AFC North

[godtomsatan]

Might be the toughest division to call this year. Arguments can be made for everyone but the Browns (shudder...the Browns...shudder).

 

Today, I'm thinking Ravens, Bengals, Steelers, Browns (shudder).

[westvirginia]

Wow, I thought I'd be called off my rocker for picking the bungles, but I'm in the majority! I see a sophmore slump for Roethlisburger and if the Ward deal doesn't get done quick I can really see them losing every game they play without him (come on, Cedrick Wilson and Randle-el as your starting wideouts?). I think Palmer and company have proven they can score on the Ravens, who I still don't know can score (between Lewis' ankle/not being in camp and Boller) The Browns (shudder), are, well, the Browns (shudder).

 

I will say this though: I don't think the mistake-by-the-lakers are as bad as they looked last year. If their o-line can show some semblance of improvement this year then they might actually be competitive a-la last-year's iteration of the Cards. They have talent at RB and WR, and enough QB to not lose it for them. If the o-line can be average and the D can just get to top-20 status (which wouldn't surprise with their coach), they'll be in almost every game.

[Goopster24]

I think the Ravens got this division. Pittsburgh will still be good but the Ravens have all the pieces in place. Boller will only be better, that defense is just amazing, and Billick always has something up his sleeve. They are gonna prove a lot of people that they are possibly the best team in the AFC. I can't think of one major weakness on that team. Maybe the passing game but I think it'll come through.

[Menudo]

The Steelers might be the first team in history to go 15-1, well, they are the first team in the history of the AFC to do so, in a season and still get no respect in people's predictions for the future season.

[spain]

Tough to call but I like the Ravens to edge out the Steelers. The Ravens have the best defense in football. They improved it considerably with the addition of Samari Rolle. They will not be giving up alot of points and that will keep them in most games. The offense still has Jamal Lewis to pound away at teams. But they added Derrick Mason and this years Offensive ROY, Mark Clayton. Obviously, Kyle Boller needs to show significant improvement in his accuracy and decision making. But if he cuts down on the mistakes and just doesnt lose games, this team has a good shot to go to the Superbowl.

 

Steelers had a great season last year but Rothlisturdburgler was exposed during the playoffs. The loss of Burress, the holdout of Ward, and the fact that this team didnt make many major upgrades during the off season tells me they will slide a bit. I dont think they are as good as last seasons record indicated. The Bungoles will again be improved and will contend, but they are still a year or 2 away. The Browns, shudder, suck ass and will not be good again, at least in our lifetimes...

 

Ravens 11-5

Steelers 10-6

Bungholes 9-7

Browns 3-13

[loaf]

Pittsburgh

Baltimore

Cinci

Cleveland

[Menudo]

Tough to call but I like the Ravens to edge out the Steelers.  The Ravens have the best defense in football.  They improved it considerably with the addition of Samari Rolle.  They will not be giving up alot of points and that will keep them in most games.  The offense still has Jamal Lewis to pound away at teams.  But they added Derrick Mason and this years Offensive ROY, Mark Clayton.  Obviously, Kyle Boller needs to show significant improvement in his accuracy and decision making.  But if he cuts down on the mistakes and just doesnt lose games, this team has a good shot to go to the Superbowl.

 

Steelers had a great season last year but Rothlisturdburgler was exposed during the playoffs.  The loss of Burress, the holdout of Ward, and the fact that this team didnt make many major upgrades during the off season tells me they will slide a bit.  I dont think they are as good as last seasons record indicated.  The Bungoles will again be improved and will contend, but they are still a year or 2 away.  The Browns, shudder, suck ass and will not be good again, at least in our lifetimes...

 

Ravens   11-5

Steelers  10-6

Bungholes 9-7

Browns  3-13

 

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I'm not trying to argue people giveing their opinions, but I am just amazed how many people are falling for the Raven's hype. Their defense is still good, but is very much on the downslide. In the 2nd Steelers-Ravens game at the end of last year, in a game that the Ravens needed to stay in playoff contention, the Steelers flat out ran them over. I remember thinking to myself, that it was the first time that I had ever seen the Steelers just run straight over a Raven defense. There was one drive that they ran 15 times in a row for a score. Samari Rolle is a very good Corner, but lets not go putting him in Deion Sanders category. As for Roethlisberger being exposed in the playoffs, he did play poorly in his two playoff games, but no one exposed anything. He is going to be a phenomenal QB and will not have a Sophomore slump. They may not win 15 games, but Ben will improve this year on what was a phenomenal rookie season last year. Here is a link to the Steelers - Ravens game I mentioned. Take a look at the rushing stats:

