Need advice on how to correct a major screw up

[Grits and Shins]

Everyone else knew, didn't they? I agree that Puddy absolutely should have sent out an email or organized an owners' meeting and/or con call for a major rule change in a 15-year-running league. But if I were playing in a league for that kind of money, I sure as hell would poke in at the website some time before the draft. Dude didn't, dude didn't show for the draft, nuts to him.

 

Peace

policy

 

So I guess you can't read.

 

Vote occured AFTER THE OWNER IN QUESTION MADE THE FIRST PICK IN THE DRAFT.

 

So the owner in question could have poked around the website all he wanted the RULES WERE NOT CHANGED UNTIL AFTER HIS FIRST PICK.

 

You don't think it is reasonable for him to assume the rules in effect when he makes his first pick will be the same rules in effect when he makes his second pick and all subsequent picks? When he made his first pick the rules DID NOT REQUIRE A TE. When he made his second pick the rules had been changed and he had not been told.

[muck]

Sheesh...

 

14 teams with _____ guys / roster...surely the monster truck aficionado can pull off a trade with some other owner, can't he?

[SteelBunz]

Honestly....there should have been NO VOTE or rule change after a draft pick had already been made. I'm not saying the rule change would have altered the guy's first pick....but even at that late date in a big money league, draft strategy HAS to change for everyone with a ruling like this. Sure...Witten, Gates and a few others may have been taken eventually as WRs....but certainly not in the 3rd round as beating out someone else for a top tier TE.

 

If the guy was phoning in his picks.....he obviously did NOT have internet access either. Right? Now....how he phoned in his picks without SOMEONE telling him who'd already been taken is beyond me. BUT....the conversation COULD have been more like...."Is Walker (WR) still available? I'll take him." He might not necessarily have heard about all the TEs being taken....unless the person on the phone with him was running down the last round picks since he called last.

 

Honestly...and I know this doesn't help.....lol.....but you're screwed all the way around. You can't go back and decide NO ONE will have TEs and cut the roster by 2 spots. If you cut this one guy's roster by a spot then give him a TE pts match each week, you'd be penalizing everyone else that burned a spot or two for a TE. And really....the same goes for giving him the average TE pts each week as well. I WAS tempted to say that all his matches should be played one player short (his opponent's TE and one of his WRs)...but that doesn't even things out either.

 

Since the first game is tonight.....I'm going to say give him matching points THIS week....and let him see if he can make a trade to fill out his TE slot by next week. If not.....he'll have to WW it...maybe give him first choice in the WW the next two weeks, provided he makes a TE choice.

 

Listen...life happens. He wasn't AWOL....he was available by phone for the draft. We don't know his story....maybe he had to work. But you can't penalize 13 other guys because of a bad ruling due to poor timing and an oversight in letting the guy know about it. But you also can't penalize the individual owner TOO much....he paid....and he WAS drafting.

[policyvote]

Vote occured AFTER THE OWNER IN QUESTION MADE THE FIRST PICK IN THE DRAFT.

 

No, the vote occurred after dude drew the first pick and went "Whenever we start drafting, somebody gimme Tomlinson. Now excuse me while I go do something else." Then all the other owners that bothered to pay attention to the live draft they'd all gathered for addressed the ONLY ORDER OF PRE-DRAFT BUSINESS, which was to vote on the TE thing. If the owner had bothered to check the league website at any point in the weeks leading up to the draft, or had bothered to hang on the line for a few minutes, he would have found out. While I think everyone agrees that the commish should have done a better job of communicating, if this owner had done anything other than the absolute barest minimum amount of preparation or participation, he would have found out about it. I say nuts to him.

 

Peace

policy

[policyvote]

Honestly....there should have been NO VOTE or rule change after a draft pick had already been made.

 

Again, no pick had been made! He just told the co-Commish that when the draft starts to take LT2 for him. The draft hadn't started yet, and he then intentionally skipped out on the only order of pre-draft business. Sorry, if you're so busy you can't be bothered to even have the phone on speaker, muted, while you do whatever else, you get no special favors.

 

Peace

policy

[Jrick35]

Perhaps I lack sympathy when it comes to FF, but I expect the guys in our league to vote on issues and show up for the draft in its entirety or send a friend.

 

Ignorance of the law is never an excuse. When the 10th TE was drafted did it not tip him off?

 

As a long time commisioner of my local money league I completely agree with this post.

