westvirginia Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Millerx asked what I thought may be next in line, as it regarded government intervention ... I was not asked if I was happy about it. ...other options include: A complete overhaul of all banking, investment management and corporate finance activities under a single regulator with dramatically expanded scope and reach which would involve a (nearly) complete overturning of all current regulation and the launching of new oversight, restriction and penalties. Some of this will be very welcome (essentially the parts that get rid of conflicting overlaps), some will not (particularly the stuff that tells individual citizens what they can and cannot do with their money, primarily as it regards the suitability of certain investments). Naw, muck, that wasn't directed at you. It was a "you" in general. I was just trying to point out what that would mean - but as in-love as people are with their nanny state it probably wouldn't upset anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Cid Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Do you think the people we vote into office would NOT commit the same egregious behavior? The entire system needs to be wiped out and started over from scratch. Unfortunately, that would require a full blown revolution, which I don't think is likely to happen. No, I don't believe that it is to the revolution stage yet. I do believe that there are enough Americans that are pissed off at the way our government is being run. If you end the career of a career politician by voting them out of office, do you think that maybe the person voted in behind them might get the message being sent by the constituency? Especially if career politicians were voted out of office en masse? The problem is that I didn't organize anything for this election. As perceptive as I am, I did not perceive the looming financial crisis and the impact that it could have had on this election. I will not make that same mistake again. As such it will be you, my beloved Huddle brethren that will form the core of my new initiative, "Throw Them Out!" We will organize at a local level for the 2010 local elections, thereby gaining momentum for the 2012 Presidential elections. Ok, the above is partly in jest, but partly not. We all recognize that at some level, things are broken. Politicians are not beholden to their constituents anymore, simply because they can't hear the voice of the people over the $$$ of lobbyists. The only way significant change can possibly be made to the system is to vote people into office that weren't put there by special interest groups. That means an organized effort to support people at the local level first, people that are really there not becauase of political affiliation but because they honestly care about the school district/municipality/state that they are working for. Only then, once an organization of that nature is strong enough, could you possibly generate enough $$$ to compete on a national level. In essence, we need to form a new political party, one that holds core values of fiscal conservancy yet supports individual liberty. One that believes that a strong military is essential to our country's prosperity but one that knows that political discourse and diplomacy are far more effective tools for the advancement of all cultures and countries. One that recognizes the need for taking care of the citizens of this great country but not by destroying the republic and the democratic principals that it's built upon. One that recognizes that it is the voice of the people that hold ultimate responsibility for this country, not the voice of businesses that can and will jump to another country as soon as there is a perceived competetive advantage to do so. This is what the people of America want and deserve. Not some political party that only cares about power, money and all the influence that power and money can buy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Neutron Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 (edited) No, I don't believe that it is to the revolution stage yet. I do believe that there are enough Americans that are pissed off at the way our government is being run. If you end the career of a career politician by voting them out of office, do you think that maybe the person voted in behind them might get the message being sent by the constituency? Especially if career politicians were voted out of office en masse? The problem is that I didn't organize anything for this election. As perceptive as I am, I did not perceive the looming financial crisis and the impact that it could have had on this election. I will not make that same mistake again. As such it will be you, my beloved Huddle brethren that will form the core of my new initiative, "Throw Them Out!" We will organize at a local level for the 2010 local elections, thereby gaining momentum for the 2012 Presidential elections. Ok, the above is partly in jest, but partly not. We all recognize that at some level, things are broken. Politicians are not beholden to their constituents anymore, simply because they can't hear the voice of the people over the $$$ of lobbyists. The only way significant change can possibly be made to the system is to vote people into office that weren't put there by special interest groups. That means an organized effort to support people at the local level first, people that are really there not becauase of political affiliation but because they honestly care about the school district/municipality/state that they are working for. Only then, once an organization of that nature is strong enough, could you possibly generate enough $$$ to compete on a national level. In essence, we need to form a new political party, one that holds core values of fiscal conservancy yet supports individual liberty. One that believes that a strong military is essential to our country's prosperity but one that knows that political discourse and diplomacy are far more effective tools for the advancement of all cultures and countries. One that recognizes the need for taking care of the citizens of this great country but not by destroying the republic and the democratic principals that it's built upon. One that recognizes that it is the voice of the people that hold ultimate responsibility for this country, not the voice of businesses that can and will jump to another country as soon as there is a perceived competetive advantage to do so. This is what the people of America want and deserve. Not some political party that only cares about power, money and all the influence that power and money can buy. I :heart: KC. Edited October 7, 2008 by Jimmy Neutron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I :heart: KC. +100000000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 We could always secede. