Someone on Jets staff is gonna be in trouble

[Rovers]

Since this is an internal suspension, I think the main issue the FO has about it is the fact that he flat out lied to everyone about telling the others to do it. Dude got thrown under the bus plain & simple. I only wonder if he will end up returning the favor.

 

How do you figure he got thrown under the bus? That phrase to me means that someone who doesn't deserve it is getting blamed to protect others. More assumptions. Again, what is the big deal about standing where they were? Happens at every single NFL game I've ever watched. Now, bracing for a hit, that's over the top. Kneeing someone... I suppose Ryan told him to do that too?

 

This is why people who wanted immediate discipline were wrong. Let the internal investigation process proceed. Alosi lied to protect someone else? How about he lied to protect HIMself? He got backed into a corner he painted himself into when the players were asked about it.

 

I happen to know for a fact that Alosi is well liked by both players and coaches, and one of the best S&S coaches in the biz. Mangini has said nothing but positive things about the guy in his comments since the incident. I don't think Alosi is protecting anyone. I think the Jets just hope that by next year the whole thing blows over and they can retain him. Crazy idea, trying to protect a valued employee as much as possible...after a single but major F up.

 

I think the FO, the owner and the NFL are still not finished with their eventual closure of the entire thing. Lots of accusations and assumptions going on. Now PFT wants to implicate Westoff too. Ryan is suspected, Heck, maybe Woody Johnson gave the order. Alosi stuck a knee out and made contact with a player. He lost his job. What else?

[champ48win]

He manned up to it and took responsibility for his actions. I thought the apology he put out was far better than I've ever heard from an athlete.

 

He manned up and took responsibility.......really?????? thats your best argument. The only reason he apologized is "BECAUSE HE GOT CAUGHT, on national television" end of discussion. Alosi said "my heart fell in my chest"......really???? if you were that upset about the action, why did you do it in the 1st place???? The only reason this "a-hole" is sorry is because he got caught, plain and simple he did it on purpose as well as create the player wall, he knew damn well what he was doing and did it intentionally.......end of discussion. He needs to be finding a "Pink slip" in his Xmas stocking this year. The JETS are cheaters, no other way to spin it.......by the way Jets homers there is absolutely nothing any of you can say to justify this BULLSH*T and you know IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited December 15, 2010 by champ48win

[delusions of grandeur]

And the witch hunt continues. I say so freakin what even if it did come from Ryan. They were off the white apron and within the coaches box. This is some sort of cheating?

 

I know I said I'd stay out of this, but didn't we establish somewhere in this thread they were supposed to be 2 feet back, not right on the white line? I'm no rules expert, so I can't really comment on how wrong it is to have guys lining up to form a barrier, other than coupled with tripping, it certainly doesn't look good.

 

Since this is an internal suspension, I think the main issue the FO has about it is the fact that he flat out lied to everyone about telling the others to do it. Dude got thrown under the bus plain & simple. I only wonder if he will end up returning the favor.

 

It's starting to look alot like Spygate Jr., where we're supposed to believe that a "rogue" employee just went behind his bosses backs, and then would have the audacity to show those misdoings, right in front of their bosses faces.. Just like that case, it's becoming harder to believe that this was going on without the coach knowing what their staff and players are doing.

 

Now of course this isn't enough to indict or accuse Ryan (yet), but you have to assume that was at least aware of folks lining up like that, so it definitely raises questions of whether the tripping was a rogue unplanned act or if it was part of something that was instructed from above (but to be done discretely of course ). We'll see, now that the guy's career is "indefinite".

Edited December 15, 2010 by delusions of granduer

[rajncajn]

How do you figure he got thrown under the bus? That phrase to me means that someone who doesn't deserve it is getting blamed to protect others. More assumptions. Again, what is the big deal about standing where they were? Happens at every single NFL game I've ever watched. Now, bracing for a hit, that's over the top. Kneeing someone... I suppose Ryan told him to do that too?

 

This is why people who wanted immediate discipline were wrong. Let the internal investigation process proceed. Alosi lied to protect someone else? How about he lied to protect HIMself? He got backed into a corner he painted himself into when the players were asked about it.

