driveby Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Today, nearly a fifth of the country's largest 2,000 regional malls are failing, she says, and according to the International Council of Shopping Centers, and a record 150,000 retail outlets, including such mall mainstays as the Gap and Foot Locker, will close this year. Been months since I've been to one. Interesting related site for the oldtimers http://www.deadmalls.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman_Nick Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 In my area retail areas are being developed like crazy. I keep scratching my head at it, because it seems like there is already too much brick and mortar retail. Considering the availability and price of online goods, I can;t see how it will all survive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big John Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 In my area retail areas are being developed like crazy. I keep scratching my head at it, because it seems like there is already too much brick and mortar retail. Considering the availability and price of online goods, I can;t see how it will all survive. Were I live, a bunch of new shopping centers are still being built, then there are empty or mainly vacant commercial buildings nearby those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelBunz Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 (edited) I was at a mall yesterday (something I haven't done for 3 years) and something odd struck me. There were a ton more kiosk sort of counter sales in the main walkways than I ever remember. Only now......the people working them are like carnival barkers. Reaching out to grab your hand to show you some nail buffer or pretending to just be friendly, saying hello.....then going into their pitch about Verizon and getting a new blackberry. Pushy and intrusive.......lol. You can't just leisurely walk the mall anymore.....decide to pop in a store or 2. These people are like vultures. The funniest had to be one woman at a hair accessories counter trying to stop my sister (who works in a salon) and show her a hair straightening iron......LMAO. The saleswoman had corkscrew curls. If straightening is all the rage......what's up with the curls? Edited November 21, 2008 by SteelBunz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicCEO Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I like to describe my suburban neighborhood as being "between the mall... and the other mall." The big new mall is doing pretty good. I was there last weekend. But the small, single-story old mall has 2 of it's 4 end-cap stores vacant, and it's totally ghetto. I went in there recently because it's the closest Radio Shack to my house (and I'm a nerd), and just walking through the mall made me want to run. Every single store in there is selling the same worthless crap. Hats, mobile phones, bling kiosk, slut clothes... hats, mobile phones, bling kiosk, slut clothes.... hats, mobile phones, bling kiosk, slut clothes. That place is going down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonorator Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 in general, we have way too much stuff, and most is overpriced crap. we've seen a couple of those outdoor trendy malls open in town with all the higher priced/higher margin type clothing stores and such. it is basically a ton of overpriced, luxury kind of stuff that people squander their money away on when they believe times are good. i see many of these things going under as people can just no longer afford to go there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmarc117 Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 commercial real estate will be next to crash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_am_the_swammi Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 commercial real estate will be next to crash its already crashing.....we are getting inundated with calls from banks, asking if we are interested in hotels for 50 cents on the dollar. Some great buying opportunities...banks don't want to be landlords or real estate owners. The commerical crash will reek further havoc on the economy, but put some significant dollars into the pockets of those primed to take advantage of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 "Indoor" Malls have been dying for quite some time now....they started giving way to the open air centers...and now "town centers" where they are trying to recreate a "neighborhood" shopping experience...truth be told MANY of the big national retailers opened FAR FAR FAR to many stores....just wait to see what happens to retail on wall street after Xmas....the sad part is that some companies had good vision and concepts but then due to greed and wall street wanting more they start to move away from their original vision and biz plan and then BOOOM...a GREAT example is OLD NAVY...Old Navy was supposed to be GAP at a price and was targeted to go into markets that GAP stores wouldnt/couldnt succeed in..initially, that was the direction that ON took but then as their sales grew they needed to continually exceed their sales volume so expansion was a major focus...but they then started to get away from their initial vision of where ON's should be located and all of a sudden you had GAPs and ON's in the same markets competing for the same $$'s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmarc117 Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 its already crashing.....we are getting inundated with calls from banks, asking if we are interested in hotels for 50 cents on the dollar. Some great buying opportunities...banks don't want to be landlords or real estate owners. The commerical crash will reek further havoc on the economy, but put some significant dollars into the pockets of those primed to take advantage of it. stuff will be cheap everywhere. just be sure you have enough cash to pay the bills for a few years. i dont see the numbers coming back anytime soon. 5ys minimum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonorator Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 one of those chain mails was going around warning people to be careful when buying gift cards this year. many of the stores they come from may no longer be there after christmas ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Irish