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaP'N GRuNGe Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 No, I don't believe that it is to the revolution stage yet. I do believe that there are enough Americans that are pissed off at the way our government is being run. If you end the career of a career politician by voting them out of office, do you think that maybe the person voted in behind them might get the message being sent by the constituency? Especially if career politicians were voted out of office en masse? The problem is that I didn't organize anything for this election. As perceptive as I am, I did not perceive the looming financial crisis and the impact that it could have had on this election. I will not make that same mistake again. As such it will be you, my beloved Huddle brethren that will form the core of my new initiative, "Throw Them Out!" We will organize at a local level for the 2010 local elections, thereby gaining momentum for the 2012 Presidential elections. Ok, the above is partly in jest, but partly not. We all recognize that at some level, things are broken. Politicians are not beholden to their constituents anymore, simply because they can't hear the voice of the people over the $$$ of lobbyists. The only way significant change can possibly be made to the system is to vote people into office that weren't put there by special interest groups. That means an organized effort to support people at the local level first, people that are really there not becauase of political affiliation but because they honestly care about the school district/municipality/state that they are working for. Only then, once an organization of that nature is strong enough, could you possibly generate enough $$$ to compete on a national level. In essence, we need to form a new political party, one that holds core values of fiscal conservancy yet supports individual liberty. One that believes that a strong military is essential to our country's prosperity but one that knows that political discourse and diplomacy are far more effective tools for the advancement of all cultures and countries. One that recognizes the need for taking care of the citizens of this great country but not by destroying the republic and the democratic principals that it's built upon. One that recognizes that it is the voice of the people that hold ultimate responsibility for this country, not the voice of businesses that can and will jump to another country as soon as there is a perceived competetive advantage to do so. This is what the people of America want and deserve. Not some political party that only cares about power, money and all the influence that power and money can buy. You got my vote. You did forget to mention Joe Six Pack and Hockey Mom though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiegie Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 We could always secede. f'ing Alaskans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 f'ing Alaskans I can see DC from my house. And it's not being raped and pillaged....yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westvirginia Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I can see DC from my house. And it's not being raped and pillaged....yet. No, that's the place from which the raping and pillaging eminates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
millerx Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 No, I don't believe that it is to the revolution stage yet. I do believe that there are enough Americans that are pissed off at the way our government is being run. If you end the career of a career politician by voting them out of office, do you think that maybe the person voted in behind them might get the message being sent by the constituency? Especially if career politicians were voted out of office en masse? The problem is that I didn't organize anything for this election. As perceptive as I am, I did not perceive the looming financial crisis and the impact that it could have had on this election. I will not make that same mistake again. As such it will be you, my beloved Huddle brethren that will form the core of my new initiative, "Throw Them Out!" We will organize at a local level for the 2010 local elections, thereby gaining momentum for the 2012 Presidential elections. Ok, the above is partly in jest, but partly not. We all recognize that at some level, things are broken. Politicians are not beholden to their constituents anymore, simply because they can't hear the voice of the people over the $$$ of lobbyists. The only way significant change can possibly be made to the system is to vote people into office that weren't put there by special interest groups. That means an organized effort to support people at the local level first, people that are really there not becauase of political affiliation but because they honestly care about the school district/municipality/state that they are working for. Only then, once an organization of that nature is strong enough, could you possibly generate enough $$$ to compete on a national level. In essence, we need to form a new political party, one that holds core values of fiscal conservancy yet supports individual liberty. One that believes that a strong military is essential to our country's prosperity but one that knows that political discourse and diplomacy are far more effective tools for the advancement of all cultures and countries. One that recognizes the need for taking care of the citizens of this great country but not by destroying the republic and the democratic principals that it's built upon. One that recognizes that it is the voice of the people that hold ultimate responsibility for this country, not the voice of businesses that can and will jump to another country as soon as there is a perceived competetive advantage to do so. This is what the people of America want and