Cunning Runt Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) For starters, this is not intended to be politcal in any way. Beyond that, I don't even know where to begin. I read the papers and the internet. I watch the news and what I'm seeing/hearing is absolutely overwhelming. The magnitude of what we're going through is historic and not in a good way. I said in a post about a month or more ago that we are truly going through a complete re-set of how we, as a people, do things. I ask myself - Will I have enough money to retire? What can I do to protect my situation? Is it ok to spend money? Will I have a job a year from now? A week from now? Where are all the people who've lost their jobs going to work? - I mean, we are clearly shifting away from a nation that makes things. How are these unemployed going to be re-absorbed into the work force? How does this cycle end? No one is spending money because they're afraid they're going to be the next to lose their jobs, but yet people are losing their jobs because no one is buying the goods/services in the first place. Seriously, how does that cycle end? I don't have answers for any of this obviously, but for my part, I'm really, really concerned. The news is just SO bad and keeps getting worse pretty much daily. Is this really all because of mortgages? Really? How did things get so bad so fast? I'm frustrated. I'm concerned. I have no optimism at all right now other than the underlying faith I have as an American that we shall perservere and come out of this stronger. Kind of like believing in God. There's nothing factual that says that God does exist, but you've gotta have faith. That's really the only thing I can hang my hat on right now, because based on what I'm seeing and hearing, it really is that bad right now and it looks like it's only going to get worse still. Sorry for the doom and gloom. I'm just dazed and confused by all this. I have no debt other than a mortgage that is well under my means. I work hard. I save. I max my 401k. I don't live at all beyond my means, yet I'm concerned for my situation and I'm blown away that through nothing I've done, that I am in fact as concerned as I am. Again - sorry for the doom and gloom. Hopefully I've got this all wrong. Edited March 4, 2009 by Cunning Runt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 I know many folks that aren't spending because they think the government is going to fleece them, very soon. The tax hikes in MA are roughly as unbelievable as the things taxes are being used for (such as a weigh-in program at schools to let parents know their kids are overweight....seriously...). The Fed Gov is not that far behind. Spend some time reading into the intricate web of different government bureaucracies that exist, and you just might get the urge to throw up. I try to make the point to people that the confiscation of dollars by the government both devalues the dollars that they confiscate (think "handling fees" associated with collecting, counting, accounting, distributing, tracking the distribution, deciding what the dollars will be use for, corruption and shrinkage, etc., etc.) AND puts the money in irresponsible hands. Whether those hands are the executive committee at AIG or some baby-momma in California with 14 kids, it's not helping the people that are earning the money to be able to continue to earn the money. The private sector is what is strained, and somehow the government thinks it can alleviate the strain by straining them with more tax burden. It's freaking insane. And people...there are more taxes than income taxes. The government is constantly looking for new places to conveniently tuck taxes that they can get supported by different causes. Your taxes are going up, no matter what some politician told you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheikYerbuti Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 Kind of like believing in God. There's nothing factual that says that God does exist, but you've gotta have faith. Um, no I don't. I'm going to go out and ponder all this over a $6 latte at Starbucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) I know many folks that aren't spending because they think the government is going to fleece them, very soon. The tax hikes in MA are roughly as unbelievable as the things taxes are being used for (such as a weigh-in program at schools to let parents know their kids are overweight....seriously...). The Fed Gov is not that far behind. Spend some time reading into the intricate web of different government bureaucracies that exist, and you just might get the urge to throw up. I try to make the point to people that the confiscation of dollars by the government both devalues the dollars that they confiscate (think "handling fees" associated with collecting, counting, accounting, distributing, tracking the distribution, deciding what the dollars will be use for, corruption and shrinkage, etc., etc.) AND puts the money in irresponsible hands. Whether those hands are the executive committee at AIG or some baby-momma in California with 14 kids, it's not helping the people that are earning the money to be able to continue to earn the money. The private sector is what is strained, and somehow the government thinks it can alleviate the strain by straining them with more tax burden. It's freaking insane. And people...there are more taxes than income taxes. The government is constantly looking for new places to conveniently tuck taxes that they can get supported by different causes. Your taxes are going up, no matter what some politician told you. Pretty much how I feel. I'm keeping my money on the sidelines trying to figure out how far government is going to go, and what the cost of that additional government is going to be to me and others like me, and those we employ and those the we work for. I have a feeling that our government is about to make a big change, and it isn't going to t be for the better, I just can't tell how bad it is going to be at this point. Edited March 4, 2009 by Perchoutofwater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikesVikes Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 My old boss always said that people born after the depression don't know what bad times are and don't think crap can happen to them. It just makes you more wise. Now you know differently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmarc117 Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 My old boss always said that people born after the depression don't know what bad times are and don't think crap