Have watched 3 plays - refs already impacting games

[Grits and Shins]

I think the expectation that these guys are going to be blowing calls has a lot to do with the vitriol. People are even complaining about them missing penalties in the trenches. It's been said that you could call a penalty down there on every play, and we allow the real refs the leeway to just call the really bad ones and let the flow of the game continue. Not these guys, it seems.

 

Because we're going in looking for screw-ups. And if we go in looking for screw-ups, we're certainly going to find them.

 

I obviously didn't catch every game and, unfortunately, got only the last few minutes of the Niner game, which many seem to be complaining about. Of the games I caught, I saw about as many blown calls as I normally do. Perhaps a few more, but not enough to detract from my enjoyment of the product on the field.

 

 

[Caveman_Nick]

 

 

+

[stevegrab]

There were a couple of instances where the refs straight up didn't know the rules. Or at least how to make a ruling. I can live with crappy calls I guess but they at least need to know the rules IMO.

 

 

 

Like taking the 2 minute warning break in action before the attempted 2 point conversion. I forget which game, think it was SF-GB (or PIT-DEN).

 

Like others have said, the regular refs make mistakes too. And people are always complaining about that.

 

I wonder if nobody knew there were replacement refs would we even be talking about "there are more mistakes being made". As somebody else said, people are looking for mistakes now, so they can say how bad the replacement officials are.

 

As far as the NFLPA and their claim about safety, nonsense. And reading the linked story in this thread, it sounds like nothing more than one union sticking up for another.

 

 

I generally think the refs did ok. With more time and practice they will be fine. I think what the NFL is showing us is "these are the new NFL officials, unless the NFLRA agrees to our terms." Not sure the NFLRA has much leverage left.

[Furd]

Didn't see the play. Was the player administered to by team staff, or did he get off the field before the play clock ran out on the next play?

 

 

I didn't see it either. However, it doesn't look like anyone is disputing that Seattle did not have a timeout left when the officials gave them 3 or 4 minutes before the referee said (incorrectly) that Seattle was not charged a timeout on the Baldwin injury because that play resulted in an incompletion.

 

Missed/incorrect calls are one thing, but when the officials don't understand the rules, you have a problem. Its fortunate for the league that Seattle didn't score after that timeout.

[SEC=UGA]

I didn't see it either. However, it doesn't look like anyone is disputing that Seattle did not have a timeout left when the officials gave them 3 or 4 minutes before the referee said (incorrectly) that Seattle was not charged a timeout on the Baldwin injury because that play resulted in an incompletion.

 

Missed/incorrect calls are one thing, but when the officials don't understand the rules, you have a problem. Its fortunate for the league that Seattle didn't score after that timeout.

 

 

What is interesting to me about that is this... I'm pretty certain that call went up to the guys in the booth, guys who are the "normal", tenured officials and they made the miscall. The booth officials are not on strike and are the same one's that we have had over the past decades.

[stevegrab]

What is interesting to me about that is this... I'm pretty certain that call went up to the guys in the booth, guys who are the "normal", tenured officials and they made the miscall. The booth officials are not on strike and are the same one's that we have had over the past decades.

 

 

Curious why you feel so certain about that. Why would this group of replay officials be separate from those used in the game and not part of NFLRA?

 

Regarding the SEA time out, I didn't see the game and the initial TO taken. But did catch that piece and the ref's announcement. I think what he meant was "they should not have been charged with a TO before, therefore they still had one left." My guess is the team still thought they had a time out, then noticed the board said they didn't. They took the timeout, then discussed it with the ref when the ref was going to penalize them for taking a TO when they didn't have one. They were simply fixing a mistake they made earlier charging the team with a timeout.

 

It seems we are not allowing the replacement officials to fix their own mistakes either, since it helps prove how bad they are.

[Furd]

What is interesting to me about that is this... I'm pretty certain that call went up to the guys in the booth, guys who are the "normal", tenured officials and they made the miscall. The booth officials are not on strike and are the same one's that we have had over the past decades.