deserve. Not some political party that only cares about power, money and all the influence that power and money can buy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I'm guessing that sometime in the next month, we'll have a proposal for another bailout bill, with politicians saying that the first one didn't go far enough. Would you support another couple hundred billion dollars to help heal the credit crunch? It didn't matter to the politicians that voted if we supported or didn't support the last bailout theft...so what makes you think they will care the 2nd time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 In essence, we need to form a new political party, one that holds core values of fiscal conservancy yet supports individual liberty. One that believes that a strong military is essential to our country's prosperity but one that knows that political discourse and diplomacy are far more effective tools for the advancement of all cultures and countries. One that recognizes the need for taking care of the citizens of this great country but not by destroying the republic and the democratic principals that it's built upon. One that recognizes that it is the voice of the people that hold ultimate responsibility for this country, not the voice of businesses that can and will jump to another country as soon as there is a perceived competetive advantage to do so. I have been saying similar things a lot lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Beatings Posted October 7, 2008 Author Share Posted October 7, 2008 It didn't matter to the politicians that voted if we supported or didn't support the last bailout theft...so what makes you think they will care the 2nd time? I'm not saying they will care or listen to us... I'm just curious as to how people here would react. I called and wrote my Congressman before this most recent vote. Not sure how many other people did something like that, or would be prompted to if it comes back around again for more. Basically I'm just stirring up trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicCEO Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I have been saying similar things a lot lately. Bloomberg is biding his time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Neutron Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Well, it has been a whole week. How long did you expect a mere $700 billion to last? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLAYER Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Well I for one would like to thank Nancy pelousy, she has run a very efficient house, and things couldn't be better! Yea and I would like to thank Pres Dickhead, he has run a very efficient government and things couldn't be better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billay Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I'm saying that recent legislation focused on (imo) two things ... (i) the ability to buy assets directly from financial insitutions and (ii) the Federal Reserve pay interest to member banks for their deposits made at the Fed. New legislation may be something very different, like: 2a) Establishment of the Bank of Settlements to act as counterparty to all existing credit default swaps written against companies based in the USA, for anyone that will pay a 'fee' to the BoS for acting as the central clearing house. Existing CDS's are allowed to remain in force until they are set to contractually expire. New legislation requires that the CDSs written against a comapny can only be issued by the BoS and are only available for origination up to an amount equal to the total outstanding debt (including accounts payable), so that Company X won't have $100 million of debt, but $500 million of CDSs written against its viability (as is often times the case today as there are no caps on the potential notional value of CDSs written against a single issuer). Muck, can you elaborate on the Credit default Swaps? I was listening to something on the radio about them the other day. It likened many swaps to naked shortselling, iin that peope (companies) were buying them to insure something which they, in fact, did not own. They were being usied more in a fashion of gambling than insurance. The program quoted a statistic that the legit CDS market was something like 10 trillion and the "speculative" CDS market (that didn;t actually own the thing they were insuring) was in the neighborhood of 60 trillion. Apparently it was an inability to pay a CDS that brought down AIG. It seems that, while this market collapse began in real estate values and subprime, CDS are now playting a huge role in the financial stress companies are facing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muck Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Muck, can you elaborate on the Credit default Swaps? I was listening to something on the radio about them the other day. It likened many swaps to naked shortselling, iin that peope (companies) were buying them to insure something which they, in fact, did not own. They were being usied more in a fashion of gambling than insurance. The program quoted a statistic that the legit CDS market was something like 10 trillion and the "speculative" CDS market (that didn;t actually own the thing they were insuring) was in the neighborhood of 60 trillion. Apparently it was an inability to pay a CDS that brought down AIG. It seems that, while this market collapse began in real estate values and subprime, CDS are now playting a huge role in the financial stress companies are facing. While I don't know the exact numbers, I do know that there are gobs more CDSs than there needs to be. And yes, owning a CDS as a hedge on an asset you do own could be considered by some as "naked short selling". I'm invested with a fund manager that has sold a ton of CDSs to others on terms that would look something like this: Maturity of 3/31/09 Effective yield of 16.4% Nearest date of bond maturities of 6/30/2010 Current yield on that bond of 7.4% ...so, instead of buying the bond yielding 7.4% / yr, he sells credit default swaps that mature before the bonds are due (the ones that could go into default) and receives 2x the yield... ...and he's been getting hammered, despite the superior investment thesis... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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