumb. Even, seemingly, the college grads... Too dumb to get a job in manufacturing and the ones who do qualify, well, some of them are too lazy to do the job when offered to them.

 

I think the problem with the article you posted is that the jobs are in Indiana. Who wants to live there?

[moneymakers]

I think the problem with the article you posted is that the jobs are in Indiana. Who wants to live there?

 

 

[Chavez]

 

 

Det is dead on, and you are right, as well.

 

Kids need to understand that many of these "manufacturing" jobs pay roughly 17 to 20 per hour at start and then quickly climb to 40, 50, 70 per hour. You throw in overtime and some of these guys are getting close to 6 figures.

 

My BIL is a dirty, union thug, pipe fitter. HS diploma, no college, and on many of his projects he's knocking down 40 to 50 per hour (In the NE US that scale goes up to around 60), gets a 150 per diem and works six, ten hour shifts per week. Now, granted, due to lag between jobs and time he decides to take off he "only" clears about 75 K before taxes, but, that's pretty damn good money for a HS graduate.

 

 

That's pretty damn good money for a good chunk of college grads.

 

 

 

[tbimm]

This is a topic that comes up regularly in our shop when the discussion is about what to do with todays youth. The trades are a great way to earn a living. I have not feared for my employment throughout the recession. I make between 65 and 75 K a year depending on the year. With my side work it is a good bit more than that. Some still look down on the lowly grunt working mechanic but I am fine with that. I decide whether or not your driving or taking the freakin bus tomorrow and my car runs!

 

Trade schools and trades in the high schools would be a great way for many of todays youth to get on the right path. Funding these programs should be a no brainer unless of course we just want to keep adding to the welfare rolls.

[Pope Flick]

I don't understand why they disappeared. Can you outsource electric installations or clearing your pipes? Good money and job security. Truly a sad state of affairs.

[cre8tiff]

I don't understand why they don't just go ahead and hire the college grads to get over the hump. They seem to want smart kids that aren't highly educated. If that isn't working, shouldn't they change thier own paradigm?

[stevegrab]

I don't understand why they don't just go ahead and hire the college grads to get over the hump. They seem to want smart kids that aren't highly educated. If that isn't working, shouldn't they change thier own paradigm?

 

What college grads are applying for these jobs? You cannot hire people that don't apply.

 

I think that is the point some are making, that too many today (whether college grad or not) think that jobs working with their hands are below them. They do not study the trades, and even those without trade skills and in need of work would not want to take these jobs and learn how to do them.

[cre8tiff]

What college grads are applying for these jobs? You cannot hire people that don't apply.

 

I think that is the point some are making, that too many today (whether college grad or not) think that jobs working with their hands are below them. They do not study the trades, and even those without trade skills and in need of work would not want to take these jobs and learn how to do them.

 

Then there are the candidates with four-year college degrees who can't find other work. Manufacturers shy away from hiring them, believing they'll leave as soon as they find a job that's a better fit.

 

That's what I was working from.

.

[stevegrab]

That's what I was working from.

.

 

Sorry I missed (or had forgotten) that part of the story.

 

I think the employers are right to an extend. If they hire these people and spend time/money training them, they won't be there long term. Once their preferred field has more openings they'll leave for greener pastures.

 

The root problem is that too many people think this kind of work is beneath them, and its something they've learned from experience in society.

[westvirginia]

The state of the trades is a real shame nowadays. If I had it to do over I'd probably have gone to trade school and become either a gunsmith or furniture/cabinetmaker. When you can get a simple tax return done for $50 or so but it takes $120 to get a plumber to unclog a drain that should tell you something...