Well this sucks (Michael Thomas news)

[rajncajn]

1 hour ago, League_Champion said:

 

We'll see, it's definitely not good. Especially if he's a step older and slower with a very inaccurate QB 

Yeah, those are definitely big concerns. From a fan standpoint I'm going to love seeing him back on the field and can't wait till he's proving all the naysayers wrong. From a fantasy perspective, I'm hopeful. I've had him on IR for two years soaking up precious contract years. It's past time the wait pays off.

[The Badfinger]

On 7/23/2021 at 11:41 AM, darin3 said:

Didn't the guy have ankle issues last year?  Why wait so long to have the surgery?  This is weird.

 

Hurt on work time, heal on work time.  No need to screw up ones off-season with surgery and PT.  Assuming he could function normally in a non-football way.

[stevegrab]

19 hours ago, The Badfinger said:

 

Hurt on work time, heal on work time.  No need to screw up ones off-season with surgery and PT.  Assuming he could function normally in a non-football way.

 

That seems like a pretty messed up way to handle your multi-million dollar career, just sit back in the off season and don't address injuries, wait until you're on "company time". 

[League_Champion]

20 hours ago, The Badfinger said:

 

Hurt on work time, heal on work time.  No need to screw up ones off-season with surgery and PT.  Assuming he could function normally in a non-football way.

 

That's what happens once some of these guys "get paid". It's ridiculous, this shizz should of been done and healed over a year ago. Now he's just another old receiver coming off an injury. I'd sign Odell over this clown, at least Odell will fight to get back on the field. 

 

[boltnlava]

3 hours ago, League_Champion said:

 

That's what happens once some of these guys "get paid". It's ridiculous, this shizz should of been done and healed over a year ago. Now he's just another old receiver coming off an injury. I'd sign Odell over this clown, at least Odell will fight to get back on the field. 

 

*opinion on display. 

I'm not ready to decide if it's injury or desire. We'll know soon enough I suppose. Even then maybe not. Is Gronk's decision desire or due to injuries? He could make another SB run with Brady ...(maybe). Does that make Gronk a clown who will not fight to get back on the field? I have no idea how thomas feels mentally or physically. We have seen him be great like Gronk and struggle with injuries as well so who are we to judge?

[League_Champion]

1 hour ago, boltnlava said:

who are we to judge?

 

Who's judging?

 

Jeff Duncan of Nola.com reports that Thomas ignored multiple calls over a three-month period as then-Saints trainer Beau Lowery, wide receivers coach Curtis Johnson and head coach Sean Payton all tried to reach him to see how his ankle was doing.

Thomas was initially advised by the Saints’ medical staff to have the ankle surgery immediately after the Saints’ postseason came to an end, but after getting a second opinion he decided to try a more conservative approach and see if the ankle would heal without surgery. That didn’t work, and Thomas ultimately had the surgery in June. The recovery time from the surgery will cause Thomas to miss several games at the start of the season, and Payton said recently that Thomas should have had the surgery earlier.

If Thomas had stayed in touch with the team over the offseason, the determination that he needed the surgery might have been made earlier, and he might have recovered in time for the regular season. Instead, Thomas disappeared for much of the offseason, and now the Saints won’t have him to start the season. And it’s clear that the Saints aren’t happy about that.

[boltnlava]

16 minutes ago, League_Champion said:

 

Who's judging?

 

Jeff Duncan of Nola.com reports that Thomas ignored multiple calls over a three-month period as then-Saints trainer Beau Lowery, wide receivers coach Curtis Johnson and head coach Sean Payton all tried to reach him to see how his ankle was doing.

Thomas was initially advised by the Saints’ medical staff to have the ankle surgery immediately after the Saints’ postseason came to an end, but after getting a second opinion he decided to try a more conservative approach and see if the ankle would heal without surgery. That didn’t work, and Thomas ultimately had the surgery in June. The recovery time from the surgery will cause Thomas to miss several games at the start of the season, and Payton said recently that Thomas should have had the surgery earlier.

If Thomas had stayed in touch with the team over the offseason, the determination that he needed the surgery might have been made earlier, and he might have recovered in time for the regular season. Instead, Thomas disappeared for much of the offseason, and now the Saints won’t have him to start the season. And it’s clear that the Saints aren’t happy about that.