 

Steelers-Ravens

Edited August 5, 2005 by Menudo

[Goopster24]

I'm not trying to argue people giveing their opinions, but I am just amazed how many people are falling for the Raven's hype.  Their defense is still good, but is very much on the downslide.  In the 2nd Steelers-Ravens game at the end of last year, in a game that the Ravens needed to stay in playoff contention, the Steelers flat out ran them over.  I remember thinking to myself, that it was the first time that I had ever seen the Steelers just run straight over a Raven defense.  There was one drive that they ran 15 times in a row for a score.  Samari Rolle is a very good Corner, but lets not go putting him in Deion Sanders category.  As for Roethlisberger being exposed in the playoffs, he did play poorly in his two playoff games, but no one exposed anything.  He is going to be a phenomenal QB and will not have a Sophomore slump.  They may not win 15 games, but Ben will improve this year on what was a phenomenal rookie season last year.  Here is a link to the Steelers - Ravens game I mentioned.  Take a look at the rushing stats:

 

Steelers-Ravens

 

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I had forgotten about that game and that was a shocking game. That said, I still like the Ravens a lot this year. Their defense is going to get better with Suggs improving and Ed Reed is still quite young. Add in the fact that they are playing a new defense this year, I believe it is the 46, correct me if I am wrong. This is going to free up Ray Lewis just like during their Super Bowl drive year when they had Sam Adams and The Goose.

 

The Steelers, you're right they are a great team. I too don't really agree with that fact that Roethlisberger was exposed during the playoffs. Roethlisberger is only going to get better; he knows how to win games and rely on the people around him. He will seldom lose a game by himself. I just can't see the Steelers being as good as last year. Even if they were, Cowhler isn't the best "big game" coach out there. I think Billick as a coach is very underrated. The Ravens offense is only going to improve also and if Boller gets any chemistry going with their receivers, it'll be a great offense.

 

The Steelers and Ravens IMO will battle it out the whole season but the Ravens will get the edge by the end of the season. I think in a big way.

[spain]

Dont get your panties all bunched up Steeler fans. I didnt say Roethlisburger was a bust or wasnt going to be a good player in the league. He had a phenomenal rookie year for a qb. But he was a rookie and that was exposed during the playoffs. He is still a very young qb with alot to learn. Will he be a good qb? I think so. Can his youth and inexperience be exploited? The playoffs answered the question for us last year...

[WaterMan]

I don't think this is a tough division to call. The Steelers will win it unless the Ravens pull something out of their asses.

[justin]

The Steelers might be the first team in history to go 15-1, well, they are the first team in the history of the AFC to do so, in a season and still get no respect in people's predictions for the future season.

 

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I don't think anyone is "disrespectin'" the Steelers. Picking them as the second place team in the AFC North is still a great slot (plus many people are selecting them to win the division). I still think they make the playoffs and anything can happen in the playoffs.

 

Menudo - why do you refer to the second game between the two teams last year and not the first? Is it because Jamal and Chester Taylor ran all over the Steelers D in the first game?

[Menudo]

I don't think anyone is "disrespectin'" the Steelers.  Picking them as the second place team in the AFC North is still a great slot (plus many people are selecting them to win the division).  I still think they make the playoffs and anything can happen in the playoffs.

 

Menudo - why do you refer to the second game between the two teams last year and not the first?  Is it because Jamal and Chester Taylor ran all over the Steelers D in the first game?

 

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The reason I refer to the 2nd game rather than the first should be obvious, it was most recent. I think anyone speaking honestly would say that the Steelers had become a much different team by week 15 than they were in Week 2. They will win the division again, and the battle for 2nd place and the wildcard will be between the Bengals and the Ravens.

Edited August 5, 2005 by Menudo

[fitzkek]

Alls I know is that if the Eagles were in the AFC North, they'd win that division too.

[The Misfit]

This division, even before realignment, has been dominated by Pittsburgh and Baltimore for so long, it's hard to make a case for any other team. And while Spain's football acumen (unlike his political acumen) is as good as anyone here, methinks he dismisses the Bengals' chances too easily by saying they're still a year or two away.