Doggy Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 in general, we have way too much stuff, and most is overpriced crap. we've seen a couple of those outdoor trendy malls open in town with all the higher priced/higher margin type clothing stores and such. it is basically a ton of overpriced, luxury kind of stuff that people squander their money away on when they believe times are good. i see many of these things going under as people can just no longer afford to go there. The thing that doesn't make sense to me is a place like Kenwood Towne Center, which always seems to have a full parking lot, and yet they announced that the mall owner is in trouble financially. They have to have good foot traffic and most of the store space occupied (at least they did back in August when I was there last)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonorator Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 The thing that doesn't make sense to me is a place like Kenwood Towne Center, which always seems to have a full parking lot, and yet they announced that the mall owner is in trouble financially. They have to have good foot traffic and most of the store space occupied (at least they did back in August when I was there last)... it's definitely full during the weekends and such, but i'm not so sure about during the week. also not sure how many just to there to hang out vs. actually buy stuff. whatever happens, we need to keep the apple store. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeeR Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Most "indoor" malls seem pretty ghetto to me - probably because a lot of the people who just linger or "hang out" there are kids/families from the wal-mart side of the street. Actually a lot of the employees seem pretty ghetto too, w/the tatoos and ratty kool-aid hair etc - blech. I'll never go to another one if I can help it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebellab Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 it's definitely full during the weekends and such, but i'm not so sure about during the week. also not sure how many just to there to hang out vs. actually buy stuff. whatever happens, we need to keep the apple store. How many people are carrying bags? It is amazing how many people just go to the mall and not buy anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 (edited) I do my shopping at the indoor mall down the street from work at lunch. Yep, I'm usually the only person carrying a bag. Probably because I'm the only person that has a job in there besides the mall employees. I hate those outdoor malls...stupidest idea ever. That's all we have now for the msot part around here. If I can, I'll just stop at Tar-jay and avoid them altogether, however. ETA: If one more Chinese chick offers me something from a kiosk that doesn't involve 2 dolla sucky sucky love me long time GI, then I'm gonna go ballistic one time. Edited November 21, 2008 by TimC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riffraff Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 How many people are carrying bags? It is amazing how many people just go to the mall and not buy anything. Does eating at the food court count? That's me at a mall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks21 Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I was at a mall yesterday (something I haven't done for 3 years) and something odd struck me. There were a ton more kiosk sort of counter sales in the main walkways than I ever remember. Only now......the people working them are like carnival barkers. Reaching out to grab your hand to show you some nail buffer or pretending to just be friendly, saying hello.....then going into their pitch about Verizon and getting a new blackberry. Pushy and intrusive.......lol. You can't just leisurely walk the mall anymore.....decide to pop in a store or 2. These people are like vultures. The funniest had to be one woman at a hair accessories counter trying to stop my sister (who works in a salon) and show her a hair straightening iron......LMAO. The saleswoman had corkscrew curls. If straightening is all the rage......what's up with the curls? Exactly!!! Those people (especially the cell phones), are out of control!! Absolutely badgering!! There is a part of my local mall that I won't walk down anymore. I'll take the 3/4 loop the other way back around if there is a store I have to go to. I'm a mall guy. I like the electronics stores, the music stores, and the sporting goods stores (I'm a bit of a shoe collector). I was one of those ghetto kids hanging out at the mall when I was younger. Being in the golf biz, I basically get winters off, and being in Seattle, there isn't a ton to do with our winter weather, so I spend entirely too much time at the mall. Say what you will about the mall, but the mall is still the best place to find hot women. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursa Majoris Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 "Indoor" Malls have been dying for quite some time now....they started giving way to the open air centers...and now "town centers" where they are trying to recreate a "neighborhood" shopping experience...truth be told MANY of the big national retailers opened FAR FAR FAR to many stores....just wait to see what happens to retail on wall street after Xmas....the sad part is that some companies had good vision and concepts but then due to greed and wall street wanting more they start to move away from their original vision and biz plan and then BOOOM...a GREAT example is OLD NAVY...Old Navy was supposed to be GAP at a price and was targeted to go into markets that GAP stores wouldnt/couldnt succeed in..initially, that was the direction that ON took but then as their sales grew they needed to continually exceed their sales volume so expansion was a major focus...but they then started to get away from their initial vision of where ON's should be located and all of a sudden you had GAPs and ON's in the same markets competing for the same $$'s And that right there is a microcosm of the overall problem - Wall Street ALWAYS demands profits that go up and up, never mind whether you have a good profit in the first place. If you fail, they will kill your stock price. This is an unsustainable business model that we are all now paying for. The sooner one in ten Wall Street analysts / brokers is dragged