 

 

I don't think that this is true. in any event, it is clear that the replacement officals stopped play. If things happened as you say, it would have taken some time to go up to the booth and back, thus given Seattle a timeout anyway.

 

 

Regarding the SEA time out, I didn't see the game and the initial TO taken. But did catch that piece and the ref's announcement. I think what he meant was "they should not have been charged with a TO before, therefore they still had one left." My guess is the team still thought they had a time out, then noticed the board said they didn't. They took the timeout, then discussed it with the ref when the ref was going to penalize them for taking a TO when they didn't have one. They were simply fixing a mistake they made earlier charging the team with a timeout.

 

It seems we are not allowing the replacement officials to fix their own mistakes either, since it helps prove how bad they are.

 

 

Seattle should have been charged a timeout on the Baldwin play. They couldn't fix their mistake.

[SEC=UGA]

Curious why you feel so certain about that. Why would this group of replay officials be separate from those used in the game and not part of NFLRA?

 

Regarding the SEA time out, I didn't see the game and the initial TO taken. But did catch that piece and the ref's announcement. I think what he meant was "they should not have been charged with a TO before, therefore they still had one left." My guess is the team still thought they had a time out, then noticed the board said they didn't. They took the timeout, then discussed it with the ref when the ref was going to penalize them for taking a TO when they didn't have one. They were simply fixing a mistake they made earlier charging the team with a timeout.

 

It seems we are not allowing the replacement officials to fix their own mistakes either, since it helps prove how bad they are.

 

 

I got that info from a pre-season game where Fox Had Mike Perera, the ex-head of officials on, who stated that the booth officials were not part of the strike. Also, the NFL has also appointed a rules/officiating "expert" be in the booth at all games.

 

If you recall, while they were trying to clarify this call, one of the sideline officials was on a hand held walkie talkie speaking with someone, I'm assuming it was the officials in the booth, to get clarification.

[CaptainHook]

On one side of the ball, or both sides? What exactly were you seeing?

 

 

I was just commenting on the fact that a lot of people thought you'd be able to get away with more with the replacement refs, but that wasn't the case on Sunday. I was at the game with my son, so I have not seen extensive replays, but the one on Vontae Davis in the end zone looked pretty bad. I'm not sure Davis even touched him. All the others looked legit. The only really bad play the refs missed was the offsides on the Bears on Luck's first pick. Dude was offsides, Luck saw it, and took a shot deep he probably wouldn't have. Jennings made a great pick, but it shouldn't have counted.

[tazinib1]

Its the same thing all over again but 11 years later. I believe Ed Hochuli is still head of the NFL Referee Association and the point of full time refs is the major obstacle (and about $70 million dollars) in getting these guys back to action. Ed is a distinguished trial lawyer when not on the grid iron. How do you compensate him (and other who have high profile, lucrative off season jobs) by going full time? It's a sticky situation and one that I don't see coming to a conclusion quickly.

[rajncajn]

21 worst calls this weekend

[CaptainHook]

Three of the above came in the game I saw!

 

The Jennings play, you can't see his other arm, which from where I was sitting, looked to be grabbing Avery and pull him. I thought that was an ok call. Especially after the one against Vontae Davis in the end zone that ended up being a six inch penalty.

[Ditkaless Wonders]

I think the expectation that these guys are going to be blowing calls has a lot to do with the vitriol. People are even complaining about them missing penalties in the trenches. It's been said that you could call a penalty down there on every play, and we allow the real refs the leeway to just call the really bad ones and let the flow of the game continue. Not these guys, it seems.

 

Because we're going in looking for screw-ups. And if we go in looking for screw-ups, we're certainly going to find them.

 

I obviously didn't catch every game and, unfortunately, got only the last few minutes of the Niner game, which many seem to be complaining about. Of the games I caught, I saw about as many blown calls as I normally do. Perhaps a few more, but not enough to detract from my enjoyment of the product on the field.