 

Granted, even if the offense is in gear from the start, the defense could be their downfall. And while the holdout of David Pollock isn't helping matters, Marvin is clearly pulling some tricks out of his bag, such as getting his ex-Steeler bud Kevin Greene to come to camp to give a little personal attention to the linebackers. I think it's also clear Marvin thinks that while the D needs to improve vastly if they ever hope to get to the Super Bowl, it may well be good enough to win a division where all teams (besides the Bengals) sport rather conservative and weak offensive schemes.

 

And I'll admit I'm not buying either the Ravens hype nor the Jamal hype on the huddle boards this year. I blame Club for all that stuff. If I'm wrong about the Bengals, the Steelers take this division. And we may know in Week 1 by how the Ravens' D contains the Colts whether Menudo is right about how far the D has fallen, if at all.

 

Should be a fun and competitive division this year though, no doubt about it.

[loaf]

It might not be that Cinci doesn't have the talent, they obviously do, the problem is that they're peaking at the wrong time. Pittsburgh is just too darn good right now for Cinci to matter.

 

I liken it to the mid 80s era Cavs, we had the best talent we'd ever had and was playing the best Basketball ever played in this city. Unfortunately, there was a little team called the Bulls who had a player named Jordan...

[Menudo]

It might not be that Cinci doesn't have the talent, they obviously do, the problem is that they're peaking at the wrong time. Pittsburgh is just too darn good right now for Cinci to matter.

 

I liken it to the mid 80s era Cavs, we had the best talent we'd ever had and was playing the best Basketball ever played in this city. Unfortunately, there was a little team called the Bulls who had a player named Jordan...

 

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This Loaf guy is making more and more sense to me.....

[Bill Swerski]

The Steelers might be the first team in history to go 15-1, well, they are the first team in the history of the AFC to do so, in a season and still get no respect in people's predictions for the future season.

 

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Will the obnoxious homerism ever stop?

 

Yeah, the Steelers are good. But so are the Ravens. Must you vehemently argue with everyone who predicts that the Steelers may come in second place? Are they hurting your feelings or something?

 

BTW, the Steelers may have been the first AFC team to go 15-1, but the Bears also did it back in '85.

[jjpro11]

i think way too many people are buying into the ravens hype. way too many.. their defense is not the defense of their super bowl run. not close, records will not be broken. heres the quote from offseason moves by the ravens from fantasyindex:

 

Key gains: WR Derrick Mason (Ten), CB Samari Rolle (Ten), G Keydrick Vincent (Pitt), LB Tommy Polley (STL), WR Mark Clayton (1st)

Key losses: CB Gary Baxter (Clev), LB Ed Hartwell (Atl), C Casey Rabach (Wash), DE Marques Douglas (S.F.), LB Peter Boulware (cut), G Bennie Anderson (Buff)

 

Grade: B-

The ravens are better at both wide receiver sports, where Mason and Clayton replace Kevin Johnson and Travis Taylor. Other than a miniscule upgrade at guard, however, the team regressed in all of its other offseason shuffling. Rolle isnt quite as good as Baxter, Polley isnt anywhere near as good as Hartwell, and there are no replacements at all for Douglas and Rabacn. Losing Rabach softens the interior of the team's offensive line. ... Boulware didnt play last year because of knee injury, but he could re-surface as a productive pass rusher for another team.

 

end quote

 

Now the Steelers -

Key gains: TE Heath Miller (1st), WR Cedric Wilson (S.F.)

key losses: OT Oliver Ross (Ariz), WR Plaxico Burress (NYG), LB Kendrell Bell (K.C.), G Keydrick Vincent (Balt), CB Chad Scott (cut)

 

Grade: D-

Losing Ross could be a problem. He played well last year. The Steelers hope that Max Starks, their second-round pick last year, can handle the right-tackle job; if not, they're in trouble. ... Vincent wont be missed; Kendall Simmons, who missed last year with a knee injury, is healthy agains and is a better player. ... Giving a $2 million signing bonus to Wilson is a head-scratcher. Were any other teams interested in him? Antwaan Randle El probably will beat him out. ... Larry Foote replaced Bell effectively late last year, so no problem there.

