rajncajn Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Catch em' out in the ocean, and sink em'. Is that really your remedy? I am basing my vengeance statement off the basis that the pirates themselves have come out and said that they are now looking to target and kill or torture any Americans that they see. They are in this for vengeance now, not money. They don't care if they earn bullets. That will only make them hungrier to hurt us. It won't deter them. I am not in any way saying that we should concede to them. I'm just saying that we should use some tact, since we are not used to fighting an opponent like this. If this was a group or another military, I'm with you, blow em' up. But this is a group that we cannot locate, let alone identify. We have no way of defending ourselves from them, yet we just put a big target on our backs anyways. So I guess next, you guys are going to propose that we simply go to all of the countries that these pirates may be from and start blowing up civilians? Right? Our violent action did not scare them in the least. All it did was save one life, and risk hundreds if not thousands more. So, without having to read all of this thread what would your solution have been to the captain being held hostage? Just let him die in hopes that we would not piss them off? And if they killed him what would your solution have been then? What do you think we should do at this point and what really makes you believe that any type of dialog would have prevented this from happening? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Catch em' out in the ocean, and sink em'. Is that really your remedy? I am basing my vengeance statement off the basis that the pirates themselves have come out and said that they are now looking to target and kill or torture any Americans that they see. They are in this for vengeance now, not money. They don't care if they earn bullets. That will only make them hungrier to hurt us. It won't deter them. I am not in any way saying that we should concede to them. I'm just saying that we should use some tact, since we are not used to fighting an opponent like this. If this was a group or another military, I'm with you, blow em' up. But this is a group that we cannot locate, let alone identify. We have no way of defending ourselves from them, yet we just put a big target on our backs anyways. So I guess next, you guys are going to propose that we simply go to all of the countries that these pirates may be from and start blowing up civilians? Right? Our violent action did not scare them in the least. All it did was save one life, and risk hundreds if not thousands more. something very here. I am guessing h8tank hacked this guy's account and this is a baited hook where he pulls some switcheroo with terrorism "appeasement". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 So, without having to read all of this thread what would your solution have been to the captain being held hostage? Just let him die in hopes that we would not piss them off? And if they killed him what would your solution have been then? What do you think we should do at this point and what really makes you believe that any type of dialog would have prevented this from happening? Come on, they weren't going to kill him. It is awfully hard to request a ransom when you aren't holding anything of value. By all accounts they were taking him back to the port where they could hide him. I don't know what i would have done, I am not trained for such matters. I am sure, however, that our people, namely the seals, are well versed in ways to combat these situations without having to use deadly force. We have many weapons built to incapacitate without killing. Going forward, we don't really have any options. Sit and wait to be attacked, and hope we are prepared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicCEO Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 I don't know what i would have done, I am not trained for such matters. I am sure, however, that our people, namely the seals, are well versed in ways to combat these situations without having to use deadly force. We have many weapons built to incapacitate without killing. A sniper beanbag? No, I agree with the folks on the kill-the-pirates bandwagon. These people aren't religious zealots out to kidnap and kill for attention or an ideology. The only thing they want is money, and if they realize that the end of these situations is going to often enough be death rather than money, they'll have no motivation to do it. All of the pirate's "Now we're going to get angry" talk is for the media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H8tank Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 I am basing my vengeance statement off the basis that the pirates themselves have come out and said that they are now looking to target and kill or torture any Americans that they see. They are in this for vengeance now, not money. This has got to be an act, there are only a few people this dense, namely cr8tin, so I hope this is a joke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 I guess my main point is that these pirates are a lot more dangerous than I feel a lot of people here are giving them credit for. Shooting one doesn't make them go away. Whether or not we wanted one, we have just started a war, and on their turf. Let us see what happens. It is my contention that we just cost ourselves many lives, and lots and lots of money. We'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Cid Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 I guess my main point is that these pirates are a lot more dangerous than I feel a lot of people here are giving them credit for. Shooting one doesn't make them go away. Whether or not we wanted one, we have just started a war, and on their turf. Let us see what happens. It is my contention that we just cost ourselves many lives, and lots and lots of money. We'll see. You never kept your lunch money in grade school, did you? You don't stop a bully through tact, diplomacy and negotiation. You stop a bully by beating the piss out of him (or her as the case may be). Doing anything other than reacting with force would have encouraged the pirates to do it again because there were no negative repercussions involved in performing the act. Now they know, F with an American ship and you have to deal with the US Navy. Their rhetoric in the press is nothing more than hot air. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azazello1313 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 I guess my main point is that these pirates are a lot more dangerous than I feel a lot of people here are giving them credit for. Shooting one doesn't make them go away. Whether or not we wanted one, we have just started a war, and on their turf. Let us see what happens. It is my contention that we just cost ourselves many lives, and lots and lots of money. We'll see. as a great leader once said, "bring it on". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 You never kept your lunch money in grade school, did you? You don't stop a bully through tact, diplomacy and negotiation. You stop a bully by beating the piss out of him (or her as the case may be). Doing anything other than reacting with force would have encouraged the pirates to do it again because there were no negative repercussions involved in performing the act. Now they know, F with an American ship and you have to deal with the US Navy. Their rhetoric in the press is nothing more than hot air. The same could be said for North Korea and Iran, but we are going to talk nice to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Cid Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 The same could be said for North Korea and Iran, but we are going to talk nice to them. Both those are vastly different situations than the pirates and you know it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Both those are vastly different situations than the pirates and you know it. Clearly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajncajn Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Come on, they weren't going to kill him. It is awfully hard to request a ransom when you aren't holding anything of value. By all accounts they were taking him back to the port where they could hide him. I don't know what i would have done, I am not trained for such matters. I am sure, however, that our people, namely the seals, are well versed in ways to combat these situations without having to use deadly force. We have many weapons built to incapacitate without killing. Going forward, we don't really have any options. Sit and wait to be attacked, and hope we are prepared. They were holding a frigging AK-47 to his head. What the hell? I guess my main point is that these pirates are a lot more dangerous than I feel a lot of people here are giving them credit for. Shooting one doesn't make them go away. Whether or not we wanted one, we have just started a war, and on their turf. Let us see what happens. It is my contention that we just cost ourselves many lives, and lots and lots of money. We'll see. Namely you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 You never kept your lunch money in grade school, did you? You don't stop a bully through tact, diplomacy and negotiation. You stop a bully by beating the piss out of him (or her as the case may be). Doing anything other than reacting with force would have encouraged the pirates to do it again because there were no negative repercussions involved in performing the act. Now they know, F with an American ship and you have to deal with the US Navy. Their rhetoric in the press is nothing more than hot air. My brother from another mother... Seahags, you really went to the Neville Chamberlain school of diplomacy, didn't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Seahags, you really went to the Neville Chamberlain school of diplomacy, didn't you? That's funny but then I do like a historical joke. Surprising how many people these days will completely fail to get that. Recent episode of Jeopardy saw all three contestants fail to correctly name the city where the Chamberlain - Hitler talks took place. Ah, history always repeats when forgotten....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 That's funny but then I do like a historical joke. Surprising how many people these days will completely fail to get that. Recent episode of Jeopardy saw all three contestants fail to correctly name the city where the Chamberlain - Hitler talks took place. Ah, history always repeats when forgotten....... I bet Chamberlain would want to talk to Ahmadinejad as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 (edited) That's funny but then I do like a historical joke. Surprising how many people these days will completely fail to get that. Recent episode of Jeopardy saw all three contestants fail to correctly name the city where the Chamberlain - Hitler talks took place. Ah, history always repeats when forgotten....... Aww, crap. Vienna? Now I gotta go look it up because I can't remember... ETA - not even CLOSE! Samsonite! Edited April 20, 2009 by westvirginia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Aww, crap. Vienna? Now I gotta go look it up because I can't remember... ETA - not even CLOSE! Samsonite! Munich if my memory hasn't failed me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 All I ask is that you remember this conversation. This is only the beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 You never kept your lunch money in grade school, did you? You don't stop a bully through tact, diplomacy and negotiation. You stop a bully by beating the piss out of him (or her as the case may be). Doing anything other than reacting with force would have encouraged the pirates to do it again because there were no negative repercussions involved in performing the act. Now they know, F with an American ship and you have to deal with the US Navy. Their rhetoric in the press is nothing more than hot air. These aren't bullies. They are the kids that plant the trip wires the bullies trip over. These are the guys that have trained themseves to take from and assault the bullies, namely us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted April 20, 2009 Author Share Posted April 20, 2009 These aren't bullies. They are the kids that plant the trip wires the bullies trip over. These are the guys that have trained themseves to take from and assault the bullies, namely us. Son, you have bought a load of crap that someone had to sell. These pirates are looking for one thing; money. Nothing political about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchoutofwater Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 The irony in this thread is just too good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpwallace49 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Wait a minute . . . . are you really that concerned about a bunch of guys in glorified bass master boats getting "mad"? This isnt like dealing with a nation-state with a real army, this is no different than a gang harassing a police presence. The police dont sit down and sing kumbaya with the gang members . . they use their force to keep the peace. The pirates deserve to be blown out of the water once they start approaching boats. To compare this to dealing with fully -equipped nation states is ridiculous and can fill a thread on its own. The situation that indirectly created some of this widespread famine and chaos in Somalia can be traced back to cold war problems between the US and the USSR and the ongoing use of 3rd world countries for bases. Off the top of my head . . . I believe that USSR supported a dictator in Ethiopia and the US supported a dictator in Somalia . . . . point-counterpoint. It sucks that the USSR isnt around to bear the brunt of the damange caused by some of this cold war gamesmanship fallout. we won thw cold war, and now have to deal with stuff like this for years afterward . . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajncajn Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Son, you have bought a load of crap that someone had to sell. These pirates are looking for one thing; money. Nothing political about it. Yup, they probably couldn't really give 2 poopys about the one's that got sniped, they just want to use it as an excuse to continue what they were already doing & would have continued to do whether we did anything about it or not. I say we put Seahawks on one of the freighters so the next time these nice pirates come to beg for help he can give them all a big ole hug & tell them everything will be ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Aww, crap. Vienna? Now I gotta go look it up because I can't remember... ETA - not even CLOSE! Samsonite! Very disappointing. You get extra homework. Munich if my memory hasn't failed me. Perch however, gets the night off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retrograde assault Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Honestly, what basis do you have for saying something like that? I get the feeling there is something missing in him. I don't get the feeling he is a patriot and I don't feel like America and us Americans our his first priority, we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.