 

I happen to know for a fact that Alosi is well liked by both players and coaches, and one of the best S&S coaches in the biz. Mangini has said nothing but positive things about the guy in his comments since the incident. I don't think Alosi is protecting anyone. I think the Jets just hope that by next year the whole thing blows over and they can retain him. Crazy idea, trying to protect a valued employee as much as possible...after a single but major F up.

 

I think the FO, the owner and the NFL are still not finished with their eventual closure of the entire thing. Lots of accusations and assumptions going on. Now PFT wants to implicate Westoff too. Ryan is suspected, Heck, maybe Woody Johnson gave the order. Alosi stuck a knee out and made contact with a player. He lost his job. What else?

Defensive much? This is a message board & I am a fan, I reserve the right to make assumptions and post them here for discussion.

 

To me the phrase thrown under the bus means someone else (likely one of the others in the "wall") implicated him in order to protect themselves. I'm not accusing the other coaching staff, I'm only wondering if Ryan or other coaches instructed him to form the line if he will implicate them in turn now that it seems he will lose his job over it. Again assuming here, but the "indefinitely" part probably hinges on his future cooperation and whether he tells the truth of whether he was acting alone or not. if he wants to keep his job he will likely spill the beans and if the FO is not keen on that practice, which is what I assume, some heads are gonna roll.

 

 

ETA: BTW, if Ryan didn't act like such an ass all the time there probably wouldn't be any question whether he was involved or not.

Edited December 15, 2010 by rajncajn

[Rovers]

For more reasonable takes from less biased ex-players, how about Golic's and M Faulk's take on it?

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/news/story?id=5922926

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81ce...le=HP_headlines

 

Regarding the "wall", Faulk says this is what would have been called "gamemanship". Golic thinks this wall idea could have easilly been ordered by Alosi alone.

 

Alosi being a coach was within rules to be where he was, the players were not.

 

Hey, if you are convinced that Ryan was behind it, you have every right to that suspicion as unfounded in available information as it may be. In the absence of any evidence or information, I will not do a PFT imitation attempting to implicate not only Ryan but Westoff as well. Ryan was a yard off the apron, and from where he stood, could not have even seen what Alosi did. The wall of players was in his line of sight. I guess despite what ex-players like Golic think, Ryan will always be guilty until proven innocent. He asked for both the Jets and himself become targets, and he's gotten just that.

[overworkedirish]

Man, you love to pick and choose your quotes, don't you, Rovers?

 

From YOUR LINK:

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81ce...le=HP_headlines

"As we continued our investigation, we discovered some new information," Tannenbaum said in a conference call from the NFL owners meetings in Fort Worth, Texas, "and the players at the Miami game were instructed by Sal to stand where they were to force the gunner in the game to run around them."

 

Doing so, according to NFL executive vice president of football operations Ray Anderson, violated league rules.

 

Anderson told NFL Network insider Jason La Canfora that there are "protocols where players and coaches are supposed to be," and the Jets' alignment was "improper."

[Rovers]

Man, you love to pick and choose your quotes, don't you, Rovers?

 

From YOUR LINK:

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81ce...le=HP_headlines

 

Man, you really have trouble reading. I clearly and unambigiously stated that Alosi was within the rules to be where he was, but the players were not.

 

With both the GM and owner at the NFL owner's meeting this week, the final decision on Alosi will not be made until they return based on what Ryan said today in his press conference. I suggest you watch that presser at the Jets' site, although I doubt you will.

[Rovers]

Some rational persective:

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/New-Yor...finitely-121510

 

The New York Jets on Wednesday announced they were suspending strength and conditioning coach Sal Alosi "indefinitely'' because they learned Alosi had instructed the non-uniformed players to form a human wall on the sideline in the Miami game.

 

After further internal investigation, the Jets said they uncovered new information that Alosi had told the inactive players standing near him to form the wall.

 

 

 

 

''As we continued our investigation, we discovered some new information,'' Jets general manager Mike Tannenbaum said in a conference call from the NFL owners meetings in Dallas, ''and the players at the Miami game were instructed by Sal to stand where they were to force the gunner in the game to run around them.''