 

 

I saw a story somewhere that avearge game time increased by 8 minutes with these refs. In a game that needs all the continuity it can get I found that distracting. I found it particularly so in the 49er/Packer game which seemed to take forever.

[delfamdelfam]

They just screwed up again with that Boldin TD

[CaptainHook]

They just screwed up again with that Boldin TD

 

yep

[bushwacked]

How was the BJGE TD not reviewed?

[Big John]

How was the BJGE TD not reviewed?

 

And the booth are not replacements.

[Zooty]

21 worst calls this weekend

 

 

mehh, grasping at straws

from the Eagles browns

Both teams took equal punishment from referee Kent Roan and his crew. Here's Roan penalizing the wrong player for being offside, an extremely simple penalty but a mistake that wasn't corrected (thus being a permanent, and unfair, mark against Winn's record).

oh noooooooooooooo, I've seen it happen with regular refs big deal

This is the worst blunder, though. After a Michael Vick fumble on third and short—with the Eagles driving in an attempt to score a game-winning TD—Browns coach Pat Shurmur tried to challenge the play's result. But Vick recovered his own fumble, and you can only challenge the recovery of a fumble in the end zone. It took Roan's crew nearly six minutes to figure that out.

well the quote says they got it right so the blunder was that it took 6 minutes? or that they got it right?

 

 

seriously not much worse that any other year.

[Grits and Shins]

21 worst calls this weekend

 

 

I suspect they could do the same thing for EVERY single weekend of football for the last 2 decades.

[Chief Dick]

I suspect they could do the same thing for EVERY single weekend of football for the last 2 decades.

 

 

Agree.

[fitzkek]

 

 

I think the NFL is happy with how the games are being officiated and for the most part don't believe there is a significant difference in how the games are called. Now way does the NFL back down.

 

 

How do you know this? Are you Goddell's secretary?

[Cunning Runt]

Seriously, you folks criticizing the replacement refs are blaming anything you disagree with or may be in error on the replacement aspect. Get over it already. Officiating goes both ways and sometimes a crew is better than others but I genuinely did not see anything at all that made me say... "A regular ref would have done such and such. They screwed that up because, and only because, they are a replacement ref." Sure they made some mistakes, but BFD. I've seen the regular guys make mistakes too.

 

I can just imagine what you all would be saying if it had been one of these replacement refs that botched the overtime coin flip on Thanksgiving with Jerome Bettis a few years back.

 

The officials want things that no one else is getting - mainly for their pension to continue, where no one else's does. They allow it for the officials and you'll have opened a much bigger can of worms. This isn't about gameday paychecks. This is about the refs thinking they are more critical than they are and asking for things that nobody else is getting.

Edited September 11, 2012 by Cunning Runt

[rajncajn]

Classy

 

"Tweet heat: Fox officiating analyst MikePereira, who used to be an NFL referee and later oversaw officiating, tweeted Sunday that officiating in the Green Bay Packers-San Francisco 49ers game was "not too strong." Which prompted NFL spokesman Greg Aiello to tweet it's "kind of like when you were out there." Pereira's counterpunch to that: "That's the first honest thing you've said in a while.""

[stevegrab]

Classy

 

 

Love it.

 

I get the sense that the NFL game broadcasters are firmly behind the refs. Every game I watched focued on the replacement refs, the announcers reminding us about them, giving us their background, and on almost any questionable play pointing out "replacement refs" with Have to agree here kind of approach, as if it is the end of the world.

 

Doesn't seem very professional to me. As many have pointed out here, most of the same calls would be questioned with the original (soon to be former) refs. Its just being used as a focal point for all issues in a game, blame the replacement refs.

 

I heard last night (I think during CIN-BAL) that the NFL is moving forward assuming the replacements will continue, and have laid out their itineraries for the next 4 games (through week 5). Well that is necessary, as there seems to be no progress in the discussions with NFLRA. The officiating may be a little below the normal standard we are used to, but not bad enough to warrant the NFL caving in to the demands of NFLRA.