can happen to them. It just makes you more wise. Now you know differently. yep. my grandfather passed away last fall at 101. i talked to him about the big D. changes the way u look at things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted March 4, 2009 Author Share Posted March 4, 2009 Pretty much how I feel. I'm keeping my money on the sidelines trying to figure out how far government is going to go, and what the cost of that additional government is going to be to me and others like me, and those we employ and those the we work for. I have a feeling that our government is about to make a big change, and it isn't going to t be for the better, I just can't tell how bad it is going to be at this point. Well - you and Nick went the "government" route on this thread, which to me equates "politics". So NOT what my thread was about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) Well - you and Nick went the "government" route on this thread, which to me equates "politics". So NOT what my thread was about. Maybe to you, but not to me. My statement is as bipartisan as can be, applies to The Obama administration, the Bush administration, the current congress, the previous congress, the McCain administration that might have been, and the actions of the Government in general over the last few decades. You can't separate out the effect the government has had on the economy. It's not political, it's just the result of actions by an entity. Edited March 4, 2009 by Caveman_Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 If I were you Nick, I'd put my money towards more canned goods and water for your cave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 If I were you Nick, I'd put my money towards more canned goods and water for your cave. And ammo to protect the canned goods and water when the likes of you is trying to take it from him to keep from starving... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Waffle Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 To me, every body is still clinging to "recession", the market went under 7000, the banks are insolvent, the housing market is dead in the water,most mortgages are under water (house worth less than what is owed..that's like when you drive a new car of the lot).....people, we are in a "depression" and it's gonna get worse before it gets better. The refinance at a lower rate is a joke when the majority of homes are worth less than what is trying to be refinanced....that's nice to get a lower payment, but banks are still having to refinance something that if it comes back to them is worth less than the note on it!!! So, as of right now, there is no end in sight and the grass is not getting greener and rock bottom is approaching very fast....gloomy, no, just fdlat out realistic. Also, all this "bail out" money will haunt our childern and their children for generstions to come....middle class or less will completely be the norm they are forced to thrive in.....sad, but true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Neutron Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 To me, every body is still clinging to "recession", the market went under 7000, the banks are insolvent, the housing market is dead in the water,most mortgages are under water (house worth less than what is owed..that's like when you drive a new car of the lot).....people, we are in a "depression" and it's gonna get worse before it gets better. The refinance at a lower rate is a joke when the majority of homes are worth less than what is trying to be refinanced....that's nice to get a lower payment, but banks are still having to refinance something that if it comes back to them is worth less than the note on it!!! So, as of right now, there is no end in sight and the grass is not getting greener and rock bottom is approaching very fast....gloomy, no, just fdlat out realistic. Also, all this "bail out" money will haunt our childern and their children for generstions to come....middle class or less will completely be the norm they are forced to thrive in.....sad, but true. I think the economy is bad and going to get worse, but a lot of this post is exaggeration. Not all banks are insolvent. The housing market is slow, but people are still buying - at least locally. I think we're still a far cry from "most mortgages being underwater." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Waffle Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 I think the economy is bad and going to get worse, but a lot of this post is exaggeration. Not all banks are insolvent. The housing market is slow, but people are still buying - at least locally. I think we're still a far cry from "most mortgages being underwater." Yes, and the person selling the house ( builder ) is losing his arse big time. Hey, I hope I'm wrong, but I'm still waiting on some good news to come across the paper, TV, internet.....having seen any in many, many moons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Neutron Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Yes, and the person selling the house ( builder ) is losing his arse big time. Hey, I hope I'm wrong, but I'm still waiting on some good news to come across the paper, TV, internet.....having seen any in many, many moons. Good news would definately be welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 If I were you Nick, I'd put my money towards more canned goods and water for your cave. I imagine I am more prepared to deal with economic downturn than most because of my habits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted March 5, 2009 Author Share Posted March 5, 2009 Well, I don't know how this is all going to play out. It's just such a perfect storm of economic mess that I just honestly don't know what the outcome will be. And I hope like hell I make it through unscathed - save for losing a big chunk of change in my 401k. I'm of the opinion right now that if that's the worst that happens to me and my family that I did pretty well. I'm hoping that's the case, but damn, it's just real freaking hard to be optimistic when every day it's just more bad news. Everyone has an opinion on what we should have done and what we should do going forward. I hope what Obama is doing works. I really do. I voted for the guy. I'm willing to accept some degree of the "socialism" many of you allude to if means helpng to get us out of this mess. It's pretty clear that a truly capitalist free-market has major flaws - mainly greed. I'm of the mindset that our government needs considerably more oversight and influence on how