into the street and publicly shot, the better. ETA: If one more Chinese chick offers me something from a kiosk that doesn't involve 2 dolla sucky sucky love me long time GI, then I'm gonna go ballistic one time. Tim nails down my vote for Funniest Huddler this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Irish Doggy Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I hate those outdoor malls...stupidest idea ever. Hey, let make people walk outside during the cold and wet Christmas season. It'll be great! Really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 And that right there is a microcosm of the overall problem - Wall Street ALWAYS demands profits that go up and up, never mind whether you have a good profit in the first place. If you fail, they will kill your stock price. This is an unsustainable business model that we are all now paying for. The sooner one in ten Wall Street analysts / brokers is dragged into the street and publicly shot, the better. Tim nails down my vote for Funniest Huddler this year. Yep, have flat sales increases but continually be profitable and you will be "beaten" by wall street...I am glad someone else finally gets it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
driveby Posted November 21, 2008 Author Share Posted November 21, 2008 Hey, let make people walk outside during the cold and wet Christmas season. It'll be great! Really? Or in Houston in August. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoJoTheWebToedBoy Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I like to describe my suburban neighborhood as being "between the mall... and the other mall." The big new mall is doing pretty good. I was there last weekend. But the small, single-story old mall has 2 of it's 4 end-cap stores vacant, and it's totally ghetto. I went in there recently because it's the closest Radio Shack to my house (and I'm a nerd), and just walking through the mall made me want to run. Every single store in there is selling the same worthless crap. Hats, mobile phones, bling kiosk, slut clothes... hats, mobile phones, bling kiosk, slut clothes.... hats, mobile phones, bling kiosk, slut clothes. That place is going down. I love a mall full of shiny, sparkly, sluts..... I hate those outdoor malls...stupidest idea ever. That's all we have now for the msot part around here. A few years back I was in Palm Springs in Aug. Stopped at an outdoors mall. All I could think was "It's freakin 130 degrees, Khloe, Kim and Kourtney Kardashian" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Runt Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 "Indoor" Malls have been dying for quite some time now....they started giving way to the open air centers...and now "town centers" where they are trying to recreate a "neighborhood" shopping experience...truth be told MANY of the big national retailers opened FAR FAR FAR to many stores....just wait to see what happens to retail on wall street after Xmas....the sad part is that some companies had good vision and concepts but then due to greed and wall street wanting more they start to move away from their original vision and biz plan and then BOOOM...a GREAT example is OLD NAVY...Old Navy was supposed to be GAP at a price and was targeted to go into markets that GAP stores wouldnt/couldnt succeed in..initially, that was the direction that ON took but then as their sales grew they needed to continually exceed their sales volume so expansion was a major focus...but they then started to get away from their initial vision of where ON's should be located and all of a sudden you had GAPs and ON's in the same markets competing for the same $$'s As some of you may know, I'm a senior real estate manager at a national retail chain. You paint a fairly accurate picture of what it's like. We do have to answer to Wall St. big time. On one hand they want new store growth. We opened/relocated 300 + stores this year. But on the other hand, they don't to see that the this kind of growth can cannibalize existing store's sales, which it oftentimes does. It's a tricky one, but I walk that line everyday trying to make the right business decisions. I'll say this though - we are on of the few retail chains still growing aggressively despite having 3500+ stores already and we have investment-grade credit. Translated that means we're in high-demand to backfill some quality real estate or get sweeter than ever deals on new construction. We're looking for a lot of excess space to come onto the market after the holidays. We're already looking at some of the Circuit City and Linens n' Things stuff. I would say we're ideally situated to prosper actually so I'm cautiously optimistic that I don't need to be looking over my shoulder for the axe to fall. It's happened to a sh-tload of people in the industry who worked for other retailers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keggerz Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 (edited) As some of you may know, I'm a senior real estate manager at a national retail chain. You paint a fairly accurate picture of what it's like. We do have to answer to Wall St. big time. On one hand they want new store growth. We opened/relocated 300 + stores this year. But on the other hand, they don't to see that the this kind of growth can cannibalize existing store's sales, which it oftentimes does. It's a tricky one, but I walk that line everyday trying to make the right business decisions. I'll say this though - we are on of the few retail chains still growing aggressively despite having 3500+ stores already and we have investment-grade credit. Translated that means we're in high-demand to backfill some quality real estate or get sweeter than ever deals on new construction. We're looking for a lot of excess space to come onto the market after the holidays. We're already looking at some of the Circuit City and Linens n' Things stuff. I would say we're ideally situated to prosper actually so I'm cautiously optimistic that I don't need to be looking over my shoulder for the axe to fall. It's happened to a sh-tload of people in the industry who worked for other retailers. almost 20 yrs in retail with almost 10 in multi store management...so I know what the end result it out in the field Edited November 21, 2008 by keggerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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