 

According to Tannenbaum, that was information Alosi did not initially volunteer Monday, and the Jets alerted the league of this and extended Alosi's suspension indefinitely. Tannenbaum added that the NFL was also looking into the incident.

 

"Over the course of the next couple of days, more information came out that really doesn't sit well with us," Tannenbaum said.

 

Asked if Alosi might be fired, Tannenbaum said, "All options are on the table.''

 

League spokesman Greg Aiello said that ''Ray Anderson and his staff are reviewing and clarifying sideline protocols with the teams at today's league meeting and will follow up with a memo to the clubs this week.''

 

"Once we get all the information, we'll make a final determination," Tannenbaum said. "But, based on this information, Sal's been suspended indefinitely."

 

The Jets on Monday suspended Alosi for the season without pay and fined him an additional $25,000 after he stuck out a knee and tripped Miami's Nolan Carroll, who was covering the punt in the third quarter of the Dolphins' 10-6 win Sunday. Carroll stayed down on the field for several minutes after the play but was not injured.

 

During a news conference Monday, Alosi fought back tears as he called his actions - tripping Carroll - "inexcusable and irresponsible." He also said no one was instructed to stay up on the sideline to prevent Dolphins players from running out of bounds on kicks. Miami's Reshad Jones was penalized for doing that earlier in the game.

 

However, tight end Jeff Cumberland, who was inactive Sunday, said it was nothing new for the players to line up next to each other as they did against the Dolphins.

 

"Since the beginning of the year, we've been instructed to line up behind the (white) line," he said, adding that it was only Alosi who has told them to do so.

 

He added that coach Rex Ryan and special-teams coordinator Mike Westhoff were not involved.

 

"It caught me off guard," Ryan said.

 

Westhoff said he doesn't teach the technique and reviewed every return by the Jets this season with assistant special teams coordinator Ben Kotwica.

 

"For the most part," Westhoff said, "we didn't see it."

 

Westhoff said he didn't believe it when he first heard that players might have been ordered to stand together along the sideline.

 

 

Jets at a glance

Looking for more on the Jets? Get the inside slant, stats, scores, schedules and more scoops right here.

"I was like, 'Please, give me a break. The whole thing is ridiculous,"' Westhoff said. "Then, when I saw it, I was like, 'Whoa.' You didn't have to be Sherlock Holmes to see they were lined up."

 

Westhoff added that other teams may use the wall, and singled out the New England Patriots as one that has.

 

"I'm not accusing the Patriots of doing something wrong," Westhoff said. "Maybe they're doing something smart. Watch the tape, you tell me."

 

Tannenbaum said the team looked at film of the play and ''it looked to me like it was unusual for them to be standing that way.'' The Jets interviewed the players who were standing near Alosi but will not take any action against them.

 

''This is just about Sal,'' Tannenbaum said.

 

A former linebacker at Hofstra, Alosi earned an award for sportsmanship and fair play both on and off the field during his college career.

 

"I'm really disappointed," Tannenbaum said. "Sal's done a lot of good things as the strength and conditioning coach and done a lot of good things for the organization, but, yeah, I'm very disappointed with what's happened."

 

Carroll left the game Sunday with a muscle spasm, but returned in the fourth quarter. Alosi later apologized to him and Dolphins coach Tony Sparano.

 

"I'm glad he called me," Carroll said Wednesday. "He admitted it to me, like a man. He was sorry."

 

 

Edited December 16, 2010 by Rovers

[Czarina]

I think the "Pats did it too" deflection is hysterical and speaks volumes about the Jets

 

FWIW, I don't have a problem with them lining people up to force the player back towards the field -- so long as they don't touch him.

 

And while I don't believe really that Ryan would tell him to do such a thing, I can certainly see him spouting off emotionally a la Hard Knocks and saying something like, "We're not going to let that f'ing gunner run down OUR sidelines again!" And Alosi taking it to the next step...

[rajncajn]

I think the "Pats did it too" deflection is hysterical and speaks volumes about the Jets

 

FWIW, I don't have a problem with them lining people up to force the player back towards the field -- so long as they don't touch him.

 

And while I don't believe really that Ryan would tell him to do such a thing, I can certainly see him spouting off emotionally a la Hard Knocks and saying something like, "We're not going to let that f'ing gunner run down OUR sidelines again!" And Alosi taking it to the next step...