 

The biggest problem with your situation is that the rule change was not finalized prior to draft day but that being said, the owner in question was aware of the rule proposal and as stated, the probably higher than normal number of TE's being taken should have been a red flag for him, tipping him off that the rule passed.

 

I say there is no need for anyone to do anything other than the owner in question and all he needs to do is pick up a Free Agent TE.

Edited September 4, 2008 by Jrick35

[Thews40]

Let him pick up a TE off the wire and explain that shat happens. Maybe he'll be cool and this won't be a big deal. If it's been 15 years, you guys know each other pretty well.

[Eagle2003]

League average for the TE spot is the only way to go here. It is very fair to everyone.

 

I like this idea, especially since he probably got a better player in another position when everyone else started selecting their TEs in the 3/4th round or so. I also like the idea of giving him someone elses backup and make him return a player that was selected in a similar round. Olsen and Daniels are decent options to start.

Edited September 4, 2008 by Eagle2003

[Blabidibla]

Why not see if he can resolve his TE issue via trade first. He received players of value while others were selecting back up TEs so should have something to offer.

 

If no one is willing to offer a fair trade, then give him top WW access so he can fill the need, and reduce his fees.

 

And league avg for a TE is not fair. Especially given 2-3 TEs will pump that avg up. It means he's outpointing over half the league every week at that position. I would never draft a TE if I could assure myself those pts.

Edited September 4, 2008 by Blabidibla

[i_am_the_swammi]

How in God's name did one of the other 13 owners not think to tell the guy of the rule change when he called in his 2nd pick? It didn't dawn on anyone to say to the only person not present "Hey dude, TE's are now mandatory".

 

It also didn't dawn on the guys that, come rounds 12+, the absent owner hadn't taken a TE?

 

When we hold our drafts, multiple coaches fill out rosters during the draft to see who was taken, how many positions other coaches have filled, etc. I can't believe no one noticed the only owner not present was the only owner not to select a TE. I would think it would stick out like a sore thumb. I have a feeling someone, anyone, probably saw this error, but didn't speak up, so to screw the guy royally.

 

Honestly, not sure how you fix it, other than to endure some bogus rule (i.e give him the average TE total) for this season, or to convince him it was his fault for not asking "So, how'd that hughly important vote turn out?".

 

The fact this dramatic change in rules wasn't determined weeks before the draft even started is equally as puzzling, so I see a variety of faults here.

 

My gut feel: the absent owner is gonna have to suck it up this year, and hope he can trade the extra value he garnered by NOT picking a TE for a decent TE from someone else. Here's hoping he drafted a sleeper that works out with that mid-round pick he didn't use on a TE.

[muck]

Sheesh...

 

14 teams with _____ guys / roster...surely the monster truck aficionado can pull off a trade with some other owner, can't he?

 

+1

 

That Muck is a smart guy.

[Puddy]

Well the guy works with the other commish. He decided to drop his last pick and pick up a TE. The other commish offered him a very fair trade but he turned it down (Shockey for Berrian, both drafted the same round).

 

I didn't tell all the details in the first post to save on time. That led to some good arguments in this thread depending on the circumstances. I'm cooking dinner now so I'll address them later.

[Chief]

No, the vote occurred after dude drew the first pick and went "Whenever we start drafting, somebody gimme Tomlinson. Now excuse me while I go do something else." Then all the other owners that bothered to pay attention to the live draft they'd all gathered for addressed the ONLY ORDER OF PRE-DRAFT BUSINESS, which was to vote on the TE thing. If the owner had bothered to check the league website at any point in the weeks leading up to the draft, or had bothered to hang on the line for a few minutes, he would have found out. While I think everyone agrees that the commish should have done a better job of communicating, if this owner had done anything other than the absolute barest minimum amount of preparation or participation, he would have found out about it. I say nuts to him.

 

Peace

policy

 

Exactly the way I feel.

[drbob]

I have an idea. All owners drop their TEs. Each gets the draft pick back for the posiition the TE was taken.

 

Missing owner chooses a round after which all his picks are dropped.

 

Then draft in the original order of the draft.

 

For example if a guy drafted Witten in the 5th and someone else in the 14th, he would now have the equivelent of 5th and 14 round picks.

Another team took TE in 10 and 14th, he would have 10th and 14th round pick. The guy that spent his first pick on TE should be getting the higher ranked TE and the picks in the 14th would be per original draft order.

 

The owner without a tight end could very well say I will give up all the way back to the 4th and ensure hiself of the best tight end but would be risking losing quality player at other positions as teams that had originally drafted 2 tight ends could now take another position with one of their TE draft positions.

