gilthorp Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 I am done sticking up for him. I am totally done with garza, shea, tucker etc. This does not mean I don't want him to do well, I just won't be defending his work product any longer. Not questioning his athletic skill. A leader does lead and produce, consistently. He is a follower being asked to lead at the highest level and is proving he is incapable of doing this, except occasionally. His decision making is highly questionable on the field and he does not handle adversity well. A real leader would not have let their coach pocket 3 time outs and carry ZERO points into halftime while letting 45 seconds basically run off the clock....knowing you were going to get the ball to start the 3rd quarter. No fire...or desire to fight for it. I have seen enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowboutthemCowboys Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 I was blasted around here when I called Cutler out for coming out with a strained knee in a playoff game. RG3 played on 1 leg, romo played with broken ribs..Cam too. The list goes on. Cutlers a punk bitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwolf68 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) I was blasted around here when I called Cutler out for coming out with a strained knee in a playoff game. RG3 played on 1 leg, romo played with broken ribs..Cam too. The list goes on. Cutlers a punk bitch The best example of playing injured was Phil Rivers playing basically an entire game (playoffs) with a torn ACL. Cutler sucks. Edited October 21, 2014 by kwolf68 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTSuper7 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 That shouldn't be a one-time accomplishment for a guy who has started 100+ games. He has also fumbled it 8 times this year with 3 of them lost. He's in the midst of his career statistically? He's a 10 year veteran QB who makes a few more TDs for every time he turns it over. I'm just saying that people are acting like Cutler is terrible, and I just wanted to offer some statistics to back up that he is playing better this year than any other year of his career. I realize statistics don't tell the whole story, but yesterday was the worst game of an otherwise above average year. And sure, maybe the benchmark isn't all that high, but nobody here is putting Cutler in the upper tier of QBs anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sausagekingchi Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Fact: Cutler was not allowed back into the playoff game against the Packers. The injury occurred in the first half and he played on it. Team doctors would not let him back on the field after the first series of the second half. He tried to prove he was healthy enough by throwing on the sideline and riding the stationary bike, but he was not allowed so he sat there dejected on the sideline. As for Rivers lets no pretend he was in the same scenario. He hurt his knee and has surgery to clean it up and then played in a game the next week with a brace and cortisone shots. Cortisone shots are extremely powerful pain relievers, and is something Cutler can not take due to his Type II diabetes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Def. Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Fact: Cutler was not allowed back into the playoff game against the Packers. The injury occurred in the first half and he played on it. Team doctors would not let him back on the field after the first series of the second half. He tried to prove he was healthy enough by throwing on the sideline and riding the stationary bike, but he was not allowed so he sat there dejected on the sideline. As for Rivers lets no pretend he was in the same scenario. He hurt his knee and has surgery to clean it up and then played in a game the next week with a brace and cortisone shots. Cortisone shots are extremely powerful pain relievers, and is something Cutler can not take due to his Type II diabetes. Just a little fact clearing, Cutler has type I and cortisone could be used for a diabetic as long as it is short term. Regardless, he was not allowed back in the game and blaming him for that or calling him a punk based on that is ridiculous. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwolf68 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Ok Cutler isn't a punk for not going into that playoff game, but he's still a poor leader and an inconsistent QB prone to dumb decisions. Bears have done everything for that guy...improved offensive line, skilled receivers, a good running game to balance on, offensive minded coaches...yet he's still the same Jay Cutler. Bears go nowhere with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sausagekingchi Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) I stand corrected on what type of diabetes Cutler has. I was simply typing away and not paying enough attention. He actually has the rarer form of diabetes and the one that requires him to take insulin shots. I knew it, just typed the wrong thing. In regards to the cortisone shot, it does not matter which type of diabetes you have it is a danger to take one and even more so for Type 1. Doctors will sometimes use it, but need to instruct their patients of the dangers. A doctor would never give a shot to someone in Cutler's situation during that game as it literally puts his life in danger. Edited October 21, 2014 by sausagekingchi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrab Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 So much Cutler hate, nice to read a few actual facts mixed in there, thanks sausagekingchi. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishPride Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Every bromance has ups and downs? Marshall needs Cutler and vice versa? These guys have saved each other million times? When Marshall needed mental help and Cutler needed to make up for his lack of physical skills? Cutler puts up with Marshal and Marshall catches all the bad balls he throws? Match made in FF heavan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTSuper7 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 So much Cutler hate, nice to read a few actual facts mixed in there, thanks sausagekingchi. Here's another interesting set of stats... Jay Cutler, this season, sports a 2:1 TD to INT ratio thus far. Earlier in this thread, it was insinuated that failing to reach a 2:1 TD to INT ratio to this point in his career is a sign of QB mediocrity. I got curious to know how good of a benchmark that ratio really is, so I did come checking... Well, there are currently only 6 active QBs that sport over a 2:1 TD to INT ratio (Rodgers, Brady, Peyton, Rivers, Romo and Brees - in that order). Matt Ryan at 1.98 is just about there too. Then it drops off to Ben at 1.83, then down from there. For what it's worth, Aaron Rodgers has an absurd 3.89 ratio which is more than 1 full point higher than Brady at 2.74. Further, looking at career statistics, there are only 8 QBS in NFL history who sport a career 2:1 TD to INT ratio (Rodgers, Brady, Peyton, Rivers, Steve Young, Romo, Brees, and Donovan McNabb). If I include everyone at or above a 1.9 ratio, then the list would also include Matt Ryan, Joe Montana, and Jeff Garcia. Then it falls again to Ben at 1.83, then Neil O'Donnell at 1.76, Rich Gannon at 1.73, Mark Brunell at 1.7, then down from there. Some notable names not on the above list: Dan Marino (1.67), Kurt Warner (1.62), Brett Favre (1.51), Bernie Kosar (1.43), and John Elway (1.33). Prior to this season, Cutler's career ratio was 1.38 (it sits at 1.42 through last week's game). 1.42 puts Cutler at 40th all time, not impressive at all (he's tied with Trent Green and Kyle Orton). So the 2:1 ratio through almost half a season is one positive sign that Cutler is actually having a decent year, despite the fact that "Bad Jay" won't probably ever go away. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sausagekingchi Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Good analysis MT! I also could not agree more with your last statement. Cutler is a good QB but he will always make those idiotic mistakes. There is no reason to think that will change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishPride Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 He's a lot like Eli? You have to take the good with the bad? They both have the abilities to be at times elite and then, there's the bad? Forced passes, fumbles, untimely interceptions, its like they mentally implode? The only thing I'm able to hang my hat on is Eli has his super bowls. But believe me as a life long Giants fan, they are very similar as far as expectations go, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTSuper7 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Full disclosure: Even though career numbers are interesting, when you look at today's pass happy NFL, a 2:1 TD to INT ratio isn't really all that good: http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/touchdown-to-interception-ratio/2014/. Cutler doesn't sniff the top 10 in any of his seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Brown Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Here's another interesting set of stats... Jay Cutler, this season, sports a 2:1 TD to INT ratio thus far. Earlier in this thread, it was insinuated that failing to reach a 2:1 TD to INT ratio to this point in his career is a sign of QB mediocrity. I got curious to know how good of a benchmark that ratio really is, so I did come checking... Well, there are currently only 6 active QBs that sport over a 2:1 TD to INT ratio (Rodgers, Brady, Peyton, Rivers, Romo and Brees - in that order). Matt Ryan at 1.98 is just about there too. Then it drops off to Ben at 1.83, then down from there. For what it's worth, Aaron Rodgers has an absurd 3.89 ratio which is more than 1 full point higher than Brady at 2.74. Further, looking at career statistics, there are only 8 QBS in NFL history who sport a career 2:1 TD to INT ratio (Rodgers, Brady, Peyton, Rivers, Steve Young, Romo, Brees, and Donovan McNabb). If I include everyone at or above a 1.9 ratio, then the list would also include Matt Ryan, Joe Montana, and Jeff Garcia. Then it falls again to Ben at 1.83, then Neil O'Donnell at 1.76, Rich Gannon at 1.73, Mark Brunell at 1.7, then down from there. Some notable names not on the above list: Dan Marino (1.67), Kurt Warner (1.62), Brett Favre (1.51), Bernie Kosar (1.43), and John Elway (1.33). Prior to this season, Cutler's career ratio was 1.38 (it sits at 1.42 through last week's game). 