Let me ask...with this post you're judging right? So the answer is you. Right? How long ago was this info and does it really show anything other than he chose a second opinion? Maybe he already knew the team stance on this and had nothing to add. IDK and neither do you. Right? Looks are what they are. Looks. That's it. FF is based on chances. You say no chance. I'm not out yet based on what we know. This will be interesting to revisit just to see if he can rise above or fail. Not to see if you or I am right but to see if he can return to former glory(QB notwithstanding.

[League_Champion]

3 minutes ago, boltnlava said:

Let me ask...with this post you're judging right? So the answer is you. Right? How long ago was this info and does it really show anything other than he chose a second opinion? Maybe he already knew the team stance on this and had nothing to add. IDK and neither do you. Right? Looks are what they are. Looks. That's it. FF is based on chances. You say no chance. I'm not out yet based on what we know. This will be interesting to revisit just to see if he can rise above or fail. Not to see if you or I am right but to see if he can return to former glory(QB notwithstanding.

 

You're comparing it to Gronk, it's nothing at all similar to Gronks situation. 

[rajncajn]

13 hours ago, League_Champion said:

 

Who's judging?

 

Jeff Duncan of Nola.com reports that Thomas ignored multiple calls over a three-month period as then-Saints trainer Beau Lowery, wide receivers coach Curtis Johnson and head coach Sean Payton all tried to reach him to see how his ankle was doing.

Thomas was initially advised by the Saints’ medical staff to have the ankle surgery immediately after the Saints’ postseason came to an end, but after getting a second opinion he decided to try a more conservative approach and see if the ankle would heal without surgery. That didn’t work, and Thomas ultimately had the surgery in June. The recovery time from the surgery will cause Thomas to miss several games at the start of the season, and Payton said recently that Thomas should have had the surgery earlier.

If Thomas had stayed in touch with the team over the offseason, the determination that he needed the surgery might have been made earlier, and he might have recovered in time for the regular season. Instead, Thomas disappeared for much of the offseason, and now the Saints won’t have him to start the season. And it’s clear that the Saints aren’t happy about that.

The last person you ever want to listen to regarding New Orleans Saints is Jeff Duncan. Don't believe me? Go to any Saints board and search "Scooter."

[millworkguy]

15 hours ago, League_Champion said:

 Thomas ultimately had the surgery in June. The recovery time from the surgery will cause Thomas to miss several games at the start of the season, and Payton said recently that Thomas should have had the surgery earlier.

If Thomas had stayed in touch with the team over the offseason, the determination that he needed the surgery might have been made earlier, and he might have recovered in time for the regular season. 

 

 Isn't this from like a year ago,  as it mentions Payton as the coach.  2ndly, obviously it's wrong as he wasn't able to play last season, so getting surgery 3 months earlier didn't impact his ability to return for the start of the regular season (as he is on pup now, I assume for the same issue).

Lastly if I respect (anyone's) decision to not get a covid vaccine,  you have to respect his decision to not have surgery he didn't want to have, and try a non invasive method 1st.  Y'all can't have it both ways.

[League_Champion]

5 hours ago, millworkguy said:

 

 Isn't this from like a year ago,  as it mentions Payton as the coach.  2ndly, obviously it's wrong as he wasn't able to play last season, so getting surgery 3 months earlier didn't impact his ability to return for the start of the regular season (as he is on pup now, I assume for the same issue).

Lastly if I respect (anyone's) decision to not get a covid vaccine,  you have to respect his decision to not have surgery he didn't want to have, and try a non invasive method 1st.  Y'all can't have it both ways.

 

Yes, it's an older story but tells what went on during that time and why he's still not on the field. 

[millworkguy]

8 minutes ago, League_Champion said:

 

Yes, it's an older story but tells what went on during that time and why he's still not on the field. 

If his 6 month rehab is now at 13 months, I don't think a year old post tells us anything about why he still isnt on the field

 

[League_Champion]

4 minutes ago, millworkguy said:

If his 6 month rehab is now at 13 months, I don't think a year old post tells us anything about why he still isnt on the field

 

 

He's not on the field because he refused to get the surgery when he should of. Not only did he refuse, he wasn't in contact with any of the coaching staff so they had no idea what was going on. 