Agree with Czarina. Even if Ryan didn't tell him to do it his entire demeanor and coaching methods leave opportunity for that type of behavior.

[Rovers]

I think the "Pats did it too" deflection is hysterical and speaks volumes about the Jets

 

FWIW, I don't have a problem with them lining people up to force the player back towards the field -- so long as they don't touch him.

 

And while I don't believe really that Ryan would tell him to do such a thing, I can certainly see him spouting off emotionally a la Hard Knocks and saying something like, "We're not going to let that f'ing gunner run down OUR sidelines again!" And Alosi taking it to the next step...

 

Don't disagree at all. As for the Pats, Westoff (after the incident) reviewed films of every punt retrun by the Jets and against the Jets, and THAT was when he discovered the Pats were doing this as well. I'm not surprised, and I don't blame the Pats for doing it at all. There is a reason Belichick is one of the best coaches in the history of the NFL. He finds EVERY single way that there is to gain any kind of advantage he can get.

 

As stated in the article, in typical NFL knee jerking, they will now finally address this entire thing, from gunners not returning to the field as soon as possible, and where players and coaches stand along the sidelines.

 

Given the fact that a Miami gunner had already been flagged for remaining out of bounds (a VERY rare penalty in the NFL) I don't doubt Ryan was beitchin about it. He reportedly had already complained to the refs about it. Alosi heard it, and went to far? That's my take as well.

 

I have no link to support this as it is heresay, but on a Jets MB someone said Alosi on game days was the "get back" coach. It was his job to make sure players didn't wander onto the field during plays to avoid such penalties. Makes it all the worse for Alosi. He knew what he was doing.

[Rovers]

Agree with Czarina. Even if Ryan didn't tell him to do it his entire demeanor and coaching methods leave opportunity for that type of behavior.

 

Oh, now Ryan's demeanor has to stand trial? Seriously rajn? Since when does verbal arrogance translate to dirty play? What coaching methods? You actually mean to say that Ryan's "come and beat us" coaching style was the root cause here?

 

Did you despise his father too? Since his father put bounties on players, that means Rex is just like him? The son carries the sins of the father?

 

Well, us Jets fans will have to get used to such irrational accusations. I can live with that, as Rex Ryan has won 20 games faster than any coach in the history of the franchise. It was Ryan's fault Braylon Edwards got a DWI too I'm sure. It's that wreckless dirty coaching style of team culture that is to blame. Ryan has done NOTHING to remotely imply he coaches this sort of thing. I'm pretty surprised to see you of all people so biased. I guess Rodney Harrison's head hunting was all because of Belichick too? And Finnegan wanting to be the dirtiest player in the NFL a reflection of Fischer?

[Czarina]

Rovers, rovers, rovers. You must admit that Ryan is a guy who...encourages...gamesmanship. Hard Knocks, anyone? He's a bombastic trash talker who does nothing to discourage it in his players. Is it a leap to say he encourages this type of behavior? Sure. But it ain't a leap over the Grand Canyon. More like a hop over a rain puddle.

[budlitebrad]

Slow news week?

[Rovers]

Rovers, rovers, rovers. You must admit that Ryan is a guy who...encourages...gamesmanship. Hard Knocks, anyone? He's a bombastic trash talker who does nothing to discourage it in his players. Is it a leap to say he encourages this type of behavior? Sure. But it ain't a leap over the Grand Canyon. More like a hop over a rain puddle.

 

 

Sorry, I see this as something that happened because Maimi was pushing the rules themselves, having even got flagged for it already, and one stupid coach doing something stupid. Ryan appropriately complained to the refs. The refs threw a flag. Alosi thought he could get cute. He was after all, reportedly the "get back" coach on game days.

 

But like I said, anything, I mean anything that might happen when it involves the Jets, Ryan will get all the heat, whether he deserves it or not. But he made himself a target, and he certainly is one now. Just follow the rest of the lemmings...

 

At least the football networks remain objective. It's fans on message boards that are getting lost in their hatred of Ryan along with that pillar of publishing, PFT.

[overworkedirish]

Since when does verbal arrogance translate to dirty play?

ALL THE TIME.