1.42 puts Cutler at 40th all time, not impressive at all (he's tied with Trent Green and Kyle Orton). So the 2:1 ratio through almost half a season is one positive sign that Cutler is actually having a decent year, despite the fact that "Bad Jay" won't probably ever go away. I was the one that stated that the 2:1 mark (while ignoring fumbles lost) for this season, so far, wasn't necessarily impressive. Not sure where you are getting the active QB info from anyways. For instance Russel Wilson is 62 to 21 and not included on your list. Further, comparing career ratios is somewhat of an apples to oranges comparison to what was discussed anyways. The following comparisons are specific to what was talked about.... Luck is on pace for a better than 2:1 mark for the 2nd time 3 seasons; Wilson for the 3rd time in 3 years. Granted Luck and Wilson aren't your average 3 year NFL starters...but still...non bear homers should dump praise on Cutler for maybe doing it the first time in his 9 year career? Meh. I stand by what I said. He's a massively error prone QB. Needing to point out his 15 total TDs to his 10 total turnovers on the season thus far as huge improvement is indicative of his error proneness. Edited October 21, 2014 by Bobby Brown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Brown Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Full disclosure: Even though career numbers are interesting, when you look at today's pass happy NFL, a 2:1 TD to INT ratio isn't really all that good: http://www.sportingc...on-ratio/2014/. Cutler doesn't sniff the top 10 in any of his seasons. Okay I didn't see this post after my post above; but this is along the lines of what I was talking about previously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTSuper7 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I was the one that stated that the 2:1 mark (while ignoring fumbles lost) for this season, so far, wasn't necessarily impressive. Not sure where you are getting the active QB info from anyways. For instance Russel Wilson is 62 to 21 and not included on your list. Here's my source: http://www.footballdb.com/leaders/active-passing-tdintratio Wilson is omitted because the list only includes those with at least 1,500 pass attempts. So any of the young QBs in the league won't be on this list. Hadn't even realized that when I was reviewing it, but I guess it makes sense to have a baseline number of attempts so a one season aberration (i.e. Nick Foles last year) doesn't skew results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KipperSD Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Anyway you slice it, his numbers are marginal and have been since his days in Denver. Like previously stated, there are only a few elite QBs, but mediocre QBs can win super bowls too. Here's my question though, when do you cut the cord? They can find another mediocre QB so at least try to find the next elite QB. He's had his chances with good offensive players and a good defense. Time for CHI to turn the page IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowboutthemCowboys Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Anyway you slice it, his numbers are marginal and have been since his days in Denver. Like previously stated, there are only a few elite QBs, but mediocre QBs can win super bowls too. Here's my question though, when do you cut the cord? They can find another mediocre QB so at least try to find the next elite QB. He's had his chances with good offensive players and a good defense. Time for CHI to turn the page IMO. $126 mil for 7 yrs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Def. Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 $126 mil for 7 yrs Structured in a team friendly contract though. After 2016 it becomes a year to year deal with no cap penalties if released. So to answer Kip's post, Cutler is pretty much assured the job next year already. 2016 is probably when changes would start to be considered, and most likely that would be in the terms of a drafted developmental QB. Bears have made their bed with Trestman and Cutler and will have to lay in it till at least 2016. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Brown Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 $126 mil for 7 yrs I still don't blame the Bear brass for doing that. He was going to get that value somewhere, and as Def stated; it's a cap friendly contract that doesn't last throughout the duration of the contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougsul Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Does Cutler not have time to throw down field or are Jeffrey and Marshall just not open. With their hight you would think they could make a play on the ball even if covered. Last three weeks Forte has 28 catches great for Forte owners, but not for the Bears. Cutler is changing into Alex Smith in front of our eyes. btw i am to the point of thinking of sitting Mashall he is avering like 58 yards a game now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowboutthemCowboys Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I still don't blame the Bear brass for doing that. He was going to get that value somewhere, and as Def stated; it's a cap friendly contract that doesn't last throughout the duration of the contract. Yeah, not saying it was horrible. Was replying to the poster above me who stated it was time for the Bears to move on from Cutler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Anyway you slice it, his numbers are marginal and have been since his days in Denver. Like previously stated, there are only a few elite QBs, but mediocre QBs can win super bowls too. Here's my question though, when do you cut the cord? They can find another mediocre QB so at least try to find the next elite QB. He's had his chances with good offensive players and a good defense. Time for CHI to turn the page IMO. Serious question, how did you feel about Philip Rivers a few years ago? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowboutthemCowboys Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Serious question, how did you feel about Philip Rivers a few years ago? I get what your saying..but..when are Cutlers weapons gonna be any better than they are right now? Marshall, Jeffery, Bennett, Forte..damn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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