[millworkguy]

38 minutes ago, League_Champion said:

 

He's not on the field because he refused to get the surgery when he should of. Not only did he refuse, he wasn't in contact with any of the coaching staff so they had no idea what was going on. 

No, your reaching for a conclusion.   The post said had he gotten the surgery he may have been able to be on the field for the start of the season (approx 6 months of recovery).   Your conclusion (had he gotten the surgery asap) instead of waiting 4 months, had everything been successful he should have been on the field by Dec,  as he isn't yet on the field (8 months after that date) , and is still needing additional time, I bet there is more going on.

 

9 pregnant women don't get you a baby in 1 month. If the recovery time is 6 months, and you wait 4 to start you should be ready in 6 additional months.  We are now 13 months post surgery and he isn't healed. 

 

 Furthermore it was and is his right to say no to surgery,  and honestly I don't call work back on weekends either anymore.  

Edited July 24, 2022 by millworkguy

[millworkguy]

1 hour ago, League_Champion said:

 

He's not on the field because he refused to get the surgery when he should of. Not only did he refuse, he wasn't in contact with any of the coaching staff so they had no idea what was going on. 

As somebody seemed confused by logic, the post tells us why he wasn't on the field this time LAST season, why isn't he on the field THIS season?

[League_Champion]

39 minutes ago, millworkguy said:

your reaching for a conclusion.

 

No, I'm not. This is all well documented. It's been years! 

[millworkguy]

24 minutes ago, League_Champion said:

 

. It's been years! 

 

What are you talking about,  the team wanted him to have surgery 18 months ago, he had surgery 14 months ago, what YEARS are you talking about. 

[stevegrab]

Why are you all trying to reason with Mr. Know It All.  He is never wrong, and always has the inside scoop on every NFL player. HIs hot takes are beyond stupid and have been that way since he dropped into this forum. Sure occasionally he has some real info, or sound advice. But you have to weed thru a lot of BS to get to those. 

[League_Champion]

2 hours ago, stevegrab said:

Why are you all trying to reason with Mr. Know It All.  He is never wrong, and always has the inside scoop on every NFL player. HIs hot takes are beyond stupid and have been that way since he dropped into this forum. Sure occasionally he has some real info, or sound advice. But you have to weed thru a lot of BS to get to those. 

 

How is this a take? It's all documented. You must of crashed your Vespa this weekend and hit your little egg head. 

[League_Champion]

Just now, League_Champion said:

 

How is this a take? It's all documented. You must of crashed your Vespa this weekend and hit your little egg head. 

 

Poor thing 

[darin3]

4 hours ago, stevegrab said:

Why are you all trying to reason with Mr. Know It All.  He is never wrong, and always has the inside scoop on every NFL player. HIs hot takes are beyond stupid and have been that way since he dropped into this forum. Sure occasionally he has some real info, or sound advice. But you have to weed thru a lot of BS to get to those. 

 

Seriously man, just put the guy on ignore.  

[1fastdoc]

21 hours ago, League_Champion said:

 

He's not on the field because he refused to get the surgery when he should of. Not only did he refuse, he wasn't in contact with any of the coaching staff so they had no idea what was going on. 

 

My issue with Thomas isn't that he delayed surgery.  I dont think any of us can say that's unreasonable and people do it all the time.  But avoiding communication with the team, probably because he didn't want to discuss his decision, screwed the team.  

 

And to those who say they won't answer the phone on off time, I'm glad you don't work for me.  I've had employees who are just here to do a job.  They don't last.  The ones who really care about our business find they enjoy the work a lot more and they also enjoy the raises and bonuses they receive.  Not to mention opportunities in new businesses only offered to those I consider loyal and invested.  Thomas isn't in a 9-5 job.  He's a professional.   In that case the standards are vastly higher (that said many don't live up to them, which is why a lot of good players have short careers).

[millworkguy]

39 minutes ago, 1fastdoc said:

 

My issue with Thomas isn't that he delayed surgery.  I dont think any of us can say that's unreasonable and people do it all the time.  But avoiding communication with the team, probably because he didn't want to discuss his decision, screwed the team.  

 

And to those who say they won't answer the phone on off time, I'm glad you don't work for me.  I've had employees who are just here to do a job.  They don't last. 