 

I think unless there are any further developments, this thread has run its course. We've made clear the things on which we won't agree.

[jetsfan]

I don't know where you work, Rovers, but my experience in the workforce dictates that if you lie to your employer publicly and they subsequently find out, you get fired. No hesitation. That's what makes this "extended suspension" suspicious.

 

That depends on how much money you make for your employer. Back before I worked for Dear Old Dad, the bottom line was all that mattered. Douchebaggery was expected and rewarded, presuming you made the company money.

[rajncajn]

Rovers, rovers, rovers. You must admit that Ryan is a guy who...encourages...gamesmanship. Hard Knocks, anyone? He's a bombastic trash talker who does nothing to discourage it in his players. Is it a leap to say he encourages this type of behavior? Sure. But it ain't a leap over the Grand Canyon. More like a hop over a rain puddle.

Yep, exactly. And it's not such a leap to say he might have been privy to it as well and let it go on. Love the analogy BTW.

 

Rover, never said I didn't like Ryan. The guy's obviously a character and I like that. Not sure how well it translates into coaching, but he's certainly fun to watch.

Edited December 16, 2010 by rajncajn

[Chief Dick]

ALL THE TIME.

 

I think unless there are any further developments, this thread has run its course. We've made clear the things on which we won't agree.

 

Ok. You're new here.

 

There's at least 8 more pages of dead horse to beat before we're all done here.

[Slugs3511]

Do you think Vick would have admitted to Dog fighting had they not had information on his "rings?" NO,

No one really ever admits to things unless they get caught.....and, it wasn't me that said this....

[Rovers]

ALL THE TIME.

 

I think unless there are any further developments, this thread has run its course. We've made clear the things on which we won't agree.

 

So I guess that's why prior to this incident the Jets had incurred two fines from the NFL this year, and one of those was because of an unbuckled chinstrap. That puts them at the bottom of the league in both incidents and amounts. Yep, that 'ol dirty boy Rex Ryan has been up to his tricks again, teaching players to play dirty football.

 

http://www.justfines.com/listFines.php?year=2010

[Phazool]

This is very simple, people.

 

Alosi is stupid for sticking his knee out and tripping the guy.

 

Everything else is irrelevant.

 

If the whole damn team decides to stand on the edge of the OUT OF BOUNDS line, then so be it. They are out of bounds. Don't run out of bounds. What are they supposed to sit in the stands now?

[overworkedirish]

This is very simple, people.

 

Alosi is stupid for sticking his knee out and tripping the guy.

 

Everything else is irrelevant.

 

If the whole damn team decides to stand on the edge of the OUT OF BOUNDS line, then so be it. They are out of bounds. Don't run out of bounds. What are they supposed to sit in the stands now?

I mean, it's clear you haven't read the thread, as this is wrong. They're supposed to be back behind the second white line, a few feet further.

 

As to everything else being irrelevant, I think it's pretty relevant when there's the possibility of a ST coach and HC flat out lying to both the NFL and the media.

[Rovers]

I mean, it's clear you haven't read the thread, as this is wrong. They're supposed to be back behind the second white line, a few feet further.

 

As to everything else being irrelevant, I think it's pretty relevant when there's the possibility of a ST coach and HC flat out lying to both the NFL and the media.

 

And the Maimi gunners aren't supposed to run 6 yards out of bounds either. Remember, they had already gotten a rare flag for this in the game earlier, but continued to do it. So, both teams were pushing rules that are almost never enforced. One could even say it was the gamemanship of Miami that led to the whole incident. Stop sounding like the Phins were simple bystanders and innocent victims. In all of this Sporano has has hidden under his blanket, and it's working for him.

 

This isn't about the Jets, or Ryan, it's not even about where the Miami gunners ran out of bounds or where pesronnell stood. It's about an idiot named Alosi who tried to interfere with an opposing player during a live play.

[Phazool]

I mean, it's clear you haven't read the thread, as this is wrong. They're supposed to be back behind the second white line, a few feet further.

 

As to everything else being irrelevant, I think it's pretty relevant when there's the possibility of a ST coach and HC flat out lying to both the NFL and the media.

 

 

 

I say Who Gives A F***! Really?