 

end quotes

 

The Bengals got a C, Browns C+

 

you can kinda see why the steelers got such a low grade, althought that was a bit too harsh.. because they didnt do much this offseason and lost a couple guys, thats what the grading scale is soley based on. they feel their base of the team is in place to make a run and they didnt really need much even though they expressed interest in chad brown and fantasized about ty law. Other then that, Ross was the weakest part of our oline last year. if we needed to resign him we would have. Vincent did a nice job last year and i was hoping we could get him for solid depth because the ravens got him at a low price. Max Starks did solid last year when called upon during games. For the record he is a 3rd round pick not 2nd. Plaxico burress will be missed because of his ability to draw double coverage... and thats all. he continuously dropped passes, took plays off, and really wasnt used that much in the passing game. randle el was very productive in the games he filled in for burress. burress has the physical skills to be a great wr, but he doesnt use them and really isnt much of a threat at all. he wouldnt be much of a wr if he was 5 or 6 inches shorter because he lacks the ball skills and breakaway speed.

 

The steelers didnt even use kendrell bell last year, so his loss shouldnt effect the defense in any way. casey hampton is back at DT which is great because of his ability to clog the middle. he will draw two guys every play, something we didnt have last year because of his injury. The secondary is younger and improved. chad scott was also out most of the year and did not play a factor. if anything, you will see an improved defense with hampton back, the progression of polamalu, and 1 year under dick lebeau's defense. i still think they have the best overall defense in the division.

the steelers improved in other ways as well, they have some great young sleepers at RB, WR, and LB with willie parker, zamir cobb, and fred gibson. watch them in preseason and you will see why they will may see some significant time this season.

 

The ravens got a pretty good grade, but i dont think they did enough to shoot them to the super bowl or tops of the division. they are coming off a 9-7 season. You would think they were the ones with the 15-1 season last year by all the media hype. For what it matters, ray lewis isnt the lewis of old. he has regressed and it showed in many games last season. while hes still a very good lb. he doesnt have that ability to continuously get at the qb and blow up plays like he once could. Now their first rounder, Dan Cody, is most likely out for the season. He was brought in to replace Boulware, which makes the Ravens thin and weak at that position. im not going to go into detail about them simply because i am not as familiar with them as the steelers. for the bengals, i see another overhyped team. yes, they are on the rise.. i see them as a kind of the jaguars of last year. a lot of hype in the preseason and great young talent, however come up just short of a playoff birth. maybe in a year or two.

[Big John]

BTW, the Steelers may have been the first AFC team to go 15-1, but the Bears also did it back in '85. 

 

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And the Vikings in 1998.

 

Missed FG in playoffs.

[justin]

This Loaf guy is making more and more sense to me..... 

 

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he's just a kissa.ss

[loaf]

believe me, nothing pains me more than the fact that the Brown's are the cellar dwellars...especially with the obnoxious homers we have from the AFC North on this site...it is what it is

[Menudo]

Will the obnoxious homerism ever stop?  

 

Yeah, the Steelers are good.  But so are the Ravens.  Must you vehemently argue with everyone who predicts that the Steelers may come in second place?  Are they hurting your feelings or something?

 

BTW, the Steelers may have been the first AFC team to go 15-1, but the Bears also did it back in '85.  

 

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At least my obnoxious homerism is directed to my ONE team Swerski. As for me arguing, isn't this a message board aimed at having discussion ? The first thing I wrote is that I wasn't intending to belittle people's predictions. I am simply stating my case. I have no problem with people saying the Steelers are going to finish in 2nd place, they might. This is the NFL and I know how quickly fortunes can change. However, when you are a DIEHARD fan (meaning ONE TEAM, gets all of your attention devoted to them), you do feel the need to defend your ONE AND ONLY team. Also, I rather enjoy my battles with the Ravens fans on this board. Sorry if I'm bothering you.

 

P.S. By the way, I knew about the Bears going 15-1, wich is why I clarified AFC team in my post. By the way, just to clear things up are you a die-hard Bears fan ?

Edited August 5, 2005 by Menudo

[Trots]

Sorry if I'm bothering you. 

 

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Don't worry about it, you bother everyone - including the Steeler fans.

