Suture Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Just like Snyder and the Redskins, that franchise will not see any success until Matt Millen is gone. Somewhere, Barry Sanders is laughing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muck Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Anyone know how the Lions P/L has looked under Millen? If he's making money for the Fords, it would go a long way to explaining how he gets to stick around... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitem0nkey Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 As a bears fan who shares the division with the lions, you would think I would be happy about the lions decision. But im not. I enjoy watching good football. I want competitive games. Sure I want my bears to win it all. But I want them to earn it. I don’t enjoy hearing "yeah the bears have won 13 games but against weak competition" Close competitive games are more fun than blowouts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CD6405 Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Matt Millen is SO CLOSE to turning this team around! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraftykraft Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 On the plus side Lions fans, by this time next year Nick Saban will have one eye on the door at Alabama, and I don't think he has the Motown part of his ticket punched yet!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 As a bears fan who shares the division with the lions, you would think I would be happy about the lions decision. But im not. I enjoy watching good football. I want competitive games. Sure I want my bears to win it all. But I want them to earn it. I don’t enjoy hearing "yeah the bears have won 13 games but against weak competition" Close competitive games are more fun than blowouts. Well, they did once take us to OT before handing us the ball and taking the wind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraftykraft Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 As a bears fan who shares the division with the lions, you would think I would be happy about the lions decision. But im not. I enjoy watching good football. I want competitive games. Sure I want my bears to win it all. But I want them to earn it. I don’t enjoy hearing "yeah the bears have won 13 games but against weak competition" Close competitive games are more fun than blowouts. The Bears are quite capable of being forced into a competitive game any given Sunday that Rex Grossman is under center... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egret Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Well, they did once take us to OT before handing us the ball and taking the wind. I think that was the first year of the Millen regime. Back when we still used to get together to watch Lions games with friends. Does anybody still do that? We might get together to watch other games, but I haven't got together with a group of friends to watch the Lions for a very long time. I remember looking at eachother trying to make it sound reasonable to take the wind. We couldn't. No matter who the president or gm would've been next year, the Lions will still be bad. At least now we don't need to get our hopes up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitem0nkey Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 The Bears are quite capable of being forced into a competitive game any given Sunday that Rex Grossman is under center... well it depends if rextard or if rex grossman shows up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraftykraft Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 well it depends if rextard or if rex grossman shows up. That is the million-dollar playoff question for the Bears. They are capable of beating anyone if Rex shows up, but they are capable of being whomped by any of the teams in the playoffs if Rextard gets off the short bus... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Beatings Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Matt Millen is to the NFL, as Kevin McHale is to the NBA. Are there any other obvious comparisons in professional sports? William Clay Ford refuses to fire Millen no matter how absolutely horrible the Lions have become under his direction. Just as Glen Taylor absolutely refuses to fire Kevin McHale no matter how clearly he has decimated the Timberwolves. Its really a strange thing to watch. Sports organizations have to be about trying to win, don't they? Without the kind of success that can only be measured in more wins than losses, a sports team is doomed. How can these owners afford to be so blind when it comes to running these businesses? I just don't understand it on any level. I suppose when these teams eventually go bankrupt, they'll be able to say that at least they were loyal to the losers that drove them into the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeeR Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 So what? Results are what matter - in football or anywhere elese. If you lost a lot of money in the stock market year after year, would you stick with your broker because, at the time that he offered you the adive, the stock looked good, even to a lot of people? Hell no. CEO's and people of responsibility are replaced everyday because of poor performance. And you can't say that the Lions are any better after 6 years of the Millen era. What well run company would keep around somebody like that for another year? Its preposterous. And drafting is only a part of the equation. What about other personnel moves? What has Millen done in 6 years to make the Lions a better team? Nothing. Again hindsight is 20/20. I didn't hear any (or little) of this when he made his draft moves at the time. He doesn't throw or catch the balls (etc). Plus comparisons to "normal" companies tend to be dicey, if that. Football franchises are unique. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 William Clay Ford refuses to fire Millen no matter how absolutely horrible the Lions have become under his direction. Obviously Millen has some 8x10s from Mr. Ford's side-trips to Thailand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Anyone know how the Lions P/L has looked under Millen? If he's making money for the Fords, it would go a long way to explaining how he gets to stick around... Maybe if they had some MILLEN INTERACTIVE events. Dunking, stone throwing, tar and feathering, etc. Perhaps they need a tax writeoff and need him to fail. Or have a running bet with the Bidwell family? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Again hindsight is 20/20. I didn't hear any (or little) of this when he made his draft moves at the time. He doesn't throw or catch the balls (etc). Plus comparisons to "normal" companies tend to be dicey, if that. Football franchises are unique. Millen is the leader of the organization. It is his job to determine the best draft picks and other personnel moves that will work. Just because Mel Kyper agrees with him doesn't let him off the hook. The moves have mostly backfired and just like any other leader of an organization, the ramifications should affect him. He is in charge of evaluating the talent for the Lions, not ESPN goofballs or journalists or fans. We are allowed to miss on our guesses. We aren't in charge of building the team, he is. If the idea is too just draft the popular pick, why even have a GM. We can just grab the latest ranking and go from that. Actually, that's probably what he does Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cre8tiff Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Millen is the leader of the organization. It is his job to determine the best draft picks and other personnel moves that will work. Just because Mel Kyper agrees with him doesn't let him off the hook. The moves have mostly backfired and just like any other leader of an organization, the ramifications should affect him. He is in charge of evaluating the talent for the Lions, not ESPN goofballs or journalists or fans. We are allowed to miss on our guesses. We aren't in charge of building the team, he is. If the idea is too just draft the popular pick, why even have a GM. We can just grab the latest ranking and go from that. Actually, that's probably what he does Anyone see what fantasycafe.com pre-season rankings were? That seems his speed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chavez Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Millen is the leader of the organization. It is his job to determine the best draft picks and other personnel moves that will work. Just because Mel Kyper agrees with him doesn't let him off the hook. The moves have mostly backfired and just like any other leader of an organization, the ramifications should affect him. Example - Everyone and their mother ranked Brent Fullwood highly in '87, and Tony Mandarich highly in '89. Conventional wisdom was Fullwood was a notch below Bo Jackson talent-wise and a franchise back, and Mandarich was going to make people forget Anthony Munoz. Both were busts; the team continued to suck, and the GM (and coach) paid for it. Millen's teams have been worse, and he's either picking bad players or not hiring the right people to coach them. Either way, the culpability is his. Add in the fact that their 36-44 record in the 6 years PREVIOUS to the Millen regime now is remembered as fondly as the days of Halas, Lombardi, or Grant are recalled in the other division cities and it's pretty clear that Millen, for whatever reason, has been a tremendous failure. If you want to chalk that up to bad luck, fine. But 6 years is more than enough time to turn things around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrunt Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Matt Millen is to the NFL, as Kevin McHale is to the NBA. Are there any other obvious comparisons in professional sports? William Clay Ford refuses to fire Millen no matter how absolutely horrible the Lions have become under his direction. Just as Glen Taylor absolutely refuses to fire Kevin McHale no matter how clearly he has decimated the Timberwolves. Its really a strange thing to watch. Sports organizations have to be about trying to win, don't they? Without the kind of success that can only be measured in more wins than losses, a sports team is doomed. How can these owners afford to be so blind when it comes to running these businesses? I just don't understand it on any level. I suppose when these teams eventually go bankrupt, they'll be able to say that at least they were loyal to the losers that drove them into the ground. The problem is that certain organizations are simply in it for the money. I don't know the numbers, so this is simply a theory, but I will not be surprised if Matt Millen and the Fords are still profiting even with the horrible team they put together year in and year out. It's pretty obvious that if they are making money, that's the only thing they truly care about. Not the wins. So sad... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark5 Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I found it up to 2004 but it seems they should be turning a profit here. I blame the FANS or the guy who manipulates the numbers. I thought for sure he was gone this year. ...................................average attendence Detroit Lions 1993 8 533,969 66,746 Detroit Lions 1994 8 547,977 68,497 Detroit Lions 1995 8 565,233 70,654 Detroit Lions 1996 8 491,948 61,494 Detroit Lions 1997 8 554,898 69,362 Detroit Lions 1998 8 571,416 71,427 Detroit Lions 1999 8 579,673 72,459 Detroit Lions 2000 8 606,716 75,840 Detroit Lions 2001 8 601,821 75,228 Detroit Lions 2002 8 481,082 60,135 Detroit Lions 2003 8 490,442 61,305 Detroit Lions 2004 8 499,162 62,395 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chavez Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 ...................................average attendence Detroit Lions 2001 8 601,821 75,228 Detroit Lions 2002 8 481,082 60,135 The large dropoff from 01 to 02 is due to the Lions moving from the cavernous, Tupperware-looking Silverdome to the smaller Ford Field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 The problem is that certain organizations are simply in it for the money. I don't know the numbers, so this is simply a theory, but I will not be surprised if Matt Millen and the Fords are still profiting even with the horrible team they put together year in and year out. It's pretty obvious that if they are making money, that's the only thing they truly care about. Not the wins. So sad... If I'm not mistaken, they would be profitable if NOBODY showed up to the games due to the television contracts the NFL enjoys. NFL is unique in that way. If Matt Millen is judged by how profitable the Lions are then things are even worse than I imagined (and I imagined they were pretty bad). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrunt Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 If I'm not mistaken, they would be profitable if NOBODY showed up to the games due to the television contracts the NFL enjoys. NFL is unique in that way. If Matt Millen is judged by how profitable the Lions are then things are even worse than I imagined (and I imagined they were pretty bad). From a business stand-point this scenario is not only possible, but likely. I know baseball is a much different sport than football, but the principal foundation between the two seperate businesses shouldn't change too much. No matter what angle you look at a business, such as in sports or all other profit driven organizations, it's all about money. I'm sure several of you can think of many baseball organizations that only care about their profit over how many wins they get, so why wouldn't an NFL based organization, such as the Lions, do the same? At this point, I'm just stumped on how a team with such high-expectations can continue to flop on a yearly basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 The large dropoff from 01 to 02 is due to the Lions moving from the cavernous, Tupperware-looking Silverdome to the smaller but much more expensive seat-wise Ford Field. Amended Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muck Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Amended Econ 101: Each seat is more expensive because there are fewer of them ... supply/demand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Econ 101: Each seat is more expensive because there are fewer of them ... supply/demand. No kidding? My point was that the profit from the Lions has probably gone up, regardless of results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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