 

If it sounds too crazy, I would go for the average TE score. There is no way to go with opponents score as some early draft picks wee spent on elite TE and these teams would be punished.

Edited September 5, 2008 by drbob

[eags]

here's my opinion. it's fine to do the draft order the night of the draft, but to change rules on draft night is not good! here's what i think you should do. since most of the league drafted 1-2 tight ends, just for this year, instead of starting 2 wide receivers and 1 tight end, turn the tight end position into the 3rd wide receiver position. it will even itself out for the year and get you (and for whatever reason your co-commissioner) off the hook.

[Turf Smurf]

As a long time commisioner of my local money league I completely agree with this post.

 

The biggest problem with your situation is that the rule change was not finalized prior to draft day but that being said, the owner in question was aware of the rule proposal and as stated, the probably higher than normal number of TE's being taken should have been a red flag for him, tipping him off that the rule passed.

 

I say there is no need for anyone to do anything other than the owner in question and all he needs to do is pick up a Free Agent TE.

 

I agree with the point in bold to a point. He's a dumbass for not fully participating (although I don't know if it was a personal emergency etc) and being fully available at the time of the draft. So, I have very limited sympathy for him.

 

However, to me, the larger infraction is on the commish and co-commish for allowing the vote just prior to the draft, then passing it, and ultimately not communicating the decision to all concerned in the first place. Seems to me, in this situation, the larger owness falls on you. First, you never change the rules in mid-season, and even worse two minutes before the draft and then fail to communicate it to everybody.

 

So, I was just thinking, and haven't seen this mentioned, that he drop anybody of his choosing allowing him to pick up a TE from the waiver pool, and then you cut him a break on the entry fee, by say half or at least a third, which would then be picked up by you and the co-commish.

 

At that point he can trade up or not, at his own choosing.

 

Just a thought. Honestly, in my home league, if this happened (which it never would) I would be of the opinion (and I only have 1 vote) that he’s screwed for the year due to lack of participation. However, as the commish, the way it would work is that I would collect solutions and allow the entire league to vote.

 

Good luck!

[vonromig]

I have been co-commish of my long standing local for about 15 years. We tried to vote in a mandatory tight end using the league site over the last few weeks. The vote ended up 5-5 with 4 teams not voting (not sure if they weren't on the site or whatnot). Tonight we had our draft. 9 teams made the draft in person while 5 drafted along online and via conference call. One of the remote guys drew the first pick and told the other commish to take LT when we started drafting and to call him when it was close to his turn again.

 

Well, the only order of business prior to drafting was to take a vote on the TE position. We got a majority vote without the first team participating. The problem is by the time he got back on the line we forgot to tell him that the vote passed. On my way home, I'm perusing the rosters and realized he didn't draft a TE. Only then do I realize that we didn't tell him about the vote. This is a 14 team league and many of us drafted 2. How in the world do we handle this situation?

 

 

This is the fault of Commissioners...

 

1. You scheduled a strategy changing vote just prior to the draft... giving little to no time for the owners to plan. This being a long standing local league it could not be hard to contact the owners during the first voting period via another form of communication (phone, in person), instead of waiting until it was draft day.

 

2. You prevented all the owners from casting a vote. Regardless of the foregone majority, they did not have a chance to voice their choice. In doing so the owners would have been involved in the process and would thus take it upon themselves to learn it's outcome.

 

3. You obviously did not take your responcibilities of fairness and clarity to heart and ensure that all the owners knew of any rule changes. One reason a habit of many leagues is to have a period of time where the commissioner goes over the rules, as well as the draft order, roster limitations and needs, and drink orders before the draft starts. Mostly this is done to refresh everyone memory about the particularities of the league, after the long summer football drought.

 

Therefore, I believe that in all fairness the owner who missed out should be able to grab a TE from one of the Commissioner's roster... for which the Commissioner than replaces the lost player (TE) from the waiver wire. (Considering that there are two Commissioners and neither of them caught this blunder... perhaps the owner gets a TE from each of them. It would make sure something like this doesn't happen again)

 

Just my two cent as a commish...

 

Von

[Cunning Runt]

Again, no pick had been made! He just told the co-Commish that when the draft starts to take LT2 for him. The draft hadn't started yet, and he then intentionally skipped out on the only order of pre-draft business. Sorry, if you're so busy you can't be bothered to even have the phone on speaker, muted, while you do whatever else, you get no special favors.

