irish Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Great post rajn, I was going to try and express my thoughts but you said it very well. Irish, You can believe or not, but please don't resort to the "religious people are idiots" angle unless you are looking for a hondastorm. I don't care what your beliefs are, but don't ridicule or belittle mine. I'm not belittling anyone's beliefs. However, my opinion is that if you pray for change, that's silly as the only way change is going to happen is if you make it happen. Religion, in my opinion, is nothing but a money making scheme that preys on those who are old, desperate or forced into it through generational pressure. Once you find the holes in it, you usually come to your senses. Rajn, I have great respect for ya brother but there's a lot I could counter with based on what you posted. I just don't have the time. However, I could start with how mother Teresa was a joke and a proven thief, look it up. So, you shouldn't really use her as a model of goodness or good morals and values. The idea behind religion is to make money off people who are sold by the fake stories of displaying good character and morals, while the church as a whole does anything but, as it turns it's nose down towards gay people and those who have sex out of wedlock, those who use protection, etc (i could go on). When looking at the number of those practicing Catholicism, they have dropped dramatically because religion is a scam and people have been duped. You can learn all about morals, values, and how to be a quality person without getting bent over a pew (literally and figuratively). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irish Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 My take on Irish's post was not that he is saying religion is bad, rather that he took exception to Watson saying that education is not an answer. Not trying to put words in his mouth...but the point I took is that people need to take responsibility for adressing racism and violence and not just pawn it off to their God as some thing that will eventually work itself out. Exactly. However, I do also, as stated above, don't have any use for religion and find it quite colt-ish. But that is my opinion and I'm entitled to that, just as others are entitled to tithe to their God above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 No you're not belitting anybody's beliefs, just calling people who believe senseless old and desperate. Won't bother responding beyond that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irish Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 No you're not belitting anybody's beliefs, just calling people who believe senseless old and desperate. Won't bother responding beyond that. You can. I respect that you have a different opinion but not what that opinion is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sksmith Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 (edited) It's quite unfair to discount the overall message based on how/why the individual got there; especially because of personal bias. I'd suggest how you view "prayer" is quite different from it's actual purpose; it is not like a letter to Santa asking for something for nothing. It is much more akin to meditation in search for ways to move toward the goal that you seek. Also, faith does not equal organized religion. I'm sure the guy attends a certain church. If he was asking for donations, you'd have a point; but he was speaking personally and from his own viewpoint. Lastly, the view of organized religion, while not necessarily off-base, is pretty weak...for to hold that as a reason to write off the good they do provide, you must be prepared to hold the same view toward every government system throughout history. Man has proven his desire to control others time and time again, whether "God" be the reason or not. Now that we've successfully proven that Mr Watson's desires are still far off...can we get back to the parts we all do agree on and look at each other as humans and not enemies This coming from someone who doesn't have a personal faith Edited December 1, 2014 by sksmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flemingd Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 I'm not belittling anyone's beliefs. Do you have an updated definition of the word "belittle" somewhere that I haven't seen? is nothing but a money making scheme that preys on those who are old, desperate you usually come to your senses. The idea behind religion is to make money off people who are sold by the fake stories because religion is a scam Not only do you look like an mister, but the amount of failed logic here is astounding. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irish Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Do you have an updated definition of the word "belittle" somewhere that I haven't seen? Not only do you look like an mister, but the amount of failed logic here is astounding. Prove it wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flemingd Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 Prove it wrong. It's not about being right or wrong, it's what an mister you're being about it. All you have to do is respectfully disagree. You refuse to do that, instead slinging barbs and insults the whole way, seconds after claiming not to. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn5033 Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 My take on Irish's post was not that he is saying religion is bad, rather that he took exception to Watson saying that education is not an answer. Not trying to put words in his mouth...but the point I took is that people need to take responsibility for adressing racism and violence and not just pawn it off to their God as some thing that will eventually work itself out. This is exactly how I took his first post as well. And now it's been escalated because a few of you guys attacked him for stating his opinion. I didn't think his post warranted such a defensive response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajncajn Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 My take on Irish's post was not that he is saying religion is bad, rather that he took exception to Watson saying that education is not an answer. Not trying to put words in his mouth...but the point I took is that people need to take responsibility for adressing racism and violence and not just pawn it off to their God as some thing that will eventually work itself out. I might agree if he were only saying that he disagrees with Watson's opinion that the "answer" is specifically religion, but he does so by degrading Watson & religion as a whole, then states that reading the Gospel is not a solution at all and calls it a "f'ing joke." Honestly, I don't think Watson meant that education & exposure(depending on what that exposure is) could not be part of a solution, only that he felt that living within the teachings of the Gospel was a primary solution. And as I stated in my response, Watson never said anything about pawning off responsibility on God and letting it work itself out. If you read the rest of Irish's posts in this thread I think it's quite obvious that he is allowing his personal experience to sway his judgement and due to that I'm just going to refrain from responding to his posts here again before I say something that I will regret myself. I will only say that he has a lot to learn about respecting someone's beliefs and opinions and I hope that whatever experience he had he can somehow come to terms with and hopefully come to the realization that people, and religions, and the "faithful" no matter what religion, as a whole should never be judged on the actions of a few or even many. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darin3 Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 Leopards, spots, carry on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilthorp Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 Always has been....always will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 This is exactly how I took his first post as well. And now it's been escalated because a few of you guys attacked him for stating his opinion. I didn't think his post warranted such a defensive response. I'm guessing you didn't read his follow up posts where proceeded to not belittle religion and their followers by telling us what idiots we are for falling for such a scam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn5033 Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 I'm guessing you didn't read his follow up posts where proceeded to not belittle religion and their followers by telling us what idiots we are for falling for such a scam. No I did that is why I said his first post. After that I'm staying out of it 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 No I did that is why I said his first post. After that I'm staying out of it And I missed that part of your post, sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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