[Menudo]

i think way too many people are buying into the ravens hype.  way too many..  their defense is not the defense of their super bowl run.  not close, records will not be broken.  heres the quote from offseason moves by the ravens from fantasyindex:

 

Key gains: WR Derrick Mason (Ten), CB Samari Rolle (Ten), G Keydrick Vincent (Pitt), LB Tommy Polley (STL), WR Mark Clayton (1st)

Key losses: CB Gary Baxter (Clev), LB Ed Hartwell (Atl), C Casey Rabach (Wash), DE Marques Douglas (S.F.), LB Peter Boulware (cut), G Bennie Anderson (Buff)

 

Grade: B-

The ravens are better at both wide receiver sports, where Mason and Clayton replace Kevin Johnson and Travis Taylor.  Other than a miniscule upgrade at guard, however, the team regressed in all of its other offseason shuffling.  Rolle isnt quite as good as Baxter, Polley isnt anywhere near as good as Hartwell, and there are no replacements at all for Douglas and Rabacn.  Losing Rabach softens the interior of the team's offensive line. ... Boulware didnt play last year because of knee injury, but he could re-surface as a productive pass rusher for another team.

 

end quote

 

Now the Steelers -

Key gains: TE Heath Miller (1st), WR Cedric Wilson (S.F.)

key losses: OT Oliver Ross (Ariz), WR Plaxico Burress (NYG), LB Kendrell Bell (K.C.), G Keydrick Vincent (Balt), CB Chad Scott (cut)

 

Grade: D-

Losing Ross could be a problem.  He played well last year.  The Steelers hope that Max Starks, their second-round pick last year, can handle the right-tackle job; if not, they're in trouble. ... Vincent wont be missed; Kendall Simmons, who missed last year with a knee injury, is healthy agains and is a better player. ... Giving a $2 million signing bonus to Wilson is a head-scratcher.  Were any other teams interested in him?  Antwaan Randle El probably will beat him out. ...  Larry Foote replaced Bell effectively late last year, so no problem there.

 

end quotes

 

The Bengals got a C, Browns C+

 

you can kinda see why the steelers got such a low grade, althought that was a bit too harsh..  because they didnt do much this offseason and lost a couple guys, thats what the grading scale is soley based on.  they feel their base of the team is in place to make a run and they didnt really need much even though they expressed interest in chad brown and fantasized about ty law.  Other then that, Ross was the weakest part of our oline last year.  if we needed to resign him we would have.  Vincent did a nice job last year and i was hoping we could get him for solid depth because the ravens got him at a low price.  Max Starks did solid last year when called upon during games.  For the record he is a 3rd round pick not 2nd.  Plaxico burress will be missed because of his ability to draw double coverage...  and thats all.  he continuously dropped passes, took plays off, and really wasnt used that much in the passing game.  randle el was very productive in the games he filled in for burress.  burress has the physical skills to be a great wr, but he doesnt use them and really isnt much of a threat at all.  he wouldnt be much of a wr if he was 5 or 6 inches shorter because he lacks the ball skills and breakaway speed.

 

The steelers didnt even use kendrell bell last year, so his loss shouldnt effect the defense in any way.  casey hampton is back at DT which is great because of his ability to clog the middle.  he will draw two guys every play, something we didnt have last year because of his injury.  The secondary is younger and improved.  chad scott was also out most of the year and did not play a factor.  if anything, you will see an improved defense with hampton back, the progression of polamalu, and 1 year under dick lebeau's defense.  i still think they have the best overall defense in the division.

the steelers improved in other ways as well, they have some great young sleepers at RB, WR, and LB with willie parker, zamir cobb, and fred gibson.  watch them in preseason and you will see why they will may see some significant time this season.

 

The ravens got a pretty good grade, but i dont think they did enough to shoot them to the super bowl or tops of the division.  they are coming off a 9-7 season.  You would think they were the ones with the 15-1 season last year by all the media hype.  For what it matters, ray lewis isnt the lewis of old.  he has regressed and it showed in many games last season.  while hes still a very good lb.  he doesnt have that ability to continuously get at the qb and blow up plays like he once could.  Now their first rounder, Dan Cody, is most likely out for the season.  He was brought in to replace Boulware, which makes the Ravens thin and weak at that position.  im not going to go into detail about them simply because i am not as familiar with them as the steelers.  for the bengals, i see another overhyped team.  yes, they are on the rise..  i see them as a kind of the jaguars of last year.  a lot of hype in the preseason and great young talent, however come up just short of a playoff birth.  maybe in a year or two.

 

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My vote for newbie of the year

[Menudo]

Don't worry about it, you bother everyone - including the Steeler fans.

 

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You think so. I haven't heard any Steeler fans complain, and I get along quite well with them.

 

P.S. I know you Ravens fans on the board have never been guilty of annoying homerism.

 

P.S.S. How have the Orioles been playing lately ?

Edited August 5, 2005 by Menudo