 

Peace

policy

 

Dude,

 

That's just way too hard core. It really is. It'd be one thing if they'd told the guy in advance that he had to be present, but sounds like everyone knew the guy was not going to be able to there and the other league mates decided to proceed anyway. The people present took a vote and forgot to tell the guy the outcome. Shi-t happens. It was an honest mistake. You absolutely have to do something to make it right by this guy.

[Chief Dick]

This is the fault of Commissioners...

 

 

 

Therefore, I believe that in all fairness the owner who missed out should be able to grab a TE from one of the Commissioner's roster... for which the Commissioner than replaces the lost player (TE) from the waiver wire. (Considering that there are two Commissioners and neither of them caught this blunder... perhaps the owner gets a TE from each of them. It would make sure something like this doesn't happen again)

 

This is your answer right here.

[bigbadwolf]

Just read the first post so unsure if there is a resolution yet but yikes, that is a mess you have there. Obviously you can't redraft the rosters so you'll need to figure out how to make it right, best as it can be.

 

Unfortunately for you, that would be where the commish and co-commish need to potentially fall on their swords. In my main league that I run, for the betterment of the league, if there is a mixup...accident aside, that was partly or completely because of my oversight as commish I'll sacrifice from my team in whatever way is needed to best fix the problem.

 

So what I would propose is to let the owner in questions "draft" either of the TEs on the two teams that the commish and co run and give up a player to that team within a round or two of where the TE was picked. Not perfect, but about as good as you'll find.

 

The other option would be to take the names of the 4 TEs the two teams own, pick the next two best FA TE left... put each name on a peice of paper, and randomly pick two players for each team. Again, if the team in question gets a TE from either team, he'd need to trade a player from that round or near that round to the team that is losing the player... but at least that way it is random and about as fair as it would get.

 

Hope you all resolve it.

[bigbadwolf]

It is a 14 team league. TEs are going to be drafted as WRs in leagues that don't require TEs. You can't penalize him because NOT A SINGLE OWNER thought to tell him about a new rule that passed in his absence. There is no way a rule like this should have been passed at the draft anyway as it is the type of rule change that impacts drafting strategy.

 

The only recourse is to give him an average TE score each week. I would require him to maintain an open roster spot though. If roster size is 16 then his roster size would be 15. He shouldn't be allowed to maintain a full roster AND get an average TE score each week. As it is he doesn't have to worry about covering a bye week as he would be getting an average score each week.

 

Reading more of the post, I think Grits nailed it. This would be the best solution.

[MTSuper7]

To remedy this, the owner currently sans TE should be able to look at the two commissioners' rosters, select which TE he wants from those rosters, and in return that commish gets whichever player that owner drafted in the same round as the TE he just lost. For instance, if one of the commissioners drafted Tony Scheffler in the 11th round and the owner with no TE drafted Issac Bruce in the 11th round, those two players would be traded (in essence) if that was the TE he wanted.

[Puddy]

So what I would propose is to let the owner in questions "draft" either of the TEs on the two teams that the commish and co run and give up a player to that team within a round or two of where the TE was picked. Not perfect, but about as good as you'll find.

 

 

To remedy this, the owner currently sans TE should be able to look at the two commissioners' rosters, select which TE he wants from those rosters, and in return that commish gets whichever player that owner drafted in the same round as the TE he just lost. For instance, if one of the commissioners drafted Tony Scheffler in the 11th round and the owner with no TE drafted Issac Bruce in the 11th round, those two players would be traded (in essence) if that was the TE he wanted.

 

This is what was essentially offered and he declined.

[Puddy]

Puddy, you guys are collectively a bunch of dumbasses

 

 

Puddy, you're a putz.

 

+1

[Puddy]

He STARTED the draft by selecting LT on the phone.

He hung up the phone.

The league held a vote and decided to require a TE.

He called in to make his next selection and was not told about the vote.

 

Did he know they were going to have a vote before he hung up? If he was told before he hung up that they would be voting on the TE requirement rule then he shares responsibility for not asking. If he was not told I believe it is reasonable for him to assume the RULES HAVE NOT CHANGED since he made his first pick.

 

Well, it wasn't quite that cut and dry. He was on his way home to join via online method (and conference call to a common number that was being used) and found out he won the 1st selection. He said, when the draft starts I'll take LT.

 

We didn't start the draft and then decide to vote

 

WIth the other guys on the line (4 other teams) we voted and got a quick majority. We were also having a helluva time getting CBS online draft to work properly (go figure). Amidst the issues we simply forgot when his turn came back up. Stupid human error is all.