many industries are run. If they're truly that critical hroughout the economy that a problem in one causes this kind of effect on the entire economy, then for my part, I want more regulation. If that equals socialism, so be it. Ultimately though, I just want this all to be over. Depressing as hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muck Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Hold on to your finances loosely. Hold on to your familiy tightly. Remember, good times and bad times both exist for a season ... sometimes the seasons are long, though ... so, try to keep your chin up when its tough and try to keep your feet on the ground when times are great ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyalboyd Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Hold on to your finances loosely. Hold on to your familiy tightly. Remember, good times and bad times both exist for a season ... sometimes the seasons are long, though ... so, try to keep your chin up when its tough and try to keep your feet on the ground when times are great ... Could not have been stated better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheikYerbuti Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 so, try to keep your chin up when its tough and try to keep your feet on the ground when times are great ... [kaseykasem]Keep your feet on the ground, and keep reaching for the stars. [/kaseykasem] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Irish Doggy Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 And ammo to protect the canned goods and water when the likes of you is trying to take it from him to keep from starving... Don't forget to stock up on the bananas for your chimps too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Holy Roller Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 It's not the good times that show a man'scounty's character, it's the tough times. I am in the process of building my final home. I went to our local bank and had no problems getting more money than I asked for. Every contractor I've had on the job has been very thankful to me for the opportunity to work. Building costs have gone down since we started in December and it's actually cheaper to build now than when we made our budget for the house. Am I worried about what I'm doing in the face of what the news says? Not much. My mom and grandparents went through the Depression and the most important object in their lives was the family. I will pray for our country, I will work heartily at my job, and I will take care of my family. But I will NOT succumb to the fear being spread like bad seed by the people who for the most part do not touch my life or my family. Short-sighted? Maybe. Afraid? Never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polksalet Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 (edited) Well, I don't know how this is all going to play out. It's just such a perfect storm of economic mess that I just honestly don't know what the outcome will be. And I hope like hell I make it through unscathed - save for losing a big chunk of change in my 401k. I'm of the opinion right now that if that's the worst that happens to me and my family that I did pretty well. I'm hoping that's the case, but damn, it's just real freaking hard to be optimistic when every day it's just more bad news. Everyone has an opinion on what we should have done and what we should do going forward. I hope what Obama is doing works. I really do. I voted for the guy. I'm willing to accept some degree of the "socialism" many of you allude to if means helpng to get us out of this mess. It's pretty clear that a truly capitalist free-market has major flaws - mainly greed. I'm of the mindset that our government needs considerably more oversight and influence on how many industries are run. If they're truly that critical hroughout the economy that a problem in one causes this kind of effect on the entire economy, then for my part, I want more regulation. If that equals socialism, so be it. Ultimately though, I just want this all to be over. Depressing as hell. Its pulisies like you that are going to be the end of this country. Why don't you ball up and improve your situation on your own. Grab onto the teet of the man if you like but for me and others like me we will survive. And if you would run firefox you wouldn't need to learn how to spell. Edited March 5, 2009 by polksalet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted March 5, 2009 Author Share Posted March 5, 2009 Its pulisies like you that are going to be the end of this country. Why don't you ball up and improve your situation on your own. Grab onto the teet of the man if you like but for me and others like me we will survive. And if you would run firefox you wouldn't need to learn how to spell. Atta boy Rambo. Go get 'em killer. I'm not gonna dignify this drivel with an in-depth reply other than to say that if it came to me or you surviving, it would be me. A mistake on your part questioning my will, but one I'll grant you since you don't know me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoJoTheWebToedBoy Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Good news would definately be welcome. I found a dollar today.... Runt, take a deep breath and breathe..... It's no use worrying about things you can't control. I was chewing on the same thing a couple of weeks ago and came to the conclusion that there is not a damm thing I can do about it other then prepare for the worse and hope for the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted March 5, 2009 Author Share Posted March 5, 2009 I found a dollar today.... Runt, take a deep breath and breathe..... It's no use worrying about things you can't control. I was chewing on the same thing a couple of weeks ago and came to the conclusion that there is not a damm thing I can do about it other then prepare for the worse and hope for the best. No doubt and that's what I'm doing. Not worrying so much about my own situation. I feel confident I'm in good shape. But just in general, this whole thing is blowing me away - how things got so bad so fast and how there doesn't seem to be any answers. That's what I'm concerned about. Polk can man up and get all Grizzly Adams on me, but when all is said and done, I'll pay Polk to make me a sammich and we'll kick back and "cheers" with the beverages that I paid him to fetch us. And we'll laugh. Oh how we'll laugh at how silly this thread was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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