 

Was it really his responsibility to be in touch with the team or his agents? 

 

 I've done my 25 years of 65 hour work weeks, and I don't save lives, not much happens in my world that can't wait till im back in the office on monday.  at this point I value my time with my kids /wife and parents much more then another $1000.  If I have something that has to get done you will find me at work, Saturday or Sunday or week nights,  but I know what needs to be done, and I'll make sure my entire team has it done before it's due, when it works for us. Just because my boss wants something Friday night at 11 when I'm finally sitting down, doesn't make me their slave, and entitle them to an answer at that point.

 

Also we have right to disconnect laws where I am, I'm allowed to bill my employer 3 hours of wages if they call me when I'm off work.   Now I've never done it, and (they are very good to me) I wouldn't but just because I value things differently then you doesn't make me a bad employee, not loyal,  or just there for a paycheck.

[1fastdoc]

4 hours ago, millworkguy said:

 

Was it really his responsibility to be in touch with the team or his agents? 

 

 I've done my 25 years of 65 hour work weeks, and I don't save lives, not much happens in my world that can't wait till im back in the office on monday.  at this point I value my time with my kids /wife and parents much more then another $1000.  If I have something that has to get done you will find me at work, Saturday or Sunday or week nights,  but I know what needs to be done, and I'll make sure my entire team has it done before it's due, when it works for us. Just because my boss wants something Friday night at 11 when I'm finally sitting down, doesn't make me their slave, and entitle them to an answer at that point.

 

Also we have right to disconnect laws where I am, I'm allowed to bill my employer 3 hours of wages if they call me when I'm off work.   Now I've never done it, and (they are very good to me) I wouldn't but just because I value things differently then you doesn't make me a bad employee, not loyal,  or just there for a paycheck.

 

I see how my statement reads and it wasn't meant to be personal.  It was almost more venting as I've dealt with employees (usually 20-somethings) who see their job as nothing more than a paycheck.  You wouldn't believe at how many of them have had 5, 6, 7+ jobs before they're 25.  It's a different attitude and it got a lot worse since Covid.  It sounds like your situation is much different. 

 

When I bought my practice the practice manager insisted on hourly instead of salary, which didn't make sense to me.  But the ENT she worked for previously, for 17 years, would call her to bounce ideas off of her on week nights, weekends and even when she was on vacation.  I laughed at that and assured her that when she's off, she's off and I'd resepct her time.  

 

The Right to Disconnect law sounds like a good way to protect employees from guys like my predecessor lol.  

 

If you want a job as an MA, I'd hire you.  

[rajncajn]

So, the whole history with Thomas is that when he originally got hurt, the team pushed him to play through the injury which at the time, Thomas was more than willing to do. Unfortunately it exacerbated the injury and ultimately put him out for the season. At the end of the season the team wanted him to get surgery and Thomas sought other medical opinions. He was told by a doctor that he could repair the issue without surgery and therefore be back on the field quicker, so Thomas opted for that route. Unfortunately, the therapy didn't work & ultimately Thomas had to go for the surgery ending any chance for him to get back on the field the next season.

 

As for not being in contact with the team, there's only one person who's ever said anything about Thomas not talking to the team & that's Jeff Duncan. Neither Thomas nor anybody with the Saints organization has ever said anything about that. In fact, Mickey Loomis said that the Saint knew that Thomas was going with the "conservative approach." So, they were well aware that Thomas was going to try to heal without the surgery. I think their only issue with that approach is how long Thomas waited before giving up on that method when it obviously wasn't working.

 

Here's the quote from Loomis:

New Orleans Saints' Sean Payton says Michael Thomas' surgery should've happened before June (espn.com)

Quote

"After the season it was decided that he was gonna treat that conservatively. And I think we all had an expectation that [the ankle] would heal and he'd be fine coming into camp this year," Saints general manager Mickey Loomis said Wednesday. "But we get to the minicamp, and obviously it wasn't quite right. So we had to make the call and collectively made the call to have the surgery in June.

"Obviously with hindsight we would've preferred that surgery to be earlier in February or March. But it wasn't. You know, it is what it is. And hopefully he's had a good result so far, and hopefully